250BOB Posted February 8, 2014 Share Posted February 8, 2014 I recently found I had a couple of locos not picking up power that well......a Hornby Fowler 4F and a Hornby Britannia....both have all wheel tender pick ups. When upturned in the maintenance cradle an wires applied to the tender wheels......I got no power through to the loco. If I used the wires to touch the pick ups, then power got through and the loco wheels started to turn. The wheel backs were "blackened"....but not dirty.....I had cleaned them thoroughly with solvent prior to testing. I checked that the pick ups were connecting with the wheel backs, everything was fine. So I removed the wheels and abraded the wheel backs to remove the blackening, until I had very shiny wheelbacks......very shiny indeed. The pick ups now worked wonderfully on all wheel sets.....I did this on both locos, and it transformed the running ability. What is this blackening on the wheelbacks........why is it preventing good electrical contact.????? Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain Slough Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Soot, essentially - whenever a spark is caused by poor contact, there is a moment of combustion that leaves a residue of carbon. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Soot, essentially - whenever a spark is caused by poor contact, there is a moment of combustion that leaves a residue of carbon. No, perhaps I didnt explain myself too well......this is the blackening that you find on wheels as new.......?? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaelp Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 Yes, I found that too with a Hornby Class 08, Once the blackening had been removed it transformed the running of the loco. Michael Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Il Grifone Posted February 9, 2014 Share Posted February 9, 2014 The modern fashion is to chemically blacken wheelsets - removing this from from wheel treads and contact surfaces will improve appearance and electrical conductivity. Avoid scratching the surfaces or this will worsen the dirt pick up problem. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 9, 2014 Author Share Posted February 9, 2014 Yes, I believed it was chemical blackening....and understand its done for obvious cosmetic reasons.....But I didnt realise it was so detrimental to electrical pick up. Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PjKing1 Posted February 17, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 17, 2014 Hi Interesting read, what's the best way to clean the backs of the wheels though without scratching? Sorry I know it's probably obvious but it's been a long day (well that's my excuse anyway ) Thanks, Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 17, 2014 Author Share Posted February 17, 2014 Hi Interesting read, what's the best way to clean the backs of the wheels though without scratching? Sorry I know it's probably obvious but it's been a long day (well that's my excuse anyway ) Thanks, Paul Hi Paul......glad you found my thread interesting........but I'm afraid I did end up scratching the wheel backs with emery paper, or medium grade wet and dry. But it worked wonderfully well. Hoping the scratches dont come back to bite me. If there are scratches....they are pretty fine. Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PjKing1 Posted February 17, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 17, 2014 Cheers Bob I'll try and do my best not to scratch em!! Thanks for the reply. Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 17, 2014 Author Share Posted February 17, 2014 Cheers Bob I'll try and do my best not to scratch em!! Thanks for the reply. Paul Paul I also have a dremel, and did have a go using the flat side of a cutting disc........worked extremely well, .......almost too well. Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PjKing1 Posted February 17, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 17, 2014 Hi Bob I've got a dremel to, but everytime I look at that then a loco, I can hear the loco saying please don't Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 17, 2014 Author Share Posted February 17, 2014 Hi Bob I've got a dremel to, but everytime I look at that then a loco, I can hear the loco saying please don't Paul Remember they were tender wheels I did, from a Fowler 4F and a Britannia........I took the wheel sets completley out before attacking them. It was taking too long with the emery paper.......but arguably too quick with the dremel. Good luck.......get some old wheels and have a practice. Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PjKing1 Posted February 17, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 17, 2014 Remember they were tender wheels I did, from a Fowler 4F and a Britannia........I took the wheel sets completley out before attacking them. It was taking too long with the emery paper.......but arguably too quick with the dremel. Good luck.......get some old wheels and have a practice. Bob. Will do, prob won't get chance for a few days but soon as I do I'll let you know how I get on, or I might possibly be sending you the link to eBay where I'll have an 08 for spares or repair Thanks again Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzyo Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 Sledgehammer and nuts spring to mind. Check the tension of the pick-ups and clean them with I.P.A. or meths along with the back of the wheels. As you can take the wheels out do this with them removed. If you want to remove the blackening from the wheels try using vinegar, as it's an acid. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray M Posted February 18, 2014 Share Posted February 18, 2014 Try Solvol Autosol from Halfords . it comes in a toothpaste tube , and it cleans any metal to a very shiny finish. especially alloy metals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 18, 2014 Author Share Posted February 18, 2014 Sledgehammer and nuts spring to mind. Check the tension of the pick-ups and clean them with I.P.A. or meths along with the back of the wheels. As you can take the wheels out do this with them removed. If you want to remove the blackening from the wheels try using vinegar, as it's an acid. I agree you should of course check pick up tension and cleanliness first. I had done, then resorted to the emery paper as cleaning showed no improvement. I've not tried vinegar , have you tried it? And to what degree does it remove the wheel blackening.? Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 18, 2014 Author Share Posted February 18, 2014 Try Solvol Autosol from Halfords . it comes in a toothpaste tube , and it cleans any metal to a very shiny finish. especially alloy metals. Worth a try, we used to clean the crankcases on our motorbikes with this stuff when we were kids.......have you used it to remove the chemical blackening on the wheel backs. Remember it's not just muck we are removing, it's a chemical blackening. Bob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray M Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 i`ve had a go on some of the old Heljan dirt magnets Should do it no problemo. And by the way i still use it on my old Japanese classic bikes. just not on the chrome. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 20, 2014 Author Share Posted February 20, 2014 i`ve had a go on some of the old Heljan dirt magnets Should do it no problemo. And by the way i still use it on my old Japanese classic bikes. just not on the chrome. Japanese...????........RC166 would be good.!!!!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ray M Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Not a little Honda 6, But this old girl is 40 years old. If i`m not stuck in the loft, then its time for the garage. ( I have posted this photo before on a different thread). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campaman Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Very clean, and its got a kick start, wish I had one of them on my Yamaha XVS650 Anyway back to trains, wire wool might be a more gentle way of removing the blackening, but you would be best doing it with the wheels off the model. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PGC Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 Not a little Honda 6, But this old girl is 40 years old. If i`m not stuck in the loft, then its time for the garage. ( I have posted this photo before on a different thread). So what bits do you clean with the Old Peculier? Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Poor Old Bruce Posted February 21, 2014 Share Posted February 21, 2014 So what bits do you clean with the Old Peculier? Phil Presumably that's "for internal use only" Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 21, 2014 Author Share Posted February 21, 2014 Presumably that's "for internal use only" Excellent..........!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
250BOB Posted February 21, 2014 Author Share Posted February 21, 2014 Not a little Honda 6, But this old girl is 40 years old. If i`m not stuck in the loft, then its time for the garage. ( I have posted this photo before on a different thread). I am an Ariel Arrow owner....and thats me in the Avatar....aged 56, on my RS250 Aprilia..!!!! Bob. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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