Dapol O gauge TTA announced.

[PJ10]

On 05/12/2023 at 10:39, pylonman said:

Thanks pj10.

 

From your info I guess we're only a little bit wiser!  😕

 

 

 Hi,

 

Arriving Monday at Tower

 

"It is looking like the new Dapol TTA's will be with us on Monday. Dapol did despatch these to us yesterday but it is looking like the palletts of them will arrive on Monday....."

 

PJ10

 

 

 

 

[pylonman]

Hi.

 

Rails of Sheffield took payment for three, pre-ordered, TTA's about half an hour ago.

 

Regards

 

[chickensoup]

On 08/12/2023 at 14:09, pylonman said:

Hi.

 

Rails of Sheffield took payment for three, pre-ordered, TTA's about half an hour ago.

 

Regards

 

In stock. Took the plunge x2 Plain are all out at Hattons. Merry Christmas. 

[hmrspaul]

Has anyone identified which wagon manufacturer and brake rigging these have? Is there more than one design being modelled? Tower mention drawing A1 and A2, do we know what the differences are. 

 

Although several of these wagons appear to be based on photos from my website because they are generic I have not been involved with this project - some of the finishes are suited to vacuum braked wagons; air braking of many of these wagons was a 1980s rebuild. 

 

Paul

Edited December 19, 2023 by hmrspaul

[Pugsley]

I picked mine up this morning and there are two different chassis types.

 

Type 1:

And type 2:

 

I've not looked at them too closely yet to see which diagram of wagon they're closest to, although the Esso one is a bit reminiscent of some Powell Duffryn built ones that were in Total service in the early 90's.  One thing I have noticed is that the 1st type has load sensing valves on both sides and the 2nd type has none at all!  Looking underneath (which I forgot to photograph), the brake cylinder arrangement looks a bit funky.  Axlebox covers are different on the two designs too.

 

First impressions are that they're nice wagons that could do with a bit of detailing, if that's your thing and I reckon the seams could do with a bit of sanding too.  The etched walkways and ladders are excellent.

 

It'll be interesting to see how easy they'll be to convert to S7.

Edited December 11, 2023 by Pugsley

[Robert Shrives]

Hi 

Happened across the boys packing these on pallets last week and lovely looking and undoubtably useful for many layouts - all crying out for gunking ! far to clean in the pristine condition.   Certainly they were based on photos and available drawings but sure the model will please many and see folk off down oily worm holes getting exactly right details. 

I look forward to seeing these in the wild very shortly. 

I have got a box of bits and bobs post production as spares - yet to look inside and catalogue so perhaps in new year some listings of bits will appear - but a large backlog of new parts to work on.  

Robert 

[hmrspaul]

Pugsley - thank you for the photos of both sides. Confirms my fears from the Hattons site where it is possible to do a 360 deg. view. Both appear to be a Chas Roberts brake rigging. But they have produced the same side on both sides of each model.  Instead one side should have the appearance of type 1 with a single V hanger and the other side should be as type 2 with two V hangers - and for both various other details as well. What a mistake! 

 

It is the bodies which are the major difference - a single end ladder or paired end ladders and some of the prototypes modelled do have these differences, such as the Gulf with the single ladder https://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/gulftta

 

Paul

[Mol_PMB]

That's a shame, thanks Paul and Pugsley for the info.

On the earlier Dapol tanks, the solebars are separate mouldings from the diecast chassis frame, so it would be theoretically possible to swap them. Is that the case with the TTAs?

 

I was tempted by the Lubricants Producers version, though it would be challenging to return it to original livery without the Hazchem panel and renumbering patch without requiring a complete repaint. I'll stick with working on the earlier Dapol tanks for now.

[Pugsley]

5 hours ago, hmrspaul said:

Pugsley - thank you for the photos of both sides. Confirms my fears from the Hattons site where it is possible to do a 360 deg. view. Both appear to be a Chas Roberts brake rigging. But they have produced the same side on both sides of each model.  Instead one side should have the appearance of type 1 with a single V hanger and the other side should be as type 2 with two V hangers - and for both various other details as well. What a mistake!

