RMweb Premium cnw6847 Posted December 22, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 22, 2009 As someone who is self employed I always get my income tax bill just before Christmas. This really makes my blood boil! Why? With all the Christmas post why do they need to send them now, why not just wait until the New Year? Anyone else get very annoyed about this? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold BoD Posted December 22, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 22, 2009 Not tax bill, but we always seem to get our phone bill on Christmas Eve. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 ....With all the Christmas post why do they need to send them now, why not just wait until the New Year? Maybe they want us to spend money we haven't got on tax, rather than presents..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 As someone who is self employed I always get my income tax bill just before Christmas. This really makes my blood boil! As someone who is self-employed you should have known about how much tax is due well in advance of Xmas within a month or two of your tax year end (probably 31st March). As tax is only due on profits already made and NOT in advance of making them unlike the salaried on PAYE. I think the only person you have any right to be angry with is yourself. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium eldavo Posted December 22, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 22, 2009 Like many I get 12 of those tax demands every year. Oh wait I forgot, they're not demands and I don't get a choice as to when I pay them either they simply take the money straight away! You must really need something to rant about. Edit: I lied I get 13 a year as they have a go at my annual bonus as well. (No I'm not a banker before anyone asks but I've been called something similar on occasions) Cheers Dave Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cnw6847 Posted December 22, 2009 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 22, 2009 I am already well aware of what I have to pay and when I have to pay it, what annoys me is receiving the bill 4 days before Christmas. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PrestburyJack Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 I am already well aware of what I have to pay and when I have to pay it, what annoys me is receiving the bill 4 days before Christmas. Why? If you knew it was coming in the New Year you might spend Christmas worrying. At least this way you get 3 days prior to the 25th to get over it! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium cnw6847 Posted December 22, 2009 Author RMweb Premium Share Posted December 22, 2009 I am very sorry for bringing my annoyance to air, obviously I am the only one with the problem. Better get on with some modelling to forget it then Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Anglian Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 I am very sorry for bringing my annoyance to air, obviously I am the only one with the problem. Better get on with some modelling to forget it then I'm self employed, or rather I own the company that employs me, my Corporation tax is due on my Birthday so I feel your pain. Still you've got the money ready to go. I've known people who have had to sell news cars they've bought earlier in the tax year without factoring in the fact that they have to pay tax later. Still do some model stuff??¦ more fun! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
torkardlane Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 With you Richard on this must make sure next year I spend more and dont make a profit lol. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PhilH Posted December 22, 2009 RMweb Gold Share Posted December 22, 2009 As one of the poor muppets who get stiffed for PAYE I wish I could find something to claim for. I have to get to work the same as a self employed person, why can't I claim for fuel for this, for instance? My neighbour, who is self employed claims for pretty much everything and laughs at me paying tax every month. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Etched Pixels Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 When I get the tax bill I remember - that a lot of people don't actually earn enough to pay tax - that I got to stick it in premium bonds over the year not pay it as due via PAYE and I feel happier - at least until I remember they blew the lot on bank bailouts, moat cleaning and wars... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
John_Hughes Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Enoch Powell - with whom I share almost no opinions at all except for this one - once remarked that he was always delighted to receive his tax bill because it showed he was a full member of society with all its rights and obligations. Now I must admit that I don't like paying tax as such, but whenever I visit a doctor, get on a bus or train, see kids going to school, borrow books from the library, watch television or dozens of other things, I'm darned glad that that's how the system works. Though it would be nice if it were a bit fairer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I have to get to work the same as a self employed person, why can't I claim for fuel for this, for instance? My neighbour, who is self employed claims for pretty much everything Myth - A self-employed person is NOT allowed to claim fuel for getting to work. One of the first things looked at in a tax enquiry is the "motoring expenses claimed". It is a minefield for the unwary "thinks he knows all the scams" self employed. The Revenue Inspector just knows he is on a winner when he sees this one. A win can mean double the tax plus interest plus opening enquiries into previous years. I recall one enquiry I was sitting in on. My client a landscape gardener claimed 100% of the cost of his van - everything. The discussion first focused on his other personal transport, a motorbike, and then on how insecure it must be leaving it unattended. This was followed by a discussion on where the client had been on holiday (he had failed to follow my advice and keep the meeting on pure business related matters). It transpired that the client had taken his van to the airport and parked it there when on holiday. The van had therefore been used for non-business use on at least one occasion. A gift for the inspector, who asked for business use of the van to be accounted for from invoices. More work for the accountant more costs and time for the business. It was simpler and cheaper to admit fault and come to an arrangement of the over-claim. In folowing years he kept a mileage diary. - Record keeping. It is always worth remembering that the Revenue Inspector is also on PAYE and has all the same prejudices against self-employed "cheating" tax, and they have seen every possible scam that the man in the pub or untrained bookkeeper can think up. and laughs at me paying tax every month. But I guess that is one of the few benefits of being in the insecure world of having to find your own customers, running the business administration and having a very uncertain future. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted December 23, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 23, 2009 When I get the tax bill I remember - that a lot of people don't actually earn enough to pay tax and I feel happier - at least until I remember they blew the lot on bank bailouts, moat cleaning and wars... Yeah, that about sums it up from my point of view Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Trainshed Terry Posted December 23, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 23, 2009 The other thing that effects all of us is VAT, which correct me if I am wrong goes back up to 17.5% on the 1st January 2010. and not having a pay rise this year is a a insult. :icon_mutter: :icon_mutter: :icon_mutter: Terry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted December 23, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 23, 2009 Myth - A self-employed person is NOT allowed to claim fuel for getting to work. I appreciate you know far more about this subject than me Kenton but is it really that clear cut? Having had to do a fair amount of research on starting up a business in the UK recently then surely fuel costs, indeed all vehicle costs would be deductable, ,provided the vehicle was used solely for business purposes - something your landscappe gardener example failed to do. I'm talking about a real self employment here, i.e. IR35 friendly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 I appreciate you know far more about this subject than me Kenton but is it really that clear cut? Having had to do a fair amount of research on starting up a business in the UK recently then surely fuel costs, indeed all vehicle costs would be deductable, ,provided the vehicle was used solely for business purposes - something your landscappe gardener example failed to do. I'm talking about a real self employment here, i.e. IR35 friendly. First point - before we confuse folk - IR35 is a "stealth tax" introduced to clobber the one man Ltd company and the misuse of Ltd companies to avoid employment taxes and paperwork - it does not apply to the self-employed. Your quote provided the vehicle was used solely for business purposes is absolutely correct. the term "wholly and exclusively for business purposes" is more frequently quoted. Of course the landscape gardener driving from his administrative place of work (his yard - which may or not be at his home) to the job of work or his supplier is a genuine expense and is allowable. Indeed so is driving to a prospective customer, But driving on holiday, down to the supermarket for groceries or even at lunch time to the local chip shop is most definitely not. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Tax doesn't have to be taxing. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted December 23, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 23, 2009 First point - before we confuse folk - IR35 is a "stealth tax" introduced to clobber the one man Ltd company and the misuse of Ltd companies to avoid employment taxes and paperwork - it does not apply to the self-employed. Your quote provided the vehicle was used solely for business purposes is absolutely correct. the term "wholly and exclusively for business purposes" is more frequently quoted. Of course the landscape gardener driving from his administrative place of work (his yard - which may or not be at his home) to the job of work or his supplier is a genuine expense and is allowable. Indeed so is driving to a prospective customer, But driving on holiday, down to the supermarket for groceries or even at lunch time to the local chip shop is most definitely not. Ok thanks very much for the clarification Kenton... mind you if the gardener drove a prospective client to the pub I assume that's an allowable expense! Funnliy (?) enough the one man limited company is exactly the situation I might well end up in shortly :-/ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 To a certain extent, I can understand where Richard, the original poster is coming from. None of us particularly like getting tax bills. However, one has to think where we would all be if we didn't pay tax. PAYE has its advantages, being self-employed has its advantages. The advantages/ disadvantages are just different. Here in Germany, I am required to file a tax return, which involves pages and pages of mind-boggling forms - so it isn't just a question of pay it and forget about it like PAYE is. The tax system is also a complete and utter nightmare for the uninitiated. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 mind you if the gardener drove a prospective client to the pub I assume that's an allowable expense! Don't assume anything. Entertainment, gifts, inducements, bribes and benefits in kind - another Revenue Inspector's favourite. Do you think that you will be able to convince the inspector that this is "wholly and exclusively" and not just another attempt to get one over the taxman? I wish businesses would spend the time wasted in trying to save a few pounds of tax on the real business of making profit to put more money in their pockets. If they think the taxes are unjustified then that is a separate matter of politics. Funnliy (?) enough the one man limited company is exactly the situation I might well end up in shortly :-/ Well you know what I'm going to say - get an accountant Corporation tax, employment law and taxes, company law and its additional responsibility are big issues and you will still be paying PAYE (and perhaps caught by the real complications of calculating IR35) This should not be taken lightly, it is a minefield for the unwary and HMR&C and Companies House will assume you either have the employ of a good and appropriate accountant or are yourself an expert. You want to trade looking big as a limited company - they will take it for granted that you act accordingly. The other thing always to remember is that tax law and corporation law changes rapidly - I found it difficult to keep pace when it was my job - so I am about 6 years out of touch as I no longer am a consultant in tax - budget into any business plan the expense of a bookkeeper and appropriate accountant. Work with them and not against them. Then if and when you get an enquiry it can be handled professionally and at arms length with none of your profit making time wasted. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted December 23, 2009 RMweb Premium Share Posted December 23, 2009 Several of the guys I currently work with have been self employed in one way or another for periods over the years, so hopefully if push comes to shove I can find a good accountant from personal recommendation. In terms of a limited company then really I'm looking at it from a limited liability point of view, I'd still like a roof over my head and a shirt on my back if things go belly up; not really interested in the 'image' sid eof it as such., given anyone can set up a limited comapny for 40 quid odd anyway. ( I'm aware there are commitments beyond that) At the momnet the only certainty is that my current job ends as of 31 /12 / 09 etc. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenton Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 Limited liability is actually quite a poor protection for a "one man" Ltd company as the director(s) -ie you - are responsible for the good management of the company (she shareholder's (you again) investment) AND its ability to pay its creditors ... It is possible to sue a one man company for this bad management. It just costs money to do so. So when the amounts are small the director(s) walk away free to start over again. My personal view is that such defaulting directors should be barred from holding such an office for a period (say 10 years). But that's is because I have been on the receiving (or rather not receiving) end of such individuals. Good luck with the new venture. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrobuscp Posted December 23, 2009 Share Posted December 23, 2009 At least the tax isn't actually payable until 31st January. Prior to self-assessment, it used to be 1st January! As an accountant in practice, I would just like to support everything Kenton has said. His advice is very sound. Colin Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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