Hornby Train Set Experience

[jjb1970]

As I noted on another thread I bought my little lad a train set for Christmas and got the Hornby Majestic set as an Amazon deal of the day. This has been discussed at some length on the other thread devoted to it, suffice to say that whilst I think that at the at the SRP it was a crazy buy, at £199 it is a very good train set and my little fella loves it. I thought it might be interesting to sort of follow the journey as in going back to a train set it is something that is easy for experienced modellers to lose touch with what is in effect a very different market. I think for the train set market fine scale super detail and accuracy is not the objective, it is play value, engaging kids with the hobby and just having fun recreating something in miniature which whilst a railway in miniature is more play than shrinking the 1:1 world.

 

The first thing for aspiring parents is to budget for baseboards and to make the space for it. When I was a kid I got a splendid Hornby Duchess mail trainset but my parents never bothered getting a board or boards nor accepting it remaining set up anywhere in the house with the entirely predictable result that although I loved the set and model trains the train set died on the vine and went nowhere. Really, you can't expect any kid to find running a train around a circle of track on a carpet especially interesting. The whole attraction is to create something and to lose onself in a new world. So on boxing day me and the boy were buying wood and mdf in a well known retailer of wood. And today we have been building base boards to transfer the set from a track mat on a laminate floor.

 

Second thing is to get track pins and underlay to get the trainset started. And I'm planning a layout with the boy and letting him let his imagination run so we can plan for the extra track. Clearly you can't give a kid a blank cheque but it is also true that spending a bit now to get the basic track layout up and running will provide a foundation for the train set to grow later. We've decided to expand it from the 6x4 trackmat to 8x4 as the extra 2' makes a big difference in what you can fit on the layout. Again, as with boards, it is no surprise that even if you provide a kiddie with a baseboard the satisfaction of running a train in an oval will soon lose its appeal.

 

Next stage is to buy the extra track and underlay to pin the track down and have a working layout. At that point then my plan is to pull back a bit and build it up more slowly as I do not want to just gift him £100's overnight. However, with plasters sheets, papier mache and paint there is enough to keep us busy with the scenics without rushing out to spend ££££££'s.

 

Which brings me to my next point, for modellers it is obvious but to parents who have never been interested in model railways it is not really obvious just how much even a trainset will cost. And like I say, if you are not willing to spend a certain amount up fron then it is unlikely that kids will get much satisfaction from the thing and they'll lose interest. Which means that the trainset itself is a waste of money. And just have fun and not get too caught up in details and realism.

 

As an aside, I really am impressed with the Railroad A1, does anybody know if cab glazing is available? With cab glazing it really would be a very nice model, it seems a bit bizarre that Hornby provide brake rigging and a nicelly modelled valve gear and blackened wheels which look pretty good and then skimp on cab glazing.

[brushman47544]

Very interesting perspective- and that you went for DCC from the outset. I did too. I bought my son a Bachmann Junior digital train set, together with the Hornby track mat as a separate item and we've built up from there. I bought a baseboard a bit longer than needed for the track mat so the end with the loco shed has extra sidings and a terminal station platform. It's up to him now where he wants to go. No proper scenery yet, but he's adding scenic items using pocket money.

 

The difficulty is maintaining his interest, since the railway has to compete with video games and the like.

[Islesy]

A fine, studied post jjb1970, modellers should remember where it all starts from - getting kids engaged...

[jjb1970]

I must admit that my own equipment is all analogue but I am really quite impressed with the Railmaster + E-link idea. I am no digital expert and know little about the subject but the functionality seems very good to me and it makes a pretty powerful DCC system very affordable. And it is really quite intuitive once you get the system installed and working. I wouldn't say it was the best DCC system in the world (to be honest I have no idea how it compares) but it allows an easy to access affordable introduction to DCC for people who do not want to spend £££££'s at the same time as providing probably more than the functionality the train set segment will need. For the purposes of train set control as opposed to a high end layout it works admirably. My concern is that the transformer doesn't look very manly, at the moment it is fine as it is just two locomotives but in time it'll probably need something with a bit more poke.

