retbsignalman

Hi,

In the throes of painting some engineers wagons and wondering if there's a ready to go shade that resembles the faded look the engineers olive took on? It seemed to change quite quickly to a muddy matt brown. 

My starting point is Tamiya XF-62 Olive Drab. 

Any suggestions gratefully received. Thanks 

Graeme 

23 hours ago, RBE said:

DC Kits will be able to blow ESUs file on for you. I think currently they have programmed their own to access functions  but of course the ESU version is the correctly tailored one that we recommend.

Greetings! 

For the terminally confused such as I .........I have three DCC ready 56s and bought ESU LokPilot 5 decoders (59629) for them, installed and given them their addresses. So far so good.  

The locos all move effortlessly and responsively but f0 only puts the headlight on. No marker or tail lights......had a delve in the manual and moved the dip switches as per and no lights at all now. The instructions for functions seem to apply to sound fitted locos (which with hindsight might not have been a bad idea).

Now I read the ESU decoder needs to be blown to the 56-specific files. Did I miss the memo regarding a bespoke ESU decoder? Having invested in both locos and the decoders I thought were for them there seems to be another obstacle.....

As Wogan was oft heard to say "is it me.....?"

Any guidance gratefully received, thanks 

Graeme 

16 hours ago, Jeremy Cumberland said:

I'm sorry to hear it doesn't work.

 

I think the detectors have LEDs on them. Are they in a position you can see? If you place a train on the right hand track circuit, does the LED light up?

Good afternoon Jeremy 

Both LEDs illuminate as they should 

16 hours ago, Jeremy Cumberland said:

 

The train will need to draw power, which might mean driving it, but if it is DCC or has lighting, this should be enough. With the LED lit up, can you set the multimeter (if you have one) to DC volts and measure either between detector terminals C+ and C- or else between relay terminals 3 and 14. You should see 12 volts. This proves that the right hand detector works as intended.

The multimeter shows -11 between 3 and 14 

16 hours ago, Jeremy Cumberland said:

 

 

If the LED doesn't light up, or you don't get a 12V output, then there might be a problem with the detector, the power supply to terminals A or the connection at terminal C+ or C-.

 

The next test is to look at what the track circuits are actually doing when you drive a train over them. For this, it would help if you could disconnect the Tortoise from the points and just set the points manually for though running. Drive a train over the two track circuits and look at the LEDs on the two detectors. The circuit is designed around continuous detection, and I wonder if the right hand detector is dropping out before the train has fully passed. What you are looking for is the left hand detector LED lighting up, then both detector LEDs lighting up together, then the right hand detector LED remaining continuously lit till the train has passed the points. If the right hand detector LED goes out at any time when the left hand detector LED is not lit, the points will motor back.

As the loco occupies the left hand track circuit the relay activates, the red light on the detector illuminates but the power to the Tortoise is broken (the point doesn't change,  however I then manually move the mechanism).

When the loco occupies the right hand track circuit the red light on the detector illuminates, however when the loco has cleared the left hand track circuit completely the relay activates again and the Tortoise is powered up and returns to its original position (I have to hold the tie bar to prevent derailment).

Thanks Graeme 

16 hours ago, Jeremy Cumberland said:

 

On 21/11/2023 at 07:37, Jeremy Cumberland said:

If the above circuit does not work, then wire the coil as follows:

"Set" circuit:

12V to left hand detector terminal C-

Left hand detector terminal C+ to relay terminal 13

Relay terminal 14 to common return.

 

Latching circuit:

12V to relay terminal 3

Relay terminal 7 to right hand detector terminal C-

Right hand detector terminal C+ to relay terminal 13.

Good evening Jeremy, 

I've followed the initial diagram but when a loco occupies the "Set" circuit, the relay activates and the Tortoise has no supply, however when the loco occupies the Latching circuit and clears the "Set" circuit the Tortoise regains its supply and resets the point below the loco.

Unfortunately, I'm not sure how to relate the above description to a wiring diagram to help remedy the problem. All help gratefully received. Thanks in advance 

Graeme 

Thank you again Jeremy! I'll let you know how I get on  

Cheers Graeme 

On 21/11/2023 at 07:37, Jeremy Cumberland said:

I've just edited my last post, thinking it more likely that the detector terminals C are a switched power output rather than a switched contact. Also, this is the "safer" way of wiring them. If they are a switched contact, then you won't do any damage wiring them as above (but the circuit won't do anything) whereas if they are a switched power out and you wire them as a switched contact, you risk doing some damage.

 

If the above circuit does not work, then wire the coil as follows:

"Set" circuit:

12V to left hand detector terminal C-

Left hand detector terminal C+ to relay terminal 13

Relay terminal 14 to common return.

