Newton Abbot Diesel depot - Why ?

[rob D2]

Hi,

Just looking through some old pictures of peaks at this location in the late 70s.

 

I'm at a loss to work out why it existed - a smallish insignificant town with large stabling and maintenance facilities.

 

Surely most expresses kept going to Paignton / Torquay or down to the Cornwall area ?

[HSB]

Newton Abbot was a railway town - it was once the main works for the South Devon Railway. In diesel days it would have still stabled locos for trains running from the Torbay & Kingswear branch, bankers for the South Devon banks and also locos for the Ashburton and Heathfield branches.

Edited March 19, 2015 by HSB

[Simon Lee]

There were very limited facilities for stabling at Paignton, if you haven't read it try and get hold of a copy of "Summer Saturdays in the West" for the context of why places like Newton Abott were important and had had so much infrastructure.

 

Even upto the mid 70's the place was buzzing with traffic locos DMUs, coaches stabled etc, plus in earlier times Hackney yard was quite a busy freight yard.

 

Regards

Simon

Edited March 19, 2015 by Simon Lee

[Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71]

.....The Jowetts Rail atlas is excellent for giving an instant picture of all lines that ever were and quickly illustrates why loco sheds were required in the locations in which they were provided.

 

Dave

Edited March 19, 2015 by Torr Giffard LSWR 1951-71

[HSB]

Here's some pics I took with my Instamatic back  in the Seventies:-

 

 

 

 

 

[The Stationmaster]

Very simple really - Newton was a District Running & Maintenance headquarters dept (hence 83A while Laira was only 83D - i.e a depot within Newton's District) plus it had a District HQ depot's workshop capability (and more).  Thus it was a  natural site for a major  diesel depot conversion. And it was still an important traffic centre at the time of dieselisation, don't forget the latter took place almost 60 years ago - what you see today at Newton is but a minor shadow of its past importance on the railway network.

[Rivercider]

Just as Newton Abbot was a railway town so the railway also helped make Torquay and Paignton.

When the railway reached Newton Abbot in 1846 Torquay and Paignton were little more than fishing villages.

Once locomotive maintenance and servicing facilities were established at a location they tended to stay there,

 

Swindon as another example, roughly half way between London and Bristol was where the locomotives were changed,  so a shed was built there,

there were only 2.495 people living there in 1841,

 

cheers

[br2975]

Newton Abbott was still an important location at the start of the 70s.

.

I only ever 'bunked' the place once, and that included the shed and repair shops.

 

Sunday 22nd. August,1971.
Newton Abbot 83A
93, 107, 130, 132, 157, 158,
807, 814, 818, 822, 839, 842, 851, 853, 855,
1027,
1648, 1737, 1840, 1905, 1917,
3808, 4022, 4167,
6337,
(50865+59372+50918), (51313+51328), (51335+59487+59543+51377)+(51372+59479+51414),
B8W (Wickham Trolley).

.

Brian R

[TheSignalEngineer]

Also Newton Abbot had previously been of importance loco-wise because of assisting engines for the South Devon banks. I did the works in 1964 and there were at least half a dozen Warships in that day undergoing major in-traffic routine service or attention to faults.

[rob D2]

All very interesting, but the changing of locos and assisting up the banks - this is steam stuff surely ?

 

I guess it just stayed where it was like you said......did locos run light from Paignton and Torquay for fuel or anything ?

 

Reminds me of Woodford halse near where I used to live that I never understood the importance of either

[chrisf]

Assistance up the banks is still required when an HST is running on only one power car.

 

Chris

[griffgriff]

All very interesting, but the changing of locos and assisting up the banks - this is steam stuff surely ?

I guess it just stayed where it was like you said......did locos run light from Paignton and Torquay for fuel or anything ?

Reminds me of Woodford halse near where I used to live that I never understood the importance of either

Ditto the reasons listed above for Newton Abbot, except there's no sunny seaside towns nearby

 

BTW You're correct in saying 'steam stuff' but you need to remember that railway attitudes (management, running, organisation etc) didn't necessarily change because a load of diesels arrived. Particularly, if I may say, on the WR

[stovepipe]

All very interesting, but the changing of locos and assisting up the banks - this is steam stuff surely ?