 

For all my conservatism I do think digital has a lot of potential for train sets given the play value it opens up, especially now that TTS is making sound affordable for this end of the market. Again, I am not saying TTS is the best sound system in the world but by adding a basic sound system to affordable Railroad type models Hornby are opening up this part of the hobby to a new segment. For all their faults the more I look at their efforts with this end of the market the more I think they probably deserve a bit more credit than they are generally accorded. This is not fine scale or super detail, but for the train set market things like TTS and E-link strike me as excellent innovations.

[geoffers]

Back along when my two lads were 9/11 (now 29/31) mrs geoffers and I did the same. Arranged baseboards - the lads designed the set-up themselves (they both had their own respective baseboard - laid it out on their beds when they wanted to run trains) and filched some of my locos/rolling stock. They built their own scenery and plonked it on the board when they wanted a running session. Did it work?  Well one is more concerned with finding out the mysteries of the universe as he is a research cosmologist (though he paints and collects warhammer stuff) and now married and living away. The other is a struggling musician/guitarist and still living at home (!!!!) but obvious potential there. However they do come into the railway room and ogle the layout and occasionally play with it when home. So I reckon that give them time and opportunity and space (!) they will drift towards it. So to the OP it will be worth it.

[jjb1970]

I think most people have a fascination with replicating things in miniature and even if they have no interest in modelling will often enjoy looking at models. I am lucky enough to work in an office which has a lot of extraordinary large scale builders models of ships (and oddly, a large model of a Virgin high speed train of which I have no idea what it is, a losing competitor to Alstom's Pendolino proposal?) and it is quite telling how people with zero interest in modelling will find them very impressive. I think children love these things, of course they will be interested in other things (tablets, gaming etc) and many will lose interest in models but some will retain an interest and others will return in later life after they get through that phase of growing up where things like modelling are seen as being uncool or for children. And modelling actually has a lot of educational value, this week my boy has been learning things about simple geometry without realising it, by helping me build the baseboard he is learning some basic (and inept...) wood working. And there is a lot of fun to be had in making stuff.

[jaym481]

Timely discussion, as I got my youngsters (8 and 6) a train set for Christmas, and find it's a wonderful thing for us all to get involved with. At their ages they do like to take things apart and experiment, which has so far resulted in a missing traction tyre and some track issues, but those are lessons learned for all of us (I have to supervise more closely, and they learned that the pieces/parts all have a function, so taking them off is not something to do casually).

 

Our main issue is portability - we are transient (my wife is a diplomat), and so move every few years. Any layout has to be portable, which has me wondering what might be a good baseboard solution (light, strong and easily put away when not in use)? 

 

Also, my own involvement in the hobby is long dormant (probably near 35 years), so I'm amazed at what's come alonmg in that time. DCC looks the business, and though the two sets we ended up with are DC, I'm thinking DCC will be the way to go from here on (I had a look at the Hornby conversion instructions, and they look manageable if I can avoid burning myself with my soldering iron). I've also bought myself my own DCC locomotive (in HO - the scale I prefer), and eventually our nomadic life will settle and we can build a proper layout. By that time the boys will be older, and maybe still interested.

 

My immediate take-away from this so far is that I need to get a board, and my kids need to be involved in the layout design. If anyone has any portability tips I would appreciate them.

[jjb1970]

I think engaging the kids is crucial to them taking the thing to heart. As with anything in life (cooking is a good example) there is a sense of pride in seeing your own creativity that far outweighs a recognition that it might not be the most impressive creation in the world. I think this is a prime reason why so many still love kits in preference to RTR. On baseboards, one option would be to build say two 4x4 baseboards and use the same type of track inserts as used for exhibition layouts for the track joints. That would give you an 8x4 board which is enough to create quite a complex layout and accommodate admittedly truncated but still sort of impressive trains and yet get storage down to two 4x4 boards. We've gone for an 8x4 board and whilst it is still compact and obviously limits the size of trains etc that extra 2 feet over a standard 6x4 board does actually open up quite a lot more possibilities and potential.

[jaym481]

I've been trying to shoehorn a decent layout into 6x4, but the idea of a pair of 4x4 boards just might be an easier solution (each board is lighter and more compact). I'm afraid the "exhibition track inserts" part is over my head. I found one example on a quick google search. It's a length of track with stiff wire at each end to "snap" between the two ends of the layout split. Is that it, or are there other solutions?

