fire flicker

[a10driver]

hi

i want to put fire flicker in a loco

but i carnt get old of aney leds that flicker.

does aneybody know where i can get them from.

iwant to fit them on to a sound chip aux 1.

i have been told i want a 16v led.

 

thanks a lot if you can help

 

cheers jack

[bertiedog]

hi

i want to put fire flicker in a loco

but i carnt get old of aney leds that flicker.

does aneybody know where i can get them from.

iwant to fit them on to a sound chip aux 1.

i have been told i want a 16v led.

 

thanks a lot if you can help

 

cheers jack

 

There are not any actual Leds that flicker randomly, it's done by an electronic circuit, the only commercial LEDS are steady flashing types.

 

If you are into home electronics you can build the electronic circuits for a few pence, they use two or three flashing leds at different rates that simulate the random flicker required. If you want I can forward or publish the circuit , should you go for this course, but the commercial ones are made, I do not have the net reference to hand , but I will check ASAP.

 

Stephen.

[bertiedog]

A published circuit Copyright of author, but open to the net attached , showing fllcker drive for single LED

 

( not just for you , but anybody interested)

Stephen.

FIREFLICKER.pdf

[Lady_Ava_Hay]

Jack, If you want to add fireflicker to a DCC equipped loco, you will need to read the decoder instructions to find out if that effect is supported by the decoder. If it is (doubtful with Hornby or Bachmann) you will need to change the decoder, wire up an LED and series resistor to one of the function wires and blue wire common negative. Then you will need to change some CV's as per decoder instructions. Use an orange LED rather than red.

 

If you are using DC then Bertiedog's advice is sound and you will need to buy or make a PCB to fit in the loco, wire up to pickups and LED and then put it all in the loco. There may be a possibility on DC that the LED will work in one direction but not the other without overcomplicating the PCB.

[Grovenor]

A published circuit Copyright of author, but open to the net attached , showing fllcker drive for single LED

 

( not just for you , but anybody interested)

Stephen.

This being the DCC section and all perhaps it might help to check out the functions on your decoder, firebox flicker is often available as one of the selectable functions.

Not there is much flickering about a steam loco fire, more that the amount of light getting out into the cab goes on and off as the firehole door is opened and shut for each shovelful, or group of shovelfuls depending on firing technique.

For sound chips the flicker can be linked to the sound so reflects the fire being affected by the blast.

Keith

[bertiedog]

The really simple way to get flicker is to get a Flashing red LED, flashing yellow LED, and a steady orange LED, the flasher LED's should work on 12volts DC, the orange LED will need 1000 ohms in series, and wire the lot in parallel.

 

The three bulbs are put together and give a nice flicker fire effect without any further electronics at all.

 

I have only seen DCC chips with flicker on chips from US made DCC systems, it's not on Hornby or Bachmann in the UK on the basic CV listings. Lenz show it, and several makes in the States feature it on standard and sound chips.

The above simple suggestion would work on DC, or DCC with an added miniature bridge rectifier, and an extra resistor of about 500 ohms in series to work from the DCC track voltage. For DC just use the bridge rectifier on its own. This allows it to run both forward and reverse.

[Lady_Ava_Hay]

This being the DCC section and all perhaps it might help to check out the functions on your decoder, firebox flicker is often available as one of the selectable functions.

Not there is much flickering about a steam loco fire, more that the amount of light getting out into the cab goes on and off as the firehole door is opened and shut for each shovelful, or group of shovelfuls depending on firing technique.

For sound chips the flicker can be linked to the sound so reflects the fire being affected by the blast.

Keith

 

You are right about flicker and the firebox door being open and closed but be aware that when the door is open ( as it should be to encourage combustion of the flammable gases ) and the loco is under power, there is a distinct difference in the light as blow back occurs. It is that draw effect caused by the exhaust blast that actually produces that flickering effect. At low speed and high cut off that blowback is pure hell for a fireman.

 

The other effect is the lethal blowback caused by a heavy, loaded steamer going into a tight tunnel. Can and has caused injury.

[bertiedog]

Simple three led flicker for fires, the bridge rectifier can be the smallest type available 20v type as the current is only about 50ma

Wire the LEDs all the same way round, cathode to cathode etc, and make sure the rectifier feeds the right way round, {reverse if it does not light}

Stephen

[Ron Ron Ron]

I have only seen DCC chips with flicker on chips from US made DCC systems, it's not on Hornby or Bachmann in the UK on the basic CV listings. Lenz show it, and several makes in the States feature it on standard and sound chips.

Sorry, that's not quite right.

I think you'll find quite a lot decoders have the ability to give a firebox flicker and not only US made ones.

 

Apart from US brands, here are some of the European brands that have the feature....

 

Lenz you have spotted. It's available on all their decoders (Standard Plus, Silver Plus and Gold Plus).