 

Latching circuit:

12V to relay terminal 3

Relay terminal 7 to right hand detector terminal C-

Right hand detector terminal C+ to relay terminal 13.

Hi Jeremy, 

I've had a proper look at your description and come up with the attached diagram.....hopefully that matches your description! I've drawn it as per the relay terminals to help clarify. 

Looking at your alternative should that not work, I'm confused about the wiring in both the 'set' circuit and 'latching' circuit.

I'm using a pair of DCC Concepts Intelligent detectors btw.

Thanks in advance 

Graeme 

I have tried a number of options but none seem to be light enough to prevent derailment of lighter vehicles whilst having the strength to restore the normal route unfortunately.....

8 minutes ago, 5BarVT said:

That’s cos RRTB doesn’t need any!

:-)

Paul. 

You say that Paul, but we have a smattering of such newfangled gizmos across the area, mostly to set routes at Dingwall and Georgemas, and others around level crossings!!

Graeme 😃 

Hi Mike, 

The start of the unidirectional line is in the fiddle yard and, like a lot of good intentions was an extra siding which in the end was hardly used. So, it has to be imagined that the signal to access it is off scene. 

The L.O.S. board has since been upgraded to a PLS fixed at danger (!) as of yesterday, as in the second drawing which also shows the point as 'sprung' (for the want of a better description. 

Cheers G 

Thats spot on, thank you again Jeremy. I'll let you know how I get on! 

Graeme 

Thank you Jeremy, this is going to be a project for next week when I can devote a bit of uninterrupted time to it.  

But first, a couple of questions about the placing of the TCs....as you'll have gathered from the foregoing I'm a novice at things like this.

1. TC A - the strike in TC (lhs) - this is approximately 3' and presumably excludes the point.

2. TC B - the latching TC - is the length of the point ( and I won't have to cut the rail near where the switch rail meets the stock rail)

Would that then mean that a train approaching from the headshunt would activate the sequence and the point move? 

Or, because of the latching process TC B won't activate unless TC A has been occupied? 

Thanks Graeme 

8 hours ago, Jeremy Cumberland said:

Oh, you're expecting things to pass the limit of shunt board. Yes, that does make things a little trickier.

It's not an expectation really, but just like on the 12":1' railway I've built in a run off/ trap. Just in case as its way more likely here!!

8 hours ago, Jeremy Cumberland said:

 

If you find that the Tortoise resets too soon with your track occupancy detector, then you could use two track occupancy detectors, one immediately after the other, with the right hand one providing a latching function. In terms of length and position, the left hand end of the left hand track circuit needs to be far enough away from the points for the Tortoise to motor them across before the train reaches them, and the right hand end of the right hand track circuit should be at the toe of the points. Both track circuits need to be at least as long as a coach wheelbase, but apart from that, it doesn't matter where you put the break between them.

 

The exact electrical configuration depends on whether you can get a 3PDT relay for the Tortoise, but you'll also need a relay (an SPST NO is all that is needed, but you may find a DPST NO easier to get hold of) to go with the right hand track circuit.

 

The idea is that the Tortoise relay is set by the left hand track circuit and is latched by the right hand track circuit. If you can get a 3PDT relay for the Tortoise, you want two feeds to the relay coil (just solder two wires to the same pin). One is from the left hand track occupancy detector. The other comes from the 12V power supply, passes through a spare NO contact in the Tortoise relay, and through an NO contact in the right hand track circuit relay. All the time that either the left hand track circuit is occupied, or that the point is already set and the right hand track circuit is occupied, the point will be set for normal running. However, simply occupying the right hand track circuit if the point isn't set for a train won't do anything.

 

If you can't get a 3PDT relay, then you can use a DPDT relay for the Tortoise, and have a DPST NO as a latching relay (as well as the SPST NO or DPST NO relay for the right hand track circuit). Have two feeds to the latching relay coil, one from the left hand track occupancy detector and the other from the 12V power supply, via an NO contact in the latching relay and an NO contact in the right hand track circuit relay. Then use the second NO contact in the latching relay to power the Tortoise DPDT relay coil.

 

As far as I can see, you can't use commercially-available latching relays because you will have times when set and reset will be powered at the same time.

 

The only thing I am a little unsure of is whether the left hand track occupancy detector can cope with the output being back-fed from the latching circuit. You can completely separate it electrically by having another relay, so that instead of taking a feed directly from the track occupancy detector to the latching relay or 3PDT Tortoise relay, you take it from an NO contact in the left hand track circuit relay.

