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Mysterious Dean PBV


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post-133-0-08387800-1503062659.jpg

 

Although implying they were non-clerestory roofed like contemporary PBVs, I think what is in the picture is what Harris refers to in "... other vehicles include a batch of six 48' 6" passenger brake vans, ..". It is an unspecified diagram, afaik, although there are gaps in the K series between K4 and K14.

 

 

 

 

 

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Yep, I'd go along with that, makes sense. The photo in my post is definitely a normal, non-TPO, corridor train. Strange that Harris doesn't list some of these lots for the K diagrams (K7, K8, K12 and the first lot of K14). A query though - my Harris (2nd edition, although I do have a 1st edition somewhere) says lot 821 (your K11) is a T59 (a 4-wheeler).

Edited by Miss Prism
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Yep, I'd go along with that, makes sense. The photo in my post is definitely a normal, non-TPO, corridor train. Strange that Harris doesn't list some of these lots for the K diagrams (K7, K8, K12 and the first lot of K14). A query though - my Harris (2nd edition, although I do have a 1st edition somewhere) says lot 821 (your K11) is a T59 (a 4-wheeler).

There is a complete lot list on GWR-elist transcribed by Barry Scott. As for the 'missing lots', there aren't any, you just need the full list either from the diagram book at York, or the Binney list which not only has them but it has extra diagrams for the odd variations that there were within a diagram.

 

As for the photo,could you post a larger scan please. It looks longer than 48'6.

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There is a complete lot list on GWR-elist transcribed by Barry Scott.

 

Ah. I'll have a look for that. (Unlike me not to have grabbed a copy at the time, or maybe I did, and have forgotten about it!)

 

I'll PM you the full pic. Not sure the whole thing can be published here, although it is well out of copyright now.

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Ok, I've had a look at Barry Scott's lot list. If the mystery coach is 48' or 48'6 the possible diagrams are K9 / K10 or K6 -K8. There are only 2 longer clerestory designs K17 54' and K12 56'. K17 was TPO with side gangways and sliding doors. K12 was a pair of Royal Train full brakes. The only K diagram not mentioned in Barry's list is K13.

 

The second coach appears to have 6 compartments and 3lavs which makes it about 48' long, probably on 8'6 bogies. So I conclude that it is K6 to K10.

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 3 weeks later...

By way of observation, isn't this a D29 with the passenger compartments replaced with a single van section? That would put it at about 50-52 feet in length, I think.

 

If so, was it built for the same or related service, like the Paddington-Penzance service?

 

I suppose one could say many of the Dean coach designs rang the changes on standardised 'bits', but it certainly doesn't look as long as 56', which is what the D29 was. I'm inclined to agree with Penhros that it is something between K6 and K10.

 

The service could well be a Paddington to Penzance, and although the photographer seems to be the same and at the same location (thought to be near Flax Bourton), it predates the longer stock used on the c 1905 'Cornishman':

 

post-133-0-05137400-1506423288.jpg

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  • 3 months later...

The mystery coach is a K9 Passenger Brake Van originally built for the Ocean Mail traffic.  Here is a photo of the other side of the coach and you can see that it is a mirror image.

post-6743-0-40498100-1514736358_thumb.jpg

Evident in both photos is the top of the central passenger gangway covered with a small tarpaulin showing above the tender.  The above photo shows that the other end of the coach had an offset PO gangway connected to the coach behind (in this case a L13 70' TPO vehicle).

 

You'll notice that the Binney drawing of K9 reproduced in Russell vol.1 differs.  I think that that drawing is of K10.  According to the lot list K9 had 2 luggage compartments and 1 guard's compartment.  K10 had 1 luggage compartment, 1 guard's compartment, 1 lavatory and a kitchen area.  So the K10 lot list description better matches the Binney drawing and the K9 matches the 2 photos.

 

So from left to right the K9 above is

central passenger gangway

1 big luggage compartment for passenger luggage with 3 sets of double doors,

1 guard's compartment with ducket and single door,

1 small 'luggage' compartment for mail

side mail gangway.

 

My photo above is an enlarged section of the 1905 GW TPO formation at OOC as in the M Harris book, p.117.

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  • 2 months later...
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The mystery coach is a K9 Passenger Brake Van originally built for the Ocean Mail traffic.  Here is a photo of the other side of the coach and you can see that it is a mirror image.

 

So does anyone know how long they lasted in service? I would guess early 30s, but could be a bit later.

 

David

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