RMweb Premium 4069 Posted July 14, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted July 14, 2020 I'm pretty sure the signal in 15 is GW/WR- the finial has been cropped off the photo, but all the other elements of the signal are standard products of Reading works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted July 14, 2020 Share Posted July 14, 2020 (edited) No. 12 is driving me insane. I've looked up practically every GWR branch line station in Cornwall, Devon, Somerset, Dorset, Wiltshire, Berkshire, Oxfordshire, some of Wales, and much of Gloucestershire/Herefordshire/Shropshire and have yet to find a match. One of the distinctive aspects of the station is that it appears to have a newer platform - it's concrete faced I think. The other thing is that I wonder if it's at the summit of a particular line. The track seems to peak into the distance then go down again towards the horizon. Edited July 14, 2020 by SD85 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlwebus Posted July 14, 2020 Author Share Posted July 14, 2020 Thank you again Fat Controller, Andy Kirkham, SD85, Jeremy C. I'm becoming convinced of No 12's GWR ancestry and am reassured by the thought of several of you that the shot could be taken from a GWR autocoach. I also think both Nos 12 and 15 are taken from the same train on the same trip. There is a similar "shadow" in the same place in No.15. The season seems to be the same judging by the grass and foliage. I'm also convinced that the foreground shadow in No.12 is not actually a shadow (there are no shadows elsewhere on the pic - unlike No 15 which has pronounced sharp shadows. It is something in the forground inside the vehicle but too close to focus. When I referred to the mysterious black building I meant the the one right by the trackside right hand side just before the bridge - looks like it is tar treated wooden shack? Well spotted the two bridges SD85! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted July 14, 2020 Share Posted July 14, 2020 If 12 and 15 are from the same train on the same journey then the background of 15 could help as it appears to be rather hilly. That means it is more likely to be Wales or the West Country. However as mentioned nowhere west of Swindon seems to fit the bill so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted July 14, 2020 Share Posted July 14, 2020 59 minutes ago, carlwebus said: When I referred to the mysterious black building I meant the the one right by the trackside right hand side just before the bridge - looks like it is tar treated wooden shack? Fairly sure this is the case, looks like a platelayer's hut or something similar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted July 14, 2020 Share Posted July 14, 2020 Come to think of it, is No. 8 from the same journey as well? Given that it's from a similar viewpoint. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted September 10, 2020 Share Posted September 10, 2020 (edited) Update on this so far: I have looked across the GWR network extensively via Google, old OS maps and GWR route maps and I still cannot place where No. 12 is at all. I am pretty sure it is a GWR station, and probably not in the London or the SE, but I have checked literally every branch line in Wales, Devon, Cornwall and Wessex and still cannot find a match. I also checked all the branch lines in Shropshire, the Marches and Gloucestershire, again nothing. Really could do with some assistance on this one as the evidence strongly suggests it's GWR but nothing is turning up. The key to the photograph is that after the station the line goes under two bridges (as noted earlier). Edited September 10, 2020 by SD85 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Andy Kirkham Posted September 11, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted September 11, 2020 (edited) Here is a seemingly comprehensive list of tunnels in the UK https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_tunnels_in_the_United_Kingdom. Might this help with No.8? The feeling I get from No.12 is that it's on an elevated plateau, and as I suggested before in limestone country - somehere like the Cotswolds - but evidently not the Cotswolds. <Edit> It couldn't be the Lambourn branch could it? Edited September 11, 2020 by Andy Kirkham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted September 11, 2020 Share Posted September 11, 2020 I don't think 12 is on the Lambourn branch. I've checked most of the stations and the 1947 OS map and none fit the bill of a platform, followed by a left curve and two bridges. Like you I think the station is situated on a plateau of some description as the line descends a gradient beyond the platform. There is the possibility that 12 and 15 were taken on the same train journey (see previous posts). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bécasse Posted September 11, 2020 Share Posted September 11, 2020 Surely the fixed distant signal visible in photo 15 is an LMS signal. I have never (knowingly) seen a photo of an LMS fixed distant before but they must have existed in considerable numbers and I had rather assumed that they were normally the same as working distants but without the operating rod or balance weights. However this design, similar to the GWR arrangement, would clearly be more economical and, so far as I can see, all the fittings, including notably the post cap, are standard LMS items. That, and the fact that they were batched with the L&M photos, might suggest that 8, 12 and 15 were all taken on the same occasion as the visit to the semi-dismantled L&M - from an Engineer's Saloon, perhaps. A very quick glance at the 1947 1" OS maps didn't produce an obvious location for 12 with its platform and two bridges but I didn't look very hard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted September 11, 2020 Share Posted September 11, 2020 The track in 12 and 15 is clearly of standard gauge though, so it can't be the L&M. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bécasse Posted September 11, 2020 Share Posted September 11, 2020 (edited) Number 12 seems that it might well be Wall Grange station, looking west, on the line from Stoke-on-Trent to Leek/Waterhouses, a logical route for any inspection trip to see the dismantling progress on the L&M. Number 15 is doubtless somewhere along the same route. Edited September 11, 2020 by bécasse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted September 12, 2020 Share Posted September 12, 2020 (edited) I don't think it is Wall Grange as that seems to have had two platforms. I did wonder if it could be Winkhill Halt on the Waterhouses branch, but after looking at the location closely I don't think it's that either. Edited September 12, 2020 by SD85 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bécasse Posted September 12, 2020 Share Posted September 12, 2020 I wondered whether the station at Wall Grange had been altered at some time in the LMS era. Certainly it originally had a loop and two platforms, one of which was wooden, but the platform in the photo looks new so it could be the result of alterations. Unfortunately, given the lack of detailed mapping in the UK for the four-five decades after the Great War, it is surprisingly difficult to check on anything that didn't survive into the new mapping era (which was effectively post-Beeching). What does seem to fit well with Wall Grange, and is checkable, is that pair of bridges. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted October 26, 2020 Share Posted October 26, 2020 Have posted some of the unlocated photographs in the thread below to try and get any further help on the matter: https://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/103405-jonnys-where-are-these-photo-album/page/65/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted October 29, 2020 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 29, 2020 (edited) On 14/07/2020 at 12:27, 4069 said: I'm pretty sure the signal in 15 is GW/WR- the finial has been cropped off the photo, but all the other elements of the signal are standard products of Reading works. It is 100% GWR/WR - no doubt whatsoever about that, no other concrern in Britain constructed fixed distant signals in anything like that sort of arrangement. I am reasonably sure that 12 & 15 were taken on the same trip as GWR pattern two bolt chairs are clearly visible in the picture alongside the station platform. And I think the odd 'shadow' is likely to be the brake setter (or something else in the cab) which is out of focus and not properly lit as the film was exposed for the outside view hence anything in the cab appears very dark. The other thing is that the overbridge in one of the views was built as a double line structure and the fact that it appears to be made of stone could give a clue about the part of the country in which it was situated. The state of the cess in both of these pictures suggests fairly late BR to me because although lineside foliage is encroaching it has not really taken over the cess. The curved ball however is that very solidly built platform so are we looking at a line in the preservation era although I can't make it fit any I can immediately think of? PS Looking more closely at the distant signal it almost looks as if the finial has been replaced by a metal cap of some sort - due to theft or breakage possibly. Edited October 29, 2020 by The Stationmaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cypherman Posted October 29, 2020 Share Posted October 29, 2020 (edited) Picture No 14 looks more like demolition rather than construction. Construction tends to be a bit more organised. This picture just looks like a mess with debris strewn all over the show. Edited October 29, 2020 by cypherman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Jeremy Cumberland Posted October 29, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 29, 2020 (edited) Got it! 12 is Chudleigh Knighton Halt, on the Teign Valley railway between Exeter and Newton Abbot, and the picture is taken looking towards Newton Abbot. The bridge is Knighton Bridge. Although at first glance the bridge in the first pictuire on the Disused Stations website (http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/c/chudleigh_knighton_halt/) looks nothing like the one in picture 12, the sign (whatever it says) in relation to the pyramid-roofed building is unmistakable. The station