[jjb1970]

The technique I am thinking of is to leave a gap between tracks where the board joint is, maybe 10cm. Then you have insert mini boards to match the width of the gap (eg. 10cm) and the width of the tracks + ballast which you drop in to join the tracks. This keeps track a safe distance from the board edges to avoid damage. You may need to snip a few sleeper clips to give you space to push the fish plates far enough back not to foul on the main tracks when you drop the insert piece in or remove it. This is a very old technique but it is quite effective and works.

[jaym481]

I've been doing a bit of layout modelling with SCARM, and I reckon we'll start with a 6x4 with an add-on to make it 8x4 once we get enough track.

 

The kids have been playing with SCARM as much as I'll allow them computer time. I had to point out to my oldest that the software is a means to an end, not a "game" in and of itself.

[jjb1970]

The key thing is fun. This is the first layout I've built for many years and generally I have been in model railway clubs rather than having my own layout. The last couple of weeks have made me remember just how much fun it is to create something like a layout. I've kept my modelling skills hot by building plastic kits of aircraft but it is a real pleasure to start building a layout. Also it is a good way of spending time with the kiddies, getting them involved and getting time with them away from a TV set or computer game. I've been showing them sound equipped locos on things like youtube and needless to say they are now badgering me to get some sound equipped locomotives. We'll see how we stay enthused when we start ballasting and doing some of the more mundane bits but at the minute we are having a terrific time.

[hornbyandbf3fan]

If you haven't already, add some sidings for shunting. Not only will it teach your son problem solving, but it's more likely to keep him interested. 

[jaym481]

I have a small layout planned now, with a view to expanding it at some point in the future. I'm also looking at DCC so all of us can control trains at the same time (Oh, the humanity!) I planned lots (relatively speaking) of yard space for shunting operations. Sound is definitely on the agenda, but spending needs to be kept within limits at the moment.

 

On the up-side, my wife is finally happy that I have a hobby that includes the boys. They get bored handing me tools when working on cars (or being the ones to crawl underneath when I drop something), and though they are fascinated by a stereo system, I'm not about to let them handle a turntable at this point.

[Ian Hargrave]

I have a small layout planned now, with a view to expanding it at some point in the future. I'm also looking at DCC so all of us can control trains at the same time (Oh, the humanity!) I planned lots (relatively speaking) of yard space for shunting operations. Sound is definitely on the agenda, but spending needs to be kept within limits at the moment.

 

On the up-side, my wife is finally happy that I have a hobby that includes the boys. They get bored handing me tools when working on cars (or being the ones to crawl underneath when I drop something), and though they are fascinated by a stereo system, I'm not about to let them handle a turntable at this point.

And they'll handle it better than you.Go on ...be amazed....surprise yourself.This "generation" will surpass us all.

[jjb1970]

At the moment we have a stretched double oval with a cross over, a siding on the outside loop and a siding with a couple of tracks on the inside of the oval which gives us some options. Next thing I think will be motorising the points. I think if I was building my own layout, given the space I have I'd probably go for an end to end branch or something but for children I think continuous running is pretty much essential.

 

One of the things I've taken from this so far are that I am very impressed by the Railmaster DCC system, for the price it is a steal and offers an awful lot of functionality for not much more than the price of a simple analogue transformer, probable less than a decent twin track analogue transformer.

[jaym481]

I'm still waiting on a few pieces to fall into place. As a central London flat-dweller who's tools are all in storage in Canada (not that I have the space to do any woodwork anyway), I decided to get a pre-fabricated baseboard frame. Hopefully it'll be in hand by the end of this coming week. Next weekend the actual construction should begin, and if all goes well we should be fully running by Sunday. Terrain modelling can come later. 

 

For DCC I went with the NCE Power Cab. It seems to have good press, and is ultimately expandable to any size we need, plus it supports one additional controller out of the box, so my kids can both be running trains simultaneously. It seemed to me the best value for money, though I admit I didn't look to deeply at the Railmaster kit. I wasn't taken with the Select controller, and the Power Cab's price is not much more (plus the Hornby controller is "coming soon" so used would be the only way to go at this point).