Toy bus hits the road

[StephenF]

Hello all, 

I’m a newbie here, but I’ve had a project going for about 15 years to convert a 1:76 bus to run. Somehow. Anyway, it was only when I saw Giles Favell’s End of the Line that I understood what could be done. That was last year, and I finally got down to it about a month ago, and she’s up and running:

 

 

The eagle eyed among you will observe the absence of on/off switch, and charging socket, so I still have work to do. I have an idea about a solution to both which I will ask for advice about, but will do that later. Also the steering is backwards so will have to reprogram I suppose

For now I’m having some down time...

Thanks to all here, for your posts  which I have read and have been a great help. I’ll be back with photos of the build if anyone is interested! 

 

Regards, Steve

 

[Corbs]

That's excellent.

[Giles]

Lovely stuff!

 

There are several options regarding reversing the steering. One is to take the drag link off the 'top'  side of the servo, whereas you are taking the the drag link off the 'bottom of the servo at the moment (so in effect the servo horn is moving from 10 o'clock to 2 o'clock instead of front 4 o'clock to 8 o'clock  if that makes sense).

Second is to take the servo apart and re-wire it internally so it works the other direction.

Third is to splash out and buy a transmitter such as the Radiomaster TX8 with Deviation software (about £95), which allows you to reverse the servo direction  signal (and also gives you inertia, and lots of other goodies!) . That's the way I would go - they are brilliant, and the models perform much better with a really good transmitter.

 

You can also reprogram the Deltang receiver to output at 60Hz, which will suit the N20 gearmotor best.

 

Congratulations!

Edited May 18, 2021 by Giles

[StephenF]

Thank you Corbs and Giles!

 

Giles, I noticed somewhere that you had gone on to a better transmitter, it does sound good. Inertia was distinctly lacking watching the video again, and easier programming would be nice. It would be difficult to alter the servo arrangement in the way you suggest. I should really have tried it out, but it was such a perfect solution to put it in front of the axle that I thought I’d cross other bridges when I came to them. 

I was surprised how smooth the N20 was though. 

At least it goes well, so my inner accountant might just ok a smart transmitter!

 

[StephenF]

So the question I had was: 

I have simple 3 pin 2.5mm pcb mount stereo sockets on the way. I want to connect the tip to battery +,  the ring to battery - and the sleeve to the rx. 

So when I want to charge I use a stereo jack from the charger  that connects to the tip and and the ring. When I want to run the bus I use a dummy jack that connects the tip and the sleeve. 

Will this work? What bothers me is the possibility of a short circuit while inserting either jack. And should I have ordered sockets with normally closed switches? I didn’t know there were  different ones till I started looking at wiring diagrams... 

Electronics is not my strong point!

[otherplanet]

Lovely work. Some nice brass engineering going on there.

[StephenF]

Thanks otherplanet, yes, I love the stuff.

I'm a bit primitive at the electronics, hope to pick it up from you guys. Like flashing lights :)

[StephenF]

As promised, some build photos...

 

I used a drill bit to make sure the wheel bearings were ok before the glue set...

 

 

 

Wheelhub is 1.3mm aluminium, that stuff you can get from the metal section at B&Q. It's soft, and easy to shape, but strong enough for making this kind of thing. I left the axle stub long so it would be easier to file round. Difficult to work with 3mm lengths.

 

 

 

 

 

Hub finished. The holes in the wood were for holding the wheels tightly so I could bore out the centres on the minidrill stand.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited May 19, 2021 by StephenF

[StephenF]

Jig for drilling the axle. Going through into the wood meant I could glue the three parts together held true by .9mm wire, which is what the kingpins will be.

 

 

 

(Started cropping these pics, they're huuuge)

Axle glueing, obv.

 

 

 

 

 

A bit sideways this one:

 

 

 

This is the rear axle mounting. I wanted to use the tiny ball bearings like at the front, but although they say they're 1.5mm inner diameter actually they're more like 1.3 or 4. So no way to get the 1.5 mm axle through, and I couldn't think of a way to open them out. 