only had a short life (1924 - 1958) so finding it on old maps is tricky. Even when you find a map which shows it, it is difficult to reconcile the map with the buildings. Here, for example, is the 6 inch "National Grid" series map (1949-1969): https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=17&lat=50.58221&lon=-3.63191&layers=193&b=1. However, the cuirve and the second bridge (Little Bovey Bridge) are a perfect match. I would hazard a guess that 8 is therefore Perridge Tunnel (the only other tunnel on the line appears to be Culver Tunnel, which is straight). Edited October 29, 2020 by Jeremy C 3 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 On 29/10/2020 at 11:27, cypherman said: Picture No 14 looks more like demolition rather than construction. Construction tends to be a bit more organised. This picture just looks like a mess with debris strewn all over the show. Dover shed was opened in the 1920s and not closed until well after nationalisation, though, so the wagons in Big Four livery mean it's a 1920s shot. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 (edited) 14 hours ago, Jeremy C said: Got it! 12 is Chudleigh Knighton Halt, on the Teign Valley railway between Exeter and Newton Abbot, and the picture is taken looking towards Newton Abbot. The bridge is Knighton Bridge. Although at first glance the bridge in the first pictuire on the Disused Stations website (http://www.disused-stations.org.uk/c/chudleigh_knighton_halt/) looks nothing like the one in picture 12, the sign (whatever it says) in relation to the pyramid-roofed building is unmistakable. The station only had a short life (1924 - 1958) so finding it on old maps is tricky. Even when you find a map which shows it, it is difficult to reconcile the map with the buildings. Here, for example, is the 6 inch "National Grid" series map (1949-1969): https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=17&lat=50.58221&lon=-3.63191&layers=193&b=1. However, the cuirve and the second bridge (Little Bovey Bridge) are a perfect match. I would hazard a guess that 8 is therefore Perridge Tunnel (the only other tunnel on the line appears to be Culver Tunnel, which is straight). Well done, brilliant research! I must admit that I had looked over the Teign Valley line before but not identified the station - the photograph on that site only just shows the bridge. I think that the first bridge immediately after the halt must have been replaced by a more modern girder one at some point judging by the photo (which was taken in the 1950s according to the website). This means that photo 12 is very probably taken pre-war, and 8 and 15 are likely to be so as well as I think they are taken on the same journey. EDIT - actually, according to the Disused Stations website the platform was originally of timber construction but was replaced in concrete after the war. Therefore I would speculate the photo to have been taken in the late 1940s or early 1950s. Also the fact that the bridge had been replaced probably confused me further in my initial search as I can't find any other photos of Chudleigh Knighton Halt with the original bridge - only the more modern one. Edited October 30, 2020 by SD85 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 (edited) Having looked at the NLS maps further, I would guess that No. 8 is taken from inside the west end of Perridge Tunnel (as suggested earlier) owing to the curvature. 15 is a bit harder to pin down but I would suggest that it is taken looking west on the line somewhere between half a mile to a mile and a half east of Perridge Tunnel, going on the contours and tree coverage indicated on the map. Edited October 30, 2020 by SD85 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SD85 Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 (edited) I think also that the photographs are taken from either an auto coach or an inspection saloon. Edited October 30, 2020 by SD85 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim V Posted October 30, 2020 Share Posted October 30, 2020 Good spot on Chudleigh Knighton, the new bridge carrying the A38. Looking at the old maps of the area, a number of improvements were made to the A38. I remember travelling down that way pre motorway/expressway, Plymouth was a long way from Bath (where I lived in the 60s). 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium DLT Posted November 27, 2020 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 27, 2020 On 30/10/2020 at 13:23, Tim V said: Good spot on Chudleigh Knighton, the new bridge carrying the A38. Looking at the old maps of the area, a number of improvements were made to the A38. I remember travelling down that way pre motorway/expressway, Plymouth was a long way from Bath (where I lived in the 60s). And needless to say, the site is now underneath the A38 dual carriageway. Heres the Side by Side Georeferenced Maps: Chudleigh Knighton The halt was were Pipehouse Lane crossed the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
carlwebus Posted November 30, 2020 Author Share Posted November 30, 2020 You guys never cease to amaze me! Fabulous research by all - especially SD85 and Jeremy C! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now