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Track plan feedback, 4200x600mm


ash39

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Some of you may have seen my first layout Ashington which I started when we moved into our new house. It's currently in the spare room but pretty soon we're going to need the room so it will be stripped and a new layout started in the garage, with a lot of lessons learnt from the first layout.

 

This one will be built on a proper timber frame ,as solid and straight as I can possibly get it. The current layout doesn't run too well as it sags in places.

 

Anyway, construction is a long way off. I'm taking my time with this one. Due to the size of it and other hobbies/commitments, it could take me a good few years to finish. Which is fine by me, I like a project that I can return to when I have spare time. The first thing I want to get right though, and it's pretty important as it dictates everything else thereafter, is the track layout.

 

As the title says, the rear wall of the garage is just over 4.2 metres. I don't want it much deeper than 600mm as the rest of the garage needs to be useful. As well as this, there will be two fiddle yards at each end, returning round the corner. The left hand side will have a 2.9m fiddleyard which will hold all express/mail trains. There will be a smaller 1.4m fiddleyard on the right hand side, only a couple of roads, which is basically just somewhere for small freight trains and DMU's to run through the scene from one end to another.

 

At this stage, here's the preliminary plan:

 

7700848914_ddd3c3c24c_o.jpg

 

I'm happy with the platform 1-2 area. They are both terminus platforms which give the impression of through platforms thanks to the scenic break (the track stops just off the plan, I haven't included it all as the fiddle yards are not planned yet).

Platform 1 will primarily be for RES trains which will come in, locomotives can run around using the headshunt and take the vehicles back out again. Being so close to the front of the layout as well uncoupling will be simple, and it's a nice bit of operational interest.

 

I intend to run ECML and WCML expresses, using the same justification as my last layout which is it's a busy thriving northern city between Leeds & Manchester which is served by both, terminating and then returning south the way they came in. This obviously works well with the large fiddleyard on one side, So looking at HSTS, 86's, 87's, 90's, 91's and the odd 60, 66, 92 on freight/light engine moves. Also going to include a couple of local services with 158's. The green line on the plan is the length of the longest train, a 91 with a set of 3 mk4's and a DVT. Plenty of space in the platforms which will give a prototypical look rather than squashing them in like some layouts. Plus I'm hoping the large footbridge/station building will break up the train masking the fact that it is underscale by 5 coaches!!

 

The station building, footbridge and canopies will be scratchbuilt to my own design. I'm not yet sure what to do about the scenic breaks at each end (the white lines). Any suggestions welcome. I want to keep it looking very urban despite the temptation to stick some scenery in as I like doing it!

 

The orange building will be a modern apartment type building. Will give a nice backdrop when viewing trains coming through the junction on the station approach.

 

I'm looking for general advice and comments, especially with regards to the track layout as I'm not strong on prototype track plans. The junction may need attention, obviously I don't want loads and loads of points for expense but can it be made better without over complicating?

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if you want to stay urban then road bridges over the railway should help.

 

Coventry has a road bridge running over one end of the station, the bridge is on a fairly steep slope (I know, I used to cycle up it home from uni!) if you slope them down from the back to the front slightly it will help look as though the bridges come down to meet station forecourt level.

 

make both bridges different types of construction, the main one at coventry is brick pillars with a span put in place (think it's a steel construction) going the other way, just after the station I believe that bridge is, while a narrower span, brick

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That's good info, cheers. I'll get on google street view when I get chance!

 

I was thinking of a road for one end, but not sure about both. Maybe another rail line (not running) would be an option.

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Nice plan - plenty of scope for the movements you describe.

 

The thing I noticed first is no crossover from platform 4 and the through-line back to the departure line ( though it could be presumed that both lines are bi-di for a distance with connection off-stage).

 

What if you move the island platfornm up a space and have the through line between 1 and 2?

 

Also a tip to steal/borrow from a layout I once saw - use feathers to signal ecml trains one way and wcml trains the other.

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Thanks for the feedback. The reason the crossovers are the way they are is so I can send a train from the big fiddle yard into platform 3 and then exit to the small yard via the crossover (only platform 5 and the middle line exit to the small yard)

 

How would you go about signalling a plan like this? I know nothing about signals whatsoever. I'm not after 100% realism but a vaguely prototypical look would be good. Are feathers the white lights on a diagonal? Don't know what they signify either!

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Thanks for the feedback. The reason the crossovers are the way they are is so I can send a train from the big fiddle yard into platform 3 and then exit to the small yard via the crossover (only platform 5 and the middle line exit to the small yard)

 

How would you go about signalling a plan like this? I know nothing about signals whatsoever. I'm not after 100% realism but a vaguely prototypical look would be good. Are feathers the white lights on a diagonal? Don't know what they signify either!