Ah yes, I see that now!  It also explains why one has the load sensing valves on both sides.  On first look, it's probably not going to be that easy to correct either as the hangars are moulded into the chassis, instead of being separate parts.  These are not going to be the quick project that I hoped they'd be.

 

Does anyone supply etched V hangars and other brake gear components in 7mm scale?

 

4 hours ago, Mol_PMB said:

On the earlier Dapol tanks, the solebars are separate mouldings from the diecast chassis frame, so it would be theoretically possible to swap them. Is that the case with the TTAs?

The whole underframe is one plastic moulding, that appears to be one piece, with a metal compensation beam connecting one end of both axles on one side.  It might be possible to cut in the corner and swap them but you'd have to be brave!

Edited December 13, 2023 by Pugsley

[Mol_PMB]

On 11/12/2023 at 17:59, Robert Shrives said:

Hi 

I have got a box of bits and bobs post production as spares - yet to look inside and catalogue so perhaps in new year some listings of bits will appear - but a large backlog of new parts to work on.  

Robert 

That's intriguing, I would be interested in some tank wagon spares, especially if you have any from the previous batches of tanks (Air Ministry and Anchor Mount).

[Mol_PMB]

24 minutes ago, Pugsley said:

Does anyone supply etched V hangars and other brake gear components in 7mm scale?

Ambis make quite a range of etched brake parts, but mostly for older wagons. Available from Hobby Holidays.

ABS used to make a lot of cast components, some of which are still available from David Parkins at Modern Motive Power.

I'm not sure where I'd start looking for air brake components though.

[admiles]

Has anyone got any photos of these end-on? All the photos I've seen so far are side-on but there seems to be a lack of air-brake pipes fitted to the bufferbeams. Unless they're in a detail pack?

[markjj]

1 hour ago, admiles said:

Has anyone got any photos of these end-on? All the photos I've seen so far are side-on but there seems to be a lack of air-brake pipes fitted to the bufferbeams. Unless they're in a detail pack?

That looks distinctly like a vacum pipe on an air braked wagon to me 😳 

Edited December 15, 2023 by markjj
Typo

[Goodnight Sweetheart]

360 degree view on the wagons here….

 

 

[Pugsley]

On 13/12/2023 at 17:29, Mol_PMB said:

I'm not sure where I'd start looking for air brake components though.

Me neither!  Might be a DIY job.

[admiles]

On 15/12/2023 at 14:23, markjj said:

That looks distinctly like a vacum pipe on an air braked wagon to me 😳 

Thanks.....thanks what I suspected.

 

Just how does anyone get it that badly wrong??

[Mol_PMB]

In general they are very nice looking models and capture the feel of the prototype well.

I guess if you want a rake of 30 on a HLJ-sized layout then the small discrepancies won’t be too noticeable and a decent weathering job is much more important.

If you just want a couple for a micro-layout (and are bothered about the details) then get one of each type and start some major surgery with solebar transplants.

They’re a bit too new for me, I’ll stick with bashing the Dapol unfitted tanks for now (and that includes some brake mods too, for some prototypes). 
Mol

 

[markjj]

7 hours ago, admiles said:

Thanks.....thanks what I suspected.

 

Just how does anyone get it that badly wrong??

Lack of proper research I would guess unfortunately.

Look at each of Dapols Air braked wagons the air pipes are either on steroids or look like they were borrowed of a 00 gauge wagon.

Why don't they run the wagons passed the experts before they release them it would save them a lot of bad press. 

[admiles]

16 hours ago, markjj said:

Lack of proper research I would guess unfortunately.

Look at each of Dapols Air braked wagons the air pipes are either on steroids or look like they were borrowed of a 00 gauge wagon.

Why don't they run the wagons passed the experts before they release them it would save them a lot of bad press. 

 

Not putting airbrake pipes/equipment on air braked wagons is a pretty fundamental error. Especially in 7mm.

[gardenwall]

3 hours ago, admiles said:

 

Not putting airbrake pipes/equipment on air braked wagons is a pretty fundamental error. Especially in 7mm.