So I used 2mm top hat bearings, filled them with solder and drilled them back out to 1.5. Whitemetal bearings, just like the big ends on my old Norton!

 

 

 

 

That's all folks!

 

 

Edited May 19, 2021 by StephenF
pics too big

[Giles]

Excellent stuff with the axle - it belies how small it actually is.

 

I think you would get into trouble (with shorting) using a stereo jack. I use mono jacks in the bigger stuff which don't short - or at least the type I use don't.... in the 4mm vehicles I use 1.25 Molex sockets instead.

Micron sell combined socket/switch units - which I've only recently discovered, which would do you well (bottom of the page)

 

http://www.micronradiocontrol.co.uk/conn_molex2mm.html#mrc-swplate-microslide

[StephenF]

Thanks Giles, I’ll look them up.

I also thought the dummy jack was a good idea, but in the long run you’d lose it....

I’ve been looking at Radiomaster, the Tx8 is not available anymore, except a few 2nd hand. Tx12s are though, at £65-75. Tx16s are £150+. 

So maybe a Tx12...

[Giles]

I've had a couple from here with no problem at all.......

 

https://www.kooltoyz.co.uk/radiomaster-tx8.html

 

[StephenF]

Oh good, thanks.

 I ‘ll take a look!

 

Edited May 20, 2021 by StephenF

[StephenF]

so this is the next project:, a Leyland halfcab:

 

 

 

Preliminary hacking is done:

 

 

 

It's smaller than the Seagull, so not really space for the big 520 battery on the ceiling. I'll use a 200 so:

 

 

 

 

I'll probably re use the red wheels on it I think, but maybe skip the double wheels on the back axle, unless there are howls of disapproval.... this is a narrow bus!

I have more of the black wheels I used on the Seagull, but they are fairly inaccurately drilled and I had to discard several before finding ones that were good enough.  

Edited May 23, 2021 by StephenF

[wainwright1]

28 minutes ago, StephenF said:

so this is the next project:, a Leyland halfcab:

 

 

 

Preliminary hacking is done:

 

 

 

It's smaller than the Seagull, so not really space for the big 520 battery on the ceiling. I'll use a 200 so:

 

 

 

 

I'll probably re use the red wheels on it I think, but maybe skip the double wheels on the back axle, unless there are howls of disapproval.... this is a narrow bus!

I have more of the black wheels I used on the Seagull, but they are fairly inaccurately drilled and I had to discard several before finding ones that were good enough.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Now that looks interesting.

I have been looking at motorising some buses for some time, but without using the radio control option. I have gathered most of the parts I need and am working out how to modify several different types of vehicle. I was wondering how you are going to deal with the clearances for the steering unit as you have to cut away a fair amount of material under the bonnet area and for the front wheel under the mudguard. It is pretty tight and relatively close to scale, you have to allow enough room to turn and obviously you cannot take away too much material without making it all too weak and flimsy. Are you going to use under scale wheels ?

All the best

Ray

[StephenF]

Hello Ray!

I agree it’s all very tight, but I’ve cut away the subframe right up to the axle mounting. I’m hoping to use the red plastic flange directly in front of the axle as the front axle pivot support. The steering axle will be right behind that, with a rear support behind it. Then I have to have the servo.

I’ll make the axle directly, and see how it fits. Maybe get some supporting structure on the underside of the bonnet, or extend something from the seat moulding, which is really the subframe. It all has to be removable in one piece, so probably the latter would be best. Your points are interesting, it does look like I’ll have to cut away some of the rear inner face of the wheel arches, but the wheels must pivot tightly. So the key is to get the kingpins as close to the inner face of the wheel as possible. There are pictures of that in the section above, dealing with the Seagull. 

Solving the problems is where the fun is isn’t it?