 

I guess it just stayed where it was like you said......did locos run light from Paignton and Torquay for fuel or anything ?

 

Reminds me of Woodford halse near where I used to live that I never understood the importance of either

 

I have a 1970 WTT for Newton Abbot, and there were about 10 freight trains and 6 passenger trains in both directions which had a pilot loco booked. Even into the 1980s the overnight sleeper service was piloted over the Devon banks to/from NA.

[JeffP]

And remember that, despite the so-called Modernistation Plan, BR was pretty strapped for cash, so if they could save tripping locos to Swindon for repair, when they already had a pretty decent repair base at NA, why not?

[Clive Mortimore]

The WR had a different approach to diesel maintenance to the other regions (nothing new here, think broad guage, domeless locos.....). They went down the large component exchange route. All there main depots were fitted with overhead cranes that could lift quite heavy items including engines from the hydraulic locomotives. These would be shipped back to Swindon for repair. The other regions only done small component replacement, so for things like engine change the loco went back to works.

 

If you look at Old Oak, Canton, Laira, Bath Road, and Landor they all have a taller repair shed than found at other regions depots, this was to house the overhead crane. Newton Abbott having been a loco works as well as a loco depot was well equipped with a crane and a traverser, therefore ideal for a "modern depot".

[The Stationmaster]

Ditto the reasons listed above for Newton Abbot, except there's no sunny seaside towns nearby

 

BTW You're correct in saying 'steam stuff' but you need to remember that railway attitudes (management, running, organisation etc) didn't necessarily change because a load of diesels arrived. Particularly, if I may say, on the WR

Actually in many respects far more things changed on the WR than some other Regions although admittedly some of that was down to Stanley Raymond arriving as the General Manager following the removal of Keith Grand.  By the 1970s - and in some respects even until its end in 1992 - the LMR was probably the most unchanged although the organisational structure of the SR on the operating side had basically been unchanged since the Grouping (although the Region had changed in many other ways).

 

Incidentally the WR was probably - in the 1960s/early part of the '70s - the most go-ahead and advanced in managerial structure change and of course its running (as in Driver/loco depot management) structure changed prior to dieselisation as it and the other Regions had that part of the organisation altered in the early 1950s.   The next change in that respect - in the 1960s was several years ahead of other Regions except, probably, the Eastern.  As far as diagramming of locos was concerned I think the WR was a long way ahead working hydraulics on cyclic diagrams from the early 1960s.

 

However what did change, and particularly hit the Western, was the impact of the Beeching closures and the loss of freight traffic following the 1955 ASLEF strike together with the contraction of coal mining in South Wales.  And latterly increasingly powerful locos and finally unit trains in teh shape of HSYTs which had a massive impact on depot work allocation for traincrews as well as leading to, initially, a significant change in shopping practice

[Eggesford box]

In the late 70s I was sent down there to learn passenger shunting and there seemed to be a fair bit of swopping locos on trains for them to go for fuel with the replacement loco taking the train to Torbay and then working the return leg as far as I can remember. As others have said even at that time there seemed to be far more activity than nowadays. Great time for me riding around on the pilot  pushing and pulling rakes of coaches in and out of Hackney. Even though there was only a small amount of passenger shunting in my job I can assure one of the previous posters I was small and thin in those days! 

[rob D2]

And I bet you weren't shunting as slowly as most 08s you see at exhibitions !

I think sometimes modellers forget it was a job people were trying to get done ASAP

[HSB]

I saw them trying to fly-shunt with an 08 at Newton once. Unfortunately the wagon didn't roll as far as they wanted and they had to go after it and give it another shove!

[The Stationmaster]

I saw them trying to fly-shunt with an 08 at Newton once. Unfortunately the wagon didn't roll as far as they wanted and they had to go after it and give it another shove!

Sounds like they were not fly-shunting then.  In fly shunting the wagon(s) is(are) hauled, not propelled - and the usual result of getting it wrong is a derailment because somebody hasn't been quick enough on the handpoint lever or the engine wasn't going fast enough prior to being uncoupled.

[KeithMacdonald]

Indeed, at one time Newton Abbot was called “Little Swindon”.

 

 

More here:

https://great-devon-railway.uk/SOUTH DEVON %26 MORETONHAMPSTEAD RAILWAY/newton abbot.html