Those built up until 1966 were vacuum braked, eventually the survivors were converted to air brake but  the Shell-BP livery had ceased by then. The mid grey Shell would have been air braked from new, let us hope later runs will add air brake detail, the earlier liveries are fine (as long as you only look at one side). 

[admiles]

21 hours ago, gardenwall said:

Those built up until 1966 were vacuum braked, eventually the survivors were converted to air brake but  the Shell-BP livery had ceased by then. The mid grey Shell would have been air braked from new, let us hope later runs will add air brake detail, the earlier liveries are fine (as long as you only look at one side). 

 

I was thinking about the ones with TTA tops codes...

[hmrspaul]

On 19/12/2023 at 16:20, gardenwall said:

Those built up until 1966 were vacuum braked, eventually the survivors were converted to air brake but  the Shell-BP livery had ceased by then. The mid grey Shell would have been air braked from new, let us hope later runs will add air brake detail, the earlier liveries are fine (as long as you only look at one side). 

Although rather tired the two logo Shell BP livery could survive a long time. Such as on this TTB in 1988 https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/p125474082/e7c1d3b85 Despite the TOPS code I doubt it still has a vacuum pipe. Or this in 1989 https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/p125474082/e74f2eb6f

 

Paul

[gardenwall]

On 20/12/2023 at 19:45, hmrspaul said:

Although rather tired the two logo Shell BP livery could survive a long time. Such as on this TTB in 1988 https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/p125474082/e7c1d3b85 Despite the TOPS code I doubt it still has a vacuum pipe. Or this in 1989 https://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/p125474082/e74f2eb6f

 

Paul

Thank you.  I may have to have a go at weathering in the future if the "Round Tu-its" allow. The others with "ghost images" of the SMBP logos are interesting too. 

[Hal Nail]

I appreciate sorting the issues is a shame but to my eyes these tanks show a lot more finesse than the Heljan B tanks that have arrived at the same time. Dapol's ladders and roof fittings are a lot finer and as usual there is no comparison on price.

[ChrisS]

I was looking forward to these being released. I'm no expert but they do seem to be a bit generic though, which does not help my OCD, but which i guess is inevitable given all the various original builds and the liveries offered by Dapol. 

 

I have a few examples of the TTAs or perhaps TTVs given they come with a vacuum pipe - maybe they are suffering from an identity crisis. I've looked at too many photos trying to work out what Dapol have done - it could drive you mad. So I decided to do some modelling and make them my own.

 

First I painted lamp irons and bottom steps white, and buffer shanks silver. I painted over the yellow axle boxes on my BP example- not the correct shade but it will get weathered later. I found some spare Heljan air pipes supplied with my past class 25 purchase so fitted these too. The vacuum pipe easily came out - I've not bothered filling the hole and just touched up with some black paint. Then there was the issue with the break levers....... (a subtle difference corrected in photo below).

 

 

What I really could not get my head around was the brake levers. On the BP example it had two levers with the crank bits, where as the lubricant producer had two plain levers without the cranks (see photos below). The other models also appear to have issues with their levers. After studying many photos it generally appears to be the case there should be one of each and specific to each side of the wagon- I can only assume this is a production line issue? I have visions of someone thinking that will do, no one will notice!

 

Luckily the glue is not strong, so I was able to swap an example over so each wagon has been improved - you just need to make sure you fit the correct lever for the side being modelled - hope this makes sense. I have another TTA to modify so will have to source or fabricate another lever - don't fancy buying another wagon for the purpose of swapping levers. 

 

 

 

 

Another modification I've done is to remove the duplicate load sensing valve (?) and lever from the side without the additional break rigging. Again the glue was not strong and I kept the cylinder, and fitted it from within to fill the hole in the frame- see photo below. I then painted and touched up as required. Looking at prototype photos it looks like there should be some additional detail here on this side of the wagon, perhaps why there is some empty fixing lugs in the frame?

 

 

As mentioned at the start I'm no expert. I've done some modelling to improve my TTAs. I'm aware there are still detail issues with the model if comparing to a specific prototype. Please do your own research if you have any doubts. However, they are better than anything I could have built in the time I have available. Looking forward to weathering.

 

Hope this was of interest/ use.