Full garage plan - new plan update!

[jamest]

Hi all,

 

I've posted some smaller layouts here over the years but the recent sale of my end to end layout has cleared some space in the garage and uncovered my previous attempts to go around my garage.

 

I re-started back in the hobby in 2007 ish hoping to put something over my car's bonnet in the garage. This then extended to the whole garage but quickly sapped all my enthusiasm. I was working with set-track and was not knowledgeable enough to plan something real enough to satisfy me.

 

I then actually made a sensible decision and started building smaller layouts and learning about the hobby and the real railway on sites such as these. Now.....I would never claim to be anywhere near some of the people on here, but I feel I'd like to re-attempt something continuous in the garage that would develop over the years and serve as a test/running in track.

 

So here is a plan of my boards - the green is permanently down, the blue one bottom right folds down against the wall, and the orange board sits in the gap when the folding board is up.

 

My basic requirements are - continuous run (minimum double line), through station (or hint of terminus going out of sight), early diesel era, some sort of goods area where I can shunt while two trains circulate. I had planned to have the two moveable boards as storage but there is no real restriction there if something fits. Obviously the restrictions are the left hand 6" self and the 6" bridge on the other side where there is a pillar on the wall and the car door opens.

 

Here are my first ramblings, with oversize flex to get around the 50 piece limit on free anyrail, based roughly on a Model Rail booklet plan on the Settle and Carlisle. It has a double run, goods loop, sidings, slow goods siding (bottom right) - and I'm contemplating a bay platform from the inside run to the bottom left platform face. Its not breaking any boundaries but its a starter for ten!

 

First the blank (dimensions in inches):

 

Then the plan - based on the widening of the end board to accommodate the station:

 

I'd be very grateful and interested in any ideas. I've tapped into the knowledge on here before for other layouts and always learnt a lot.

 

Regards,

James

 

[Ray H]

I can understand why you have done it but I think you'll find that the location of the station on a curve, even if it is 3ft radius (which I think is just possible in a garage) will be difficult to disguise with wide gaps between trains and platform edges.

 

Depending on your chosen method of coupling you may even find the sidings in the far corner a struggle to access especially over any station buildings.

 

Sorry to sound a little negative.

[MikeHunter]

Hi James, of course it's your plan, but I'd get bored to death by it if it was me. The main issue being lack of shunting. How about sneaking in a small shunting yard separate to the station? You could go for an industry like a colliery or a small dock.

 

As you have issues with needing to remove boards, I'd add a cassette based fiddle yard as a starter. On the 6 inch board, Id add height to minimise the impact of the narrow width, Blea Moor viaduct is the obvious candidate if you are going Settle and Carlisle, or if freelance I've always quite liked the Hornby suspension bridge. I'd make the plain track work harder, what about some layby sidings to clear the line of slow moving freight? Quite like the station design.

[jamest]

Hi,

 

Thanks for the quick feedback. Please don't worry about being negative - I need to know!

 

Although the station is 50/50 from your feedback I'm not 100% on it as it is a bit of a compromise. The station buildings will have to be on the inside platform and will further obscure the yard and outer loops. I had thought of having the station on the scenic break on the blue board. You would see the approach on the blue board after the pillar - perhaps an island platform with a station building on the road overbridge forming the scenic break. that would leave me the rest of the circuit to have a scenic run and some sort of industry.

 

One of my main problems is a lack of knowledge of the real railway and how the approach and exit of sidings was handled on double track. The railway seems to dislike facing points and reversing into the yard is common. but I have books and plans to read up on - I just have trouble converting their format to my space.

 

The 'pinch point' halfway down on the right is hurting me I think - but although it is tempting to widen this a little it would hamper the car and I need to consider that the car will change in the future so I don't want to custom fit my current one! I can squeeze three tracks on it with streamline spacing so it is possible to have a kick-back from the 'blue' station to a set of sidings on the green board above. That would leave the upper left green area for scenics - and the long thin green board for scenics and possibly a dropped section for a river.

 

I like the idea of slow goods sidings, or loops, as I want to keep as much stock on the layout as possible and I don't really have much width for fiddle yard sidings.

 

I need to play a bit more on Anyrail I think!

 

By the way I didn't mention this will be peco code 100 streamline. I'd like to try code 75 but I have accumulated a few medium and large radius points over the years and it would be costly to re-invest in 75 now. While I appreciate how good some of the trackwork looks on the forum it is not as high on my list of priorities.

 

regards,

James

[Chimer]

A couple of random thoughts ........

 

A bay platform to the left of the main station building would need to be accessed from the clockwise circuit via a facing crossover.  If it was to the right it could be accessed directly from the anti-clockwise, and departure to the clockwise would then be via a trailing crossover.  But in either case it would be very short, and you can already terminate and reverse a clockwise working using the loop platform and the trailing crossover on the left hand side.

 

For storage, how about double-track cassettes, say 3' long, forming part of the main run down the left hand side shelf?  Obviously there would always have to be one in place, but if you had 3 or 4 of them you could ring the changes on stock quite well.  You might even be able to disguise them as bridges ....... 

