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HST numbers in 1987


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I'm currently repainting my farish HST set into executive intercity for use on Millers Dale. My question is does anyone have any info on HST set numbers running on the midland main line in 1987? I'm after loco numbers and coaching stock rakes if possible. The most important bit being the nose end numbers as in exec some had 43XXX on there and some still retained their 253XXX or 254XXX. Is there any way of finding this info or do I just simply search for pics of suitable prototypes for the year. I'd like the set locos numbers to be accurate though. i.e. that loco ran with the other in that year.

 

Regards

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I might be able to help you in terms of which sets were used on the MML in that year, but you'd then need to find photos of those specific power cars to see what they had on the front. ISTR that the 253/254 numbers had pretty much been abandoned by that time.

 

I'll have a nose through my books when I get home.

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Cheers mate that would be good. As for abandoning the set no's I am currently looking at a pic of 253035 in 1988! I would prefer to use a loco with the 43XXX numbers though tbh.

 

Cav

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The Midland Main Line used Eastern Region power cars in its sets and I have looked at a considerable number of photos when choosing the power cars for Kirkhill.

 

Around Jan/Feb/March 1988 the Eastern had 110 power cars. From these I have notes for 83 of them and only 2 (43163, 43164) carry a set number (253041). I think that this is because they were Western Region power cars until May 1987 and the Western Region continued to apply set numbers when the Eastern didn't. Of the remaining 81 power cars, four have numbers that have begun to peel off (43041, 43052, 43054, 43111) and sixty one show the power car number thus leaving sixteen with no number on the front at all.

 

This should give you a reasonable approximation of how to number your models. Power cars did run together perhaps a month or so but as soon as one needed a major exam or failed they were swapped as required.

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Cheers mate that would be good. As for abandoning the set no's I am currently looking at a pic of 253035 in 1988! I would prefer to use a loco with the 43XXX numbers though tbh.

 

Cav

253035 was a Western Region set: 41145, 41146, 40419, 42299, 42300, 42301, 44040 based at Old Oak Common in 1988

 

I think you would want East Coast and Midland Lines set 35: 41153, 41154, 40741, 42195, 42200, 42205, 42210, 44083 based at Neville Hill

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Cheers for that info. Im not major league anal so Ill pick a pair from yours, do you have info on the numbers which fit your categories. The pic I was looking at was at Paddington as it turns out so was in fact a western region set.

 

Cav

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The Eastern Region power cars were 43038 - 43123, 43152 - 43166, 43178, 43179, 43182, 43193 - 43198. I'm not going to list all the power cars here as it would take too long and some of my notes will be for Swallow livery not exec. If I were you I'd go to flickr and type in either Sheffield, Leicester, Derby or St Pancras followed by hst 1987 (eg Sheffield hst 1987) and see what photos come up: http://www.flickr.com/search/?w=all&q=sheffield+hst+1987&m=text

 

If flickr says it's "got the hickups at the moment" press refresh and it should work after a couple of tries.

 

Don't forget that Derby and Sheffield may show you cross-country sets though as well.

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This thread is of help to me as well, so thanks very much! It seems i've lucked out. 3/4 of my power cars are ER numbered (43051 "Duke and Duchess of York", 43072, 43178). The final one is only one out! 43181 "Devonport Royal Dockyard". 

 

Sorry to hijack thread but as it's related I thought it would be better than starting a new thread. Does anyone have a list of names of the ER power cars up until just before privatisation? I'm modelling 1993/1994. Thanks! 

 

Edit: never mind, came across this useful list: http://www.railuk.info/members/diesel/loconame_search.php?offset=800&number_in=&name_in=&order=number,%20named&dir=Next

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No problem with the hijack. It may be a good place to post hst related information. For such an iconic and long lasting train the hst doesnt get a lot coverage on here. Im sure there must be a need for an info thread.

 

Cav

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Just ER for me. Guessing the OP would want MML. Would power cars always run in pairs from the same depot? I guess that would make sense... 