 

Thanks for the feedback. The reason the crossovers are the way they are is so I can send a train from the big fiddle yard into platform 3 and then exit to the small yard via the crossover (only platform 5 and the middle line exit to the small yard)

 

How would you go about signalling a plan like this? I know nothing about signals whatsoever. I'm not after 100% realism but a vaguely prototypical look would be good. Are feathers the white lights on a diagonal? Don't know what they signify either!

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OOPS, I was on the train back from Leeds last night when I sent that and signal kept dropping out, haha.

 

That's right. I'll finish the plan tonight and it will make more sense then but basically the top line on the left goes to a small loco holding area with 3-4 sidings, the other three lines go to the main fiddle yard. On the right, the top two lines (platform 4 and the centre through line) go to the small fiddle, the other three terminate just off scene. I may amend this though.

 

The reason the through line is between 3 & 4 and not 1 & 2 is the curve to the fiddle yard would have to be too tight if it was closer to the front of the scene.

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7709993042_b0c16880a0_o.jpg

 

This should clarify the small fiddle situation. The sidings just take a 2-car DMU, but I can't go much further because of the garage door. I might see if I can squeeze it to take a 3-car Class 158 in one road at least.

 

I will draw up the big fiddle tonight. This will be more challenging as they need to take 1.5m trains and I'd like as many roads as possible.

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I'm still a bit puzzled by the track layout - are the lines coming in from each end (from the fiddle yards) meant to be parallel single lines, or even bi-directional? Otherwise I can't see how it would be worked. I understand the constraint you have at the right hand end with lack of space but the design means that you either 'crane shunt' from the arrival line to the departure line or trains have to go back the way they came (which is what would happen with parallel single lines of course).

 

I presume a similar state of affairs will apply at the other end as well because unless the lines to the fiddle yard are bi-directional some of the track layout simply will not work because it will be impossible for trains to arrive in Platforms 1 & 2.

 

I'm also puzzled by the line between No.s 3 &4 platform lines as it basically appears to be no more than a very long facing crossover - unless it is part of the junction between the parallel single lines and offers a place to hold a freight (for example).

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Thanks for your feedback! Platforms 1 and 2 are bi directional as the trains simply come in and out. Platform 3 will be mostly used in this way too but thanks to the connection with the middle line can be used as a through platform too.

 

The centre track is basically to allow a freight to pass through whilst trains are in the platforms, I thought thisbwas fwirly prototypical?

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The problem you've got at the moment Ash is it looks like a junction station more than a conventional double track station. If the left hand arrival lines are conventional double track lines then you can't arrive into platforms 1 or 2. So they would be departure only after trains terminating in platforms 3 or 4 are shunted into 1 or 2. (i.e. you don't have a facing cross-over from the up line into the terminal platforms).

 

On the right the way you've done it trains can't swap-over (without the afformentioned hand-crane) from the up to the down lines so again it has the feel of two single lines.

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Personally I'd make platforms 1 and 2 as conventional terminal lines for DMU's and push-pull terminating traffic fed by a revised set of the pointwork to the left.

 

Then on the right as soon as the track disappears into the scenery (which would be as early as you can) join the double track into a single track then straight into a 3-way point. That would then give you 3, similar length, sidings all of which feed both the up and down lines.

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  • 3 weeks later...

After taking on board comments in this thread, and a few of my own concerns about there being too much track and not enough 'scene setting', I have simplified the plan.

 

The main changes are:

 

- Any fiddle yard road can now enter any platform, this will improve operation massively

 

- I have switched from a U-shape to an L-shape to save space in the garage and save building baseboards, It can still be extended in future. The only compromise is I can't run freight but I still have the RES platform and I can still send light engines and DMU's from one end to another as they can 'hide' in the scenic break at the non-fiddle end.

 

- More focus has been put on where buildings are and the viewpoints for watching/photography

 

New plan

 

7834349220_6988880451_b.jpg

 

A few points as marked on the plan:

 

1 - will be a large feature building - I'm thinking of scratchbuilding my favourite building - Broadcasting Tower in Leeds, but worried it will look too modern for when I run mid 90's stock, thoughts?

 

6905824077_c127b7802d_b.jpg

 

2 - will be a modern apartment building as originally planned but now raised to match the street level, the green line is a retaining wall

 

3 - Royal Mail building - now with stabling sidings for locomotives

 

4 - Street level with shops etc

 

5 - Station building and footbridge exiting to street level

 

6 - Dual carriageway in cutting with rail bridge over , giving three levels at that point which should hopefully give the impression of depth. This will look similar to the photo above in terms of how the road works.

 

 

The scenic breaks are undecided but I'm thinking of having the right hand end as a multi storey car park with the railway running under it, similar to the road in this photo I took in Leeds

 

7834455526_4ac692b8a4_b.jpg

 

Any more feedback most welcome, I really want to get it right!

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