Are you going to do wire in the road then? I’ll come and have a look....:)

Edited May 23, 2021 by StephenF

[Pikey]

Excellent work making the front axle! You can buy plastic ones at whatever width you specify from KKPMO, if you fancy doing it the 'easy' way. They're not without issues, but it saves making the whole thing from scratch 

 

https://shop.kkpmo.com/product_info.php?info=p927_steering-kit-a-in-small-0-5mm-steps-milled-1-87-or-smaller.html

 

[StephenF]

 

2 hours ago, Pikey said:

Excellent work making the front axle! You can buy plastic ones at whatever width you specify from KKPMO, if you fancy doing it the 'easy' way. They're not without issues, but it saves making the whole thing from scratch 

 

https://shop.kkpmo.com/product_info.php?info=p927_steering-kit-a-in-small-0-5mm-steps-milled-1-87-or-smaller.html

 

 

Noooooo  (shoots self in head). 

Seriously though thanks Pikey, but I enjoy making things like that, and I’m just doing another for the halfcab. I did buy a Faller axle a while back and thought it was a bit weak, don’t know if that’s what you meant by issues?

Anyway, it keeps me off the streets as they say! Or they used to.... when I was a lad some years ago.

[Pikey]

The axles they come with tend to be far too short for 1:76 wheels, especially bus and lorry wheels. I have found that 1mm pins intended for circuit board use (I think) are suitable longer alternatives, and I just drill a 1mm hole in the model's wheels, insert the axle so there is a tiny amount of free play, and add a tiny drop of superglue to the outside. You can see this from the outside, but I am happy with this small visual intrusion because of the amount of work it saves doing it the correct way (ie your way). This has worked very well for the 20+ models I've converted thus far.

[StephenF]

 

Quote

The axles they come with tend to be far too short for 1:76 wheels, especially bus and lorry wheels. I have found that 1mm pins intended for circuit board use (I think) are suitable longer alternatives, and I just drill a 1mm hole in the model's wheels, insert the axle so there is a tiny amount of free play, and add a tiny drop of superglue to the outside. You can see this from the outside, but I am happy with this small visual intrusion because of the amount of work it saves doing it the correct way (ie your way). This has worked very well for the 20+ models I've converted thus far.

Yes, sounds good.

I have spent a ridiculous amount of time putting bearings in wheels so they run true, and on the halfcab I brilliantly managed to glue two up completely. I have worked out a method which I’ll describe when I post next, but probably about 6 hours to make an axle, and  then there’s mounting it right. It’s certainly time consuming, but it does get quicker with a system.

20+ vehicles, you’ve got enough for a small town! But you need a bunch of people/transmitters to have them driving about at the same time. Or use Faller type system...maybe there could be an automated radio control traffic system run by computer. Then you could have a couple of people driving independently, trying not to hit or get hit...!

 

 

Edited June 13, 2021 by StephenF

[wainwright1]

Has the bus hit the road yet ?

 

All the best

Ray

[StephenF]

9 hours ago, wainwright1 said:

Has the bus hit the road yet ?

 

All the best

Ray

 

 

Hello Ray, thanks for asking!

The short answer is no. As always, I have been off doing other things, and getting distracted. That’s why the last bus took ages...:)

I have made some progress though. You were quite right, the front of these kind of buses is quite difficult, owing as you said to the lack of strength. Also, the wheel arches are part of the baseplate, which must be removed for a steering system. 

So I have cut the arches off, and glued them separately to the casting. I also needed to remove quite a bit from the insides, so the wheels would turn. (See photos)

On the seat moulding which is the main chassis, I made a brass plate which runs down the aisle and extends forward to hold the steering axle. As you said it’s pretty tight, and took a bit of time to get right. I have had the steering axle in, also have just about done the rear axle mounting. I’ll post more photos sometime....

Quite a lot left to do, and not much spare time at the moment, but I will get to it eventually!

 

regards,

Steve

Edited September 20, 2021 by StephenF
Repetition