 

Others will have better-informed views, but I would have thought facing access to the yard headshunt via the loop platform road would be OK, compared with facing access direct into the headshunt from the main - all the S&C plans I've seen required setting back into the yard via a trailing point, but if the loop was there anyway the access you've got would seem logical.

 

There looks to be room for a lay-by siding off the anti-clockwise circuit on the folding board, opposite the one you've got off the clockwise - not great for storage if you have to fold the board down at the end of every session, though!

 

I think the station where you've got it is probably the best option given the constraints, radius notwithstanding, unless you cut back to a couple of platform ends emerging from under a road bridge acting as a scenic break, which limits the scope for doing anything interesting in the way of passenger operations.

 

As I said, random thoughts, probably not hugely helpful ... best of luck!

 

Chris 

[Silver Sidelines]

As requested some random thoughts

 

An aerial shot of my curved platform, inner radius about six feet, outer radius 4 to 5 feet.

 

You don't say or I didn't pick up an era for the railway - steam or modern image?  In the steam era you have to avoid facing points.  Obviously there will be facing points at junctions but elsewhere for access off the main running lines think trailing points.

 

Again for interest a panarama view of a station that occupies a length of about 12 feet with three feet / Peco medium radius points at either end.  There is a wide angle view here.

 

If you are interested on steam era layouts you might get some pointers here.

 

Regards

 

Ray

[jamest]

Hi gents,

 

Thanks for the help - I'm churning through some thoughts and your suggestions as we speak.

 

It is planned to be around the 60s/70s - so at the end of really interesting operation but I hope to operate something that has survived to the bitter end!

 

I do have some late creast steam and green diesels along with some BR blue.

 

I don't really need a lot of track to fill the boards just enough to run two trains while I play a little in the yard.

 

I have a good collection of magazines to read again and some plan books from mr freezer, etc.

 

Thanks again,

James

[jon_1066]

One suggestion:

 

What about putting the station throat on the right hand board as it starts to flare with the platforms starting then a train shed covering that hides the tight bend.  This would then give you room on the left hand side for some shunting.

[Catweasel]

Do you have room for the car to stay outside? Better place for it. I have a garage for my "toy" car,but that's because of what it is. The family car lives outside. The toy car's garage is 30x 18 feet. What a space that would be.

[sub39h]

I would put the station on the wider area on the right hand side of your plan with the station approach on the top where you currently have the platforms. Maybe if you have the pointwork on show, then use narrow curves on the corner leading into the station hidden by a town scene on top. You could also give the illusion that the platforms are longer by hiding the start of them under the town scene. I'd then use the wider section on the left hand side to put a goods yard or shed. 

 

If you were feeling ambitious, you could put helices in either of the bottom corners and have a fiddle yard under the layout. This way you may still be able to fit your car?

[jamest]

Hi all,

 

I have tried some of the options you mention on Anyrail and they are all valid - I just need to decide what compromise I prefer!

 

The station/yard is better suited to either 'wider' board and I have tried to link a goods facility and staion around the bend with 'scenic' curves and points. But I've come to the conclusion that if I do that the curves need to be tigher (unless I buy another 20 curved points!) and I'll have to hide them cleverly. Which seems a reasonable compromise to me.

 

A helix is out of the question realistically - and the car needs to live in the garage!

 

Another option was two terminous stations on the wider boards (angling in towards 12 o'clock) as individual 'scenes'. I could then have a circuit - hidden around the top - and scenic countryside below. I could then run to either station, or leave trains to run on the loop. I would need two 'junctions' off the loops - and maybe slopes would help to sit one terminus over the loop.

 

Another night on anyrail I think!

 

Thanks for the help,

James

[jamest]

Hi all,

 

Right, here is my first Anyrail effort tonight - based on ideas shared above. Station one side and limited goods, relief siding, run-around the other. The goods format might change a little but you get the idea.

 

No facing points on the main line - and the curves don't look too bad to me - but could be hidden/obscured with a road or elevated town scene.

 

I don't want to go too point/track happy - but I suppose the track/scenery balance is a decision I'll have to take.

 

 

Have I over-done the points? This does use more curved points than I have, but I have the budget for some more - the next step is to see if I can insert some 'straight' point-work and perhaps hide the tighter curves necessary.

 

Regards,

James

[jamest]

And the version with only a few more curved points - and utilizing a set-track curved point out of sight.

 

I've taken away the cross-over at the bottom right - it didn't seem necessary.

 

Think I quite like the idea of the trains disappearing under the town scene.

 

 

Regards,

James

[37114]

Hi James,

 

I would be tempted to put the bottom right crossover back in as otherwise any trains leaving the goods yard to go way from the station, need to go into the station to run around.

[jamest]

Hi Rob,

 

Good point - I was thinking reversing in the station to continue clockwise would add to the interest - as I can't exit the yard on the right without reversing from the head-shunt/relief road anyway - but that might well get in the way of the passenger service.

 

Cheers,

James

[TonyMay]

I think you need a single slip to enable a train to leave the yard in a clockwise direction.  This doubles as a crossover.  As illustrated with the image below, the slip isn't facing because there's not a facing route to turn off.  Trains would normally stop and reverse into the yard.