I don't think they did, I think it was just a general pool. The Midland used power cars from the Eastern Region so there is every chance that Bounds Green, Heaton or Craigentinny power cars could turn up as well as Neville Hill ones.

 

Dennis Taylor's site, http://80srail.zenfolio.com/f849552340 , shows a complete mixture of power cars from all the depots passing Leicester.

 

Edit : I'm thinking of 1987/8. By 1994 the power cars would have been in dedicated pools.

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power cars should be from the same depot. 

Only after the dedicated sector pools came in. Even then I have:

 

23 May 1992

43019 PM + 43144 OO Cardiff to Swansea (both IWRP)

43131 PM + 43008 LA Swansea to Fishguard and back to Paddington (both IWRP)

 

24 May 1992

43166 LA (ICCP) + 43133 PM (IWRP) Exeter to Plymouth

 

By 1992 all the East Coast and Midland power cars were at Neville Hill anyway, in different pools, so there is less of an issue.

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The Eastern Region power cars were 43038 - 43123, 43152 - 43166, 43178, 43179, 43182, 43193 - 43198. I'm not going to list all the power cars here as it would take too long and some of my notes will be for Swallow livery not exec. If I were you I'd go to flickr and type in either Sheffield, Leicester, Derby or St Pancras followed by hst 1987 (eg Sheffield hst 1987) and see what photos come up: http://www.flickr.com/search/?w=all&q=sheffield+hst+1987&m=text

 

If flickr says it's "got the hickups at the moment" press refresh and it should work after a couple of tries.

 

Don't forget that Derby and Sheffield may show you cross-country sets though as well.

I am not sure but 43123 would have become a surrogate DVT around this time for working with class 91s / 89001 on the ECML and not worked on MML?

there maybe also some others like 43084

not sure as stated though

SGJ

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I am not sure but 43123 would have become a surrogate DVT around this time for working with class 91s / 89001 on the ECML and not worked on MML?

there maybe also some others like 43084

not sure as stated though

SGJ

The first two (43123, 43014) were converted around October/November 1987 and entered service on 14th December 1987 on the West Coast. Therefore for the purposes of the OP 43123 can either be ignored or it would have been based in the general pool until conversion.

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1994. depot EC graigentinny.013/14/62/63/65/67/68/69/70/71/78/79/80/84/90/91/92/93/94/97/98/99/100/123.  NL neville hill. 038/39/43/44/45/46/47/48/49/50/51/52/53/54/55/56/57/58/59/60/61/64/66/72/73/74/75/76/77/81/82/83/85/86/87/88/89/95/96/101/102/103/104/105/106/107/108/109/110/111/112/113/114/115/116/117/118/119/120/121/122/180/198. the stock that had buffers fitted to work with class 91's 13/14/65/67/68/80/84/123.

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The first two (43123, 43014) were converted around October/November 1987 and entered service on 14th December 1987 on the West Coast. Therefore for the purposes of the OP 43123 can either be ignored or it would have been based in the general pool until conversion.

Were these on the west coast for testing of TDM ?

I had seen a picture years ago with a class 86 and 43123 If i remember corectly 43123 was in executive type livery ( not swallow at the time ).

SGJ

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Were these on the west coast for testing of TDM ?

I had seen a picture years ago with a class 86 and 43123 If i remember corectly 43123 was in executive type livery ( not swallow at the time ).

SGJ

I think so, plus the fact that the East Coast electrification wasn't finished and the 91s hadn't been delivered yet.

 

Re the livery see: http://www.flickr.com/photos/blackwatch55013/4728489722/

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Thank you to all who have contributed to this thread. Some cracking information on what is somewhat of a legendary train. 

 

I wanted to ask some peoples' opinions. My 43181 is going to need renaming/renumbering. After going through the list I thought that 43092 "Highland Chieftain" would be a cool name. Then after thinking about it some more I thought about maybe naming one that wasn't named originally "Gary Speed" as a tribute. Only problem is that back then he hadn't played for either Newcastle or Sheffield so didn't have quite as much "northern" relevance, and ofc he was still alive and well... 

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