Robinson 2-8-0's (aka ROD's; MM's; MoS locos)

[Ken A.]

Hi, 

After spending the last 30 years working with American O gauge, I've derided to change to British OO: a GWR/LNWR Great War era layout to be precise.

 

Does anyone know if The Robinson 2-8-0's built by the Ministry of Supply for the British Army ever drew military (or other) trains in Britain during the war, or were they used exclusively in France and Belgium? 

 

Failing that, perhaps someone could suggest where I could find this information.

 

All the best,

Ken

[Ian Smeeton]

Hi Ken, and welcome to the forum.

 

I seem to recall that the ROD 2-8-0's were used extensively in the UK during WW1 and on all sorts of trains, not just military.

 

Sadly I am  not old enough to recall them directly, but someone on here will be along soon enough to give chapter and verse, I am sure.

 

Best Regards

 

Ian

[EddieB]

Hi Ken, and welcome.  There are several excellent books and monographs on the RODs that are worth tracking down, including Loco Profile 21 and Locomotives Illustrated 112.  

 

"Heavy Goods Engines of the War Department" (Routledge) identifies that locomotives ordered by the Government were shipped directly to the Western Front upon completion and not used in Britain during the war years.  

 

It was only after the war that RODs found their way onto the railways of Britain.  Between January and June 1919, the GWR bought 20 and the LNWR bought 30, but soon after sales were stopped and locos were hired out from the remaining stocks.  Most of the larger pre-grouping companies availed themselves of hired locomotives (in quite large numbers), including both the GWR and LNWR.  Further details of the GWR ones can be found in the relevant edition of the RCTS "brown book" (Part Ten).

[Ken A.]

Thanks for the informative answers, gentlemen.  As my proposed layout is set in 1915/17, I guess that I'll give have to give the MoS loco's a miss.  

 

However I am looking forward to Bachmann's forthcoming coal tank, pity that it is going to be unlined, although the Great War is the only period that this is appropriate.

[The Stationmaster]

Thanks for the informative answers, gentlemen.  As my proposed layout is set in 1915/17, I guess that I'll give have to give the MoS loco's a miss.  

 

However I am looking forward to Bachmann's forthcoming coal tank, pity that it is going to be unlined, although the Great War is the only period that this is appropriate.

 

Hmm 1917 - Belgian locos under repair at Swindon perhaps?  (No, sorry the Belgian Type 32s repaired at three English works were not in England until 1918)

[t-b-g]

Of course there were some genuine GCR 2-8-0 locos that did remain in this country and would almost certainly have pulled military trains.

 

It was basically the same loco but in GCR livery and with detail differences.

[bike2steam]

Hi Ken, and welcome.  There are several excellent books and monographs on the RODs that are worth tracking down, including Loco Profile 21 and Locomotives Illustrated 112.  

 

"Heavy Goods Engines of the War Department" (Routledge) identifies that locomotives ordered by the Government were shipped directly to the Western Front upon completion and not used in Britain during the war years.  

 

It was only after the war that RODs found their way onto the railways of Britain.  Between January and June 1919, the GWR bought 20 and the LNWR bought 30, but soon after sales were stopped and locos were hired out from the remaining stocks.  Most of the larger pre-grouping companies availed themselves of hired locomotives (in quite large numbers), including both the GWR and LNWR.  Further details of the GWR ones can be found in the relevant edition of the RCTS "brown book" (Part Ten).

Not forgetting 'Yeadon's Register Of LNER Locomotives Volume Number 24', probably the best source of info on the class.

[Ken A.]

Thanks for the information, gentlemen.  I'm still in the stages of advanced planning and drawing up lists.  My old layout was 20' by 8' (in a shed) so I've got plenty of space to work with.  I'll stick with LNWR and GWR (plus the Midland Railway for light comedy relief): plenty to keep me busy there.

[EddieB]

Not forgetting 'Yeadon's Register Of LNER Locomotives Volume Number 24', probably the best source of info on the class.

On the history of individual locomotives, perhaps, but Yeadon's volume 24 (split into two parts, 24A covering sub-classes O4/1-O4/5. 24B O4/6-O4/8 and Thompson O1) carries little information about allocations and work prior to the grouping.  The equivalent edition of the RCTS "Green Book" (Part 6B - to which Willie Yeadon was a major contributor, by the way) carries a lot more information, but in there the story of the ROD/MM locos really starts only after the end of the war.  Apart from their construction, there is little about their service abroad during WWI.

[The Stationmaster]

On the history of individual locomotives, perhaps, but Yeadon's volume 24 (split into two parts, 24A covering sub-classes O4/1-O4/5. 24B O4/6-O4/8 and Thompson O1) carries little information about allocations and work prior to the grouping.  The equivalent edition of the RCTS "Green Book" (Part 6B - to which Willie Yeadon was a major contributor, by the way) carries a lot more information, but in there the story of the ROD/MM locos really starts only after the end of the war.  Apart from their construction, there is little about their service abroad during WWI.

 

There is some information in 'ROD The Railway Operating Division on the Werstern Front' by W  Aves

[EddieB]

There is some information in 'ROD The Railway Operating Division on the Werstern Front' by W  Aves

Yes - an excellent book, but its focus is on operations in the Western Front; I've tried to identify the sources that best cover the UK during the pre-grouping era and the war years in particular.