I'm using Potter & Brumfield relays as in the attached picture. 

Graeme 

The headshunt on the rhs is by its nature bidirectional up to the LOS board.  The line from the lhs is unidirectional as indicated by the arrow (as far as the LOS board).

The point is set normal to the sand drag in case the LOS board is passed  from the headshunt end. 

What I'm trying to create is a situation whereby a train approaches from the lhs, the point reverses and resets to the sand drag after it has passed.

I have thought about that. The line is going to be solely used by EMUs, all of which have pick ups throughout. 

If the break was at the toe of the point, anything that had passed the LOS board would be either be derailed as the blades were mid move or it would carry on along the uni directional line which is what I was trying to avoid. Hence the break where it is. 

I have experimented with springs but have yet to find one strong enough to hold the point in the correct position yet allow relatively light vehicles to pass without derailing.

Hi!

My initial thoughts were that A would be a 'strike in' to activate the points and B a 'strike out' which would reset them after the last vehicle had passed  clear.

If I were to use  say a DCC Concepts 'intelligent detection' track occupancy detector as a TC on the trailing approach to the points and carefully cutting the rail very close to where the switch rail meets stock rail. This would allow the last vehicle sufficient time to clear the switch rail before the Tortoise motor reset the point again (in theory)......

Hopefully my drawing will help!

G

Ah, sorry! Here it is!!

What I have in mind is for the train to approach the point and pass over light sensitive diode A which will, via a relay activate the Tortoise motor to the points reverse position for the train to pass over it and once clear at B activate it to its normal position set for the sand drag.

The light sensitive diodes I have are 5mm 'photodiode photosensitive light sensitive diodes'

The distance between A and B is roughly 18" - roughly 6" before the point and 2" beyond it.

Hope this helps explain it better!

Thanks Graeme 

Good afternoon!

I would like to set up a bit of automation on a set of points powered by a Tortoise switch machine.

Basically, as the train approaches  in the trailing direction, it passes over a light sensitive diode which via a relay sets the point for the train. Once the train has passed clear, it passes over another light sensitive diode and the point resets itself.

I have uni directional line as far as a 'limit of shunt board' (from the lhs on the diagram), after which it becomes a headshunt. 

Can anyone assist with a wiring diagram please?

In anticipation! 

Thanks Graeme 

A refurbished 4CEP in NSE Kent Coast livery*, or if they haven't got round to tooling the TS yet, a 3CEP.

I possibly see why the 4TEP was done given the immediate availability of the buffet car, but the short lived  SWT 3CEP is a bit of a mystery......shooooorly one in NSE would have a greater sales potential,  after all they had a 10+ lifespan as 3 car units.

*see also LSE 'Jaffa Cake' livery

In anticipation 

Graeme 

2 hours ago, Flood said:

Length 520mm (approx 1'8.5"), 457mm (18") diameter head, oleo.

 

If modelling in 4mm, and not sprung, they are Lanarkshire Models pack BP06.

Thank you! All those years ago shunting the things, I really should know!

Ta, Graeme 

Hi,

Could anyone tell me what size buffers are fitted to BR air braked 4 wheel wagons (SPA/ZCA/OBA etc) please?

Thanks in advance, 

Graeme 

On 30/05/2023 at 20:36, Trains4U said:

Well, well, well...

As you probably know, we have an ever expanding range of military vehicles to complement our warflat wagons...
but our latest were possibly a bit too big to fit...



Well, the stowage boxes can be removed to keep in gauge, but why bother when they will happily sit on a Warwell!

Hatton's have very kindly agreed to extend their run of their OO warflat wagons to include two additional modern Warwell wagons, that will be exclusive to us at Trains4U.

These will be slightly more expensive than the Hatton's wagons at £27.50 each.  This is to cover additional artwork and sample costs as the production run is quite small

The wagons will be delivered to us as part of the main Hatton's run in early 2024.

 

Hi!

Would you consider producing a run of Warwell infills for AFVs etc. please? They would be very useful!

In anticipation, 

Graeme 

On 08/01/2023 at 15:08, Torbay Express said:

Nice looking renumber jobee.  What do you recommend then to remove the Numbers and Names?

Thank you! 

I used the time honoured t-cut and light rubbing with a cotton bud. Both the numbers and printed name came off with little effort. 

Conveniently Railtec Transfers do a sheet with 92009 on which was spot on for my chosen renumber. 

Regards 

Graeme 

Thank you David!

That's a great help 

Graeme 

Good evening!

In the process of renumbering, adding detail and fitting a decoder this bit  has come adrift and I can't work out from where!

Would anyone have any ideas please?

Thanks 

Graeme