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Exactoscale chairs, which ones go where


tender

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Now that the Exactoscale range is coming back on stream from C&L I thought I'd have a go at making some P4 turnouts using plastic chairs and timber sleepers.

I've had a look at the Exactoscale website which gives some PDF picture files of all the various components but I can't find any information as to which chair type goes where. I've printed out a few Templot templates but there's nothing on them either (unless there's a switch somewhere in the software to turn the info on)

I have the Iain Rice book but all the references regarding plastic chairs in that refer to the C&L chairs.

Any information in this regard would be much appreciated.

 

Ray.

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Now that the Exactoscale range is coming back on stream from C&L I thought I'd have a go at making some P4 turnouts using plastic chairs and timber sleepers.

I've had a look at the Exactoscale website which gives some PDF picture files of all the various components but I can't find any information as to which chair type goes where. I've printed out a few Templot templates but there's nothing on them either (unless there's a switch somewhere in the software to turn the info on)

I have the Iain Rice book but all the references regarding plastic chairs in that refer to the C&L chairs.

Any information in this regard would be much appreciated.

 

Ray.

Hi,

The information is on the Exactoscale site, just a little difficult to find - look under Instructions>4mm track and choose the pdf you want to download.

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  • RMweb Gold

Hi Ray,

 

For REA bullhead turnouts there is some information on the Templot web site at: chairing info.

For V-crossings the special chairs are identified Z  Y  X  A  B  C  D  etc., the A chair being under the blunt nose of the crossing. These identification letters are included in the timber numbering on Templot templates.

For switches, the count of slide chairs and block chairs is as given in the table.

Elsewhere in the turnout ordinary S1 chairs are used, unless two are so close together that there isn't room, in which case one or both is changed to an L1 "bridge" chair:


chairing_patterns.gif

Exact details vary by prototype and period.

You can get a good idea of the arrangements by looking at the Exactoscale P4 kit templates, which are available on the old Exactoscale web site at e.g.

 Exactoscale P4 B8 template

They are excellent detailed drawings -- zoom in to 400% or more to see the full detail, as above.

regards,

Martin.

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I have been using these chairs for some time and have got quite used to them. They have been designed for use in the Exactoscale turnout kits and in the case of the additional switch rail chairs you will have to make a centre piece for PL2 position from a standard slide chair

 

Download the the special switch and common crossing files, and the instructions for the turnout you are building eg, B7 (They enlarge very well).  I have found that on some turnouts the turnout instruction differs from the switch instructions, follow the turnout instructions.

 

If building a turnout in P4 as well as the Special switch and common crossing chairs, you will need the bridge chairs (L1) and check rail chairs.

 

One word of warning, most track gauges hold the rail vertical, the chairs are designed with the twenty degree cant. Dont rely on normal track gauges as once the gauges are removed the rail / chair goes back into the twenty degree cant position from vertical and narrows the gauge.

 

Happy to chat through any of these areas I may not have explained very well.

 

You will get a super highly detailed turnout from these versatile parts. Good luck

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Spot on Martin   … although I had to go and check :no: .

 

TOA = Tan of Opposite/Adjacent  = Tan 1/20 = Tan 0.05 = 2.86°

Goodness that takes me back a bit, happy days ….. I’m not too sure, couldn’t get out of school fast enough.

 

Ian

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Thought it looked odd, 3 degrees sounds much better. What silly b*gg*r forgot to press the inv button on his calculator and didn't notice the 10-4 at the end :blush:
 
Nick
 
ps. while we're busy correcting, I think Ian meant Tan-1 1/20 = Tan-1 0.05 = 2.86° :beee:

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Dont rely on normal track gauges as once the gauges are removed the rail / chair goes back into the twenty degree cant position from vertical and narrows the gauge.

 

 

So what gauges do you use then if not the 'normal' ones? I have a set of P4 gauges supplied by Scalefour Society plus a couple of extra track gauges from C&L.

Ray.

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Ray,

 

See this topic. You'll find that John and I don't entirely agree on this subject. Many types of gauges are suitable but roller and triangular gauges should be checked to ensure that they don't grip more than the head of the rail. If they are deep enough grip both the head and foot, then they hold the rail upright and will not be suitable and will need to be modified. If they only grip the head, the rail can take up its correct position.