 

ESU have it on their normal LokPilot V3.0 decoders, but not the LokPilot Basic V1.0 (Bachmann 3-function).

They also have it on all their sound decoders, the LokSound V3.5 series and the new LokSound Select. As it appears that the OP is asking about this function on a sound decoder, the chances are it may be one of these.

 

I think most if not all all current Zimo decoders support it. They can do just about anything else except make a cup of coffee.

 

Others European makes with the feature include; most if not all those made by Kuehn, some from Uhlenbrock and possibly some from CT Elektronik.

 

You won't find such a feature on a very basic bare bones decoder like the Hornby model, nor on the Bachmann models (see ESU above).

 

Check what decoder is being used. There's no point in building a circuit if the function is already on the chip!

 

 

.

[RedgateModels]

If you have a Loksound chip then firebox flicker is easy, I just used a 12v Hornby type filament bulb connected to F1 and set the appropriate CVs to turn on the flicker. I also mapped the function to the "shovelling" sound ....

[Marty Mc]

Hi

 

It is very simple to put firebox flicker on and you can do many things to improve the effect. See photo on AUX 1 or 2 your choice with a 1k resistor in series wired up to with 1 function. Most decoders support it.

 

 

 

Simple straight forward wiring!

 

 

Fire box flicker in action follow link

 

 

 

You can also mix epoxy and broken glass to get it reflecting in different directions with 2 or more coloured leds...very effective. I use 1.8mm leds and smds and cut out the firebox door or drill a 2mm hole depending on what I want to do.

 

Hope that helps,

 

m

[shortliner]

A couple of years ago, you could buy some magnetic "body-jewellery" that had a built in battery and some (up to about 10)minute "lightpoint" LEDS in various colours that had a very rapid flash rate. Whether they are still available, I know not, but they might produce the result you are after

Found these although not quite waht I meant http://www.flashingblinkylights.com/body-lights-round-magnetic-blinking-pins-c-114_61_1.html

[MiDAS]

Sorry, that's not quite right.

I think you'll find quite a lot decoders have the ability to give a firebox flicker and not only US made ones.

 

Apart from US brands, here are some of the European brands that have the feature....

 

Lenz you have spotted. It's available on all their decoders (Standard Plus, Silver Plus and Gold Plus).

 

ESU have it on their normal LokPilot V3.0 decoders, but not the LokPilot Basic V1.0 (Bachmann 3-function).

They also have it on all their sound decoders, the LokSound V3.5 series and the new LokSound Select. As it appears that the OP is asking about this function on a sound decoder, the chances are it may be one of these.

 

I think most if not all all current Zimo decoders support it. They can do just about anything else except make a cup of coffee.

 

Others European makes with the feature include; most if not all those made by Kuehn, some from Uhlenbrock and possibly some from CT Elektronik.

 

You won't find such a feature on a very basic bare bones decoder like the Hornby model, nor on the Bachmann models (see ESU above).

 

Check what decoder is being used. There's no point in building a circuit if the function is already on the chip!

 

 

.

 

Some of the ZTC decoders also have firebox and ash pan flicker

Terry

[a10driver]

hi

thanks for the replies

the chip are howes esu sound chips

as one or two have said it will go on axu 1

 

MARTY MC where did you get your led from

 

cheers jack

[RedgateModels]

As an update, on my class 2 tank build with a Loksound Micro installed detailed here I

 

remapped AUX2 to work with the shovelling coal sound and set it to the "firebox" flickering effect. I've also remapped F0 to AUX2 so I can have the firebox door open with or without the sound effect - perfect for those cold frosty mornings or cooking breakfast!

 

I used AUX2 because the micro did not come with a AUX1 wire at the time!

 

From memory, the CVs used were:

 

to map F0 (forwards and backwards) to AUX2 set cv 141 and 144 to 8 (4 to use AUX1)

to map AUX2 to the shovelling sound controlled with F5 set cv 171 and 175 to 8 (4 to use AUX1)

to set AUX2 to use the firebox flicker effect add 80 to the value in cv 116 (115 for AUX1)

 

I used a Hornby "HST" 12v bulb part number X.8172 which you should be able to get from East Kent Models. I have a couple spare that I could part with for ??2 each including postage

 

the photo here shows how I mounted the bulb into the firebox

 

 

 

[Marty Mc]

Hi

Try DCC Concepts www.dccconcepts.com he has his own custom manufactured LED's for model trains.

 

m

[Etched Pixels]

Hi

Try DCC Concepts www.dccconcepts.com he has his own custom manufactured LED's for model trains.

 

m

 

Or Rapid Electronics for most stuff who will sell you LEDs, lighting strips and other parts for often 1/5th of the price model shops and 'DCC specialists' like to charge.

 

The DCC specialists are good for specialist stuff but usually a rip off for standard parts.

[a10driver]

hi

thanks for all the answers

it gives me a lot to think about

will let you know how i get on

 

cheers jack