 

I also note you now have 3 crossovers which seems somewhat excessive.

 

 

[jamest]

Hi tony,

 

Stupid question #1.

 

I see the crossing access of the single slip - but which way does it allow travel 'across it'?

 

1) up line into yard (facing access)?

2) or between the main lines?

 

assuming the up is the top main line and the down is the bottom.

 

ahhh I think reading your post I see the answer "This doubles as a crossover" so it allows something running on the wrong main line to cross to the correct one.

[Ray H]

James

 

Try turning the crossover on the right the other way but connecting it between the yard and the outer through line so there isn't a facing point on the inside (anti-clockwise) through line. Then convert the diamond crossing on the inner though track into a single slip so that you can reverse from the outer track to the inner track or into the yard (or drive straight out of the yard onto the outer rail track. You won't then need the "headshunt" on the right hand side of the yard so you could swing the other sidings nearer to the through line to make them longer.

 

I'd also suggest that the crossover below the station on the left is probably unnecessary.

[jamest]

Hi again,

 

Taking on board Ray's comments above.....

 

 

 

And I've also considered adding a loop in the station for bi-directional passing. I also like the idea of a smaller station as the scenic ends bottom right - I've added a terminating middle bay for DMU units.

 

 

 

I've spent an enjoyable morning with several cups of tea and some railway magazines looking at other continuous run layouts - its raining outside and I can't do any of my chores!!

 

I've found a few plans that I like and I'm going to have a go at Anyrail again this afternoon.

 

 

Regards,

James

[Ray H]

The modification to the crossover is what I was thinking of and I like the idea of the bay facility in the new station.

 

However I think you've made things worse at the original station because you can no longer reverse there with simple moves so DMUs reversing in the new station have no easy way of reversing at the original station. Furthermore by moving the point under the raised cover further away from the rest of the sidings you have reduced the shunting capacity of the yard partly because you have taken the stub track out behind the inner platform.

 

Is there anyway that you can squeeze a third track in along the left hand wall and put you bi-directional loop there. That would also provide a reversing facility beyond the station for DMUs.

[jamest]

Hi Ray,

 

Thanks again - some useful suggestions there - I had wondered about the DMU operation on the top left station.

 

Sorry to complicate things more but I happened about a plan called Wellbridge (Hornby mag issue 10, April 2008) and really liked it. I knew it would be a compromise around my pinch width on the right and around the curves (the layout in question is wider at 12') - but I like the complexity of it and the potential for playing in the sidings. It also leaves a blank canvas for the left hand scenic run. I could hide the curves slightly with a couple of bridges. The goods yard could be bigger if it was not for the need to get out of the car!

 

It does have a facing point in the outer clockwise loop - but I'm guessing this was not always ruled out?

 

 

 

I'll also work on adding the amendments you mention above to my earlier plans.

 

Thanks for the help,

James

 

[Kris]

You could extend your goods yard round under the two bridges. At the moment it is looking very small and out of proportion to the rest to the layout. 

[Ray H]

Co-incidentally Wellbridge is in the April 2015 edition of Model Rail.

 

I think we have to accept that the occasional facing point can't be avoided when we're trying to squeeze the proverbial quart into a pint pot. I think the Midland Railway placed more emphasis on their avoidance than the other companies.

 

Two of your terminal sidings look very short, probably with space for little more than two/three wagons.

 

I'm not sure that AnyRail increases the double track spacing as the radius decreases to avoid contact between coaches on relatively tight curves like the ones you appear to have at top right.

 

I'll also hazard a guess that the outer loop is only long enough for about seven wagons plus loco and brake van.

 

Can you slide the layout down the plan enough to extend the outer loop so that it starts along the top of the plan or even in the top left corner? May I also suggest having a look at reversing the yard so that the sidings face the other way because they would then extend around the corner on the inside of the curve and there's less restriction on their length there?

[jamest]

Hi Guys,

 

Thanks for the advice - more tinkering will follow!

 

I've been out in the garage (nothing like actually looking at the space!) and I think I can make up a removable small panel that will sit at my pinch point and make it as wide as the blue folding section. I can then have 9.5" instead of 6" and make the siding alongside the platform more pleasing on the eye. Unfortunately I don't think the board angle away from here that restricts the goods yard can be changed. So perhaps a reversal of the sidings should be looked at.

 

I am aware I'm going to have to be very careful with the clearances on the curves - Anyrail will not warn me about clearances and I'll have to be careful with stock checks when track laying.

 

I'll continue to fine tune it I think - and keep a look out for the latest Model Rail!

 

Regards,

James

[jamest]

Hi again,

 

Following on from post #19 here are some amendments to the plan.

 

Dispensing with the middle road in the main station helps with the DMU service between the stations so I think it is a better balance. The DMU can now run anti-clockwise and then cross in the throat on the way back around. I've also rounded the curves to make them look better so that I can put more of it on show. The goods point is still a little tight though so I might well utilise an overbridge there:

 

I've also moved the single slip up a bit to allow a 'catch' siding and more room for the goods roads.

 

Getting there I think...

 

 

Regards,

James