 

Nick

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Nick

 

Sorry if you feel I don't agree with you, its just what ever I have tried has been less than sucessfull (I have altered one of my 3 point gauges as suggested without sucess) and when spending £18 on 2 gauges, I should not be expected to have to alter them.

 

I have found most C&L roller gauges work with chaired track, but I check the work with an electronic calliper. C&L now sell Exactoscale track gauges. £7.50 per pack of 4 and you need standard and a gauge widened set, I have a set now but not had the chance to use them.

 

To be quite honest, I set my electronic calliper (under a tenner from China off Ebay) to the gauge required and use that and the great thing about ply sleepers is that. If you make a mistake, let the solvent set then you can put a scalpal blade under the chair and unstick it. Adjusting the turnout during the build is very easy 

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Nick

 

Sorry if you feel I don't agree with you...

No problem, John. There's plenty of room for different approaches and I do agree about the C&L rollers being fine and using calipers to check. Our only disagreement was about the triangular gauges, I'm happy to modify them but I agree that you shouln't have to.

 

Nick

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Hi Nick, John, Martin

 

Many thanks for the informative posts on track gauges.

 

I've checked the 'three point' supplied by Scalefour Society and it does seem to grab both the head and root of the rail so I'll stick it in the milling machine when I return to work after Easter and reduce the depth of the slots. The other gauges including the roller gauges from C&L seem to be OK.

 

Still trying to get my head around all the different chair formats, Martin's diagram has cleared up a few things but there's still some components on the Exactoscale site that I'm not sure about. Does the Exactoscale template show the positions and types of chair?

If so where can I get a look at one, these don't seem to be available from C&L yet. I want to put in an order to C&L but don't want to end up buying a load of stuff I don't need. Presumably the code 75 rail that C&L supplies is suitable for the Exactoscale chairs. I already have a supply of that along with some 'Timber Tracks' sleeper and turnout strips.

Ray.

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Tender

 

Here is a link to the B7 turnout, just choose which plan you need.

 

http://www.exactoscale.co.uk/drawings/4NT%20B07L.pdf  Use this as your main guide (as its better than the plan on the instructions page).

 

This is the guide for switches  http://www.exactoscale.co.uk/instructions/RH%20Switches.pdf use inconjunction with the plan above.

The parts for the PL2 position is missing the middle bit, because on the kit there is a soldered joint in the way, I use a cut down (both ends) slide chair, it will become ovbious when building the turnout

 

This is the guide for common crossings  http://www.exactoscale.co.uk/instructions/Common%20Crossings.pdf again use inconjunction with the plan above

 

There are also instructions for diamonds and slips

 

You will also find the C&L plans have the correct chairs in positions

 

The switch & crossing details are taken from Instructions button then 4mm track, the turnout plan from products button (not the one on the same page as the switch & common crossing) then click on the Adobe button next to the size of turnout you are building

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Hi Ray,

...Still trying to get my head around all the different chair formats, Martin's diagram has cleared up a few things but there's still some components on the Exactoscale site that I'm not sure about. Does the Exactoscale template show the positions and types of chair?

Yes, see the link to the B8 in Martin's post #4 and the link to the page with all of the exactoscale special chair details in my #3.

...If so where can I get a look at one, these don't seem to be available from C&L yet. I want to put in an order to C&L but don't want to end up buying a load of stuff I don't need. Presumably the code 75 rail that C&L supplies is suitable for the Exactoscale chairs...

Yes, C&L code 75 BH rail is fine with Exactoscale chairs. One thought though, before you rush into ordering lots of special chairs. What company and what period are you modelling? You'll need to choose the right (or nearest available) type of chairs for plain track. Whether the available slide chairs and other special chairs are correct for your prototype is another question. For example, many are not suitable for GWR use. IIRC correctly, John has posted some examples of modifying these chairs for different prototypes.

 

Nick

 

ps John beat me to it...

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No problem, John. There's plenty of room for different approaches and I do agree about the C&L rollers being fine and using calipers to check. Our only disagreement was about the triangular gauges, I'm happy to modify them but I agree that you shouln't have to.

 

Nick

 

Nick

 

Sadly I have no access (or ablity to use) to a milling machine, I might try and reduce the depth of the gap with plasticard, but I will see how I get on with the Exactoscale ones

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Ray

 

As a guide for a normal turnout you will need the following items, some like the Bridge and check rail chairs will do for many turnouts.

 

Minimum buy, but you will need cut down standard chairs for certain areas where hals and small chairs are required

 

Rail

Chair of choice

Slide chairs

 

Additional chairs for correct detailing

 

Switch rail chairs (enough for 1 x LH & 1 x RH)

Common crossing chairs ( will make 1 each of 1-5, 1-6, 1-7, 1-8 & 1-10)

Check rail chairs (enough for 10 turnouts)

Bridge chairs (enough for 20 + turnouts)

 

For P4 turnouts I use 4 x P4 slide chairs for the first 4 positions, then 2 x 4mm slide chairs (just to ease the transition to) 4 special slide chairs.

 

 

In addition to standard, slide, common crossing (x2) and check rail chairs you will need

 

For a diamond crossing 1 x 4CH 503A

 

For a single slip 1 x 4CH 503A + 1 x 4CH 504A

 

For a double slip 1 x 4CH 503A + 2 x 4CH 504A

 

This all seems a lot but some you will buy once, others can be used on other size/hand turnouts, and you dont buy all at the same time.

 

There are plenty of spare chairs on diamond and slip frets, which I do use on other applications. In the end they can be used on more turnouts than I listed above.

 

John

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Hi John, Nick.

 

Many thanks, them links are starting to make some sense now, although viewing some of them on an iPad I was wondering why I was looking at a blank page until I zoomed in about 400%, them drawings are really fine.

I'll print them out on A3 paper when I get to work later this week and start making up a shopping list.

Still confused by all the numbers in brackets on the switches guide.

 

Looking at the check rail chairs on the template there seems to be two types, those at the ends being different from the centre ones, are these all provided on the same sprue or is it a case of cut & shut for the ends?

 

As regards company and era, these will be for my Seaton layout so will probably be a combination of LSWR and Southern grouping track. But before I get there I need to convince myself that I can build reliable track in P4 so want to just build a small section of track to try out stock on that I'm currently building.

Ray.

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Ray

 

The numbers on the plans/guides correspond to the numbers on the sprues.

 

The switch rail chairs are quite easy to follow as they are numbers

 

The common crossing chairs have nembers to tell you the angle and a letter to tell you the position.

6A is the chair on the point of the V on a 1-6, the next going to the toe will be 6B then 6C (which has a center chock as well). Going the other way from 6A is 6X then 6Y. Its quite easy once you have the parts in front of you

 

As for the check rail chairs, the 2 outer are for the flared ends. The 3 in the middle are for the straight center ones. On the 2 outer sprue legs there is CCL and CCR. If you hold the check rail flared ends away from you then CCL is on the left & CCR is on the right

 

For LSWR just order plain chairs 4CH 104 LSWR 3 hole chair if you have no chairs in stock

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  • RMweb Gold

6A is the chair on the point of the V on a 1-6, the next going to the toe will be 6B then 6C (which has a center chock as well). Going the other way from 6A is 6X then 6Y.

 

Hi Ray,

 

Going towards the heel. The "toe" of a turnout is the end with the point blades; the "heel" of a turnout is the end with the crossing (frog). Imagine a side view of a human foot.

 

The letters A, B, C, etc. are included with the timber numbers on the Templot templates:

 

post-1103-0-31267000-1364749795.png

 

regards,

 

Martin.

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Hi John, Martin.

 

The pennies finally dropped. I think I've got it now.

I'll get an order off to C&L this week and have a go at building one, hopefully before Scalefour North so I can take it along and get it checked out.

Many thanks.

Ray.

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Hi,

 

Just a small point. If it's LSWR, then the pointwork is unlikely to be pure REA. Somewhere I can't remember where, could be Scalefour site, or in an edition of Southern Way perhaps there is some prototype info on this.

 

Stephen

Thanks Stephen, I've found details for LSWR plain track on the Scalefour website but nothing specific to pointwork as yet. Will keep looking.

 

Ray.

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