olivegreen

Reading this because I, too, have had the Hattons e-mail cancelling my Bachmann Bulleid coaches pre-order.

For the modeller - the consumer - the background to the apparent dispute is irrelevant, he simply exercises his right to order from another supplier.

But having seen the prices of current Bachmann coaches (pushing 80 notes each at full RRP), a price when (if) they are released in the order of £240 for a 3-coach set is eye-watering stuff.

Now, if Hattons are clear (for whatever reason) of commitments to Bachmann, how about them commissioning Bulleid 64' coaches? On recent experience, they'll be available long before any Bachmann ones are likely to be.

Just a thought...

Well I never, you've found one of my fots! Sadly I didn't get to take many of '35017' when she was in 'Dutch', always seemed to be in the wrong place at the wrong time, though I'll have a look & see what I might have tucked away in the vaults.

I was about to jump in and say that 35017 was Belgian so what was all this nonsense about 'Dutch' ?  .... then I read the thread properly.

A senior moment... sorry, I'm very much pre-TOPS  

I believe they are currently at the Drawing Office stage so a ways to go.

 

CKT

Indeed, but judging by recent performance of the two companies concerned I'd put money on the red box ones being on the shelves before the blue box ones!

Sadly, anyone contemplating a T14 wil have to continue paddling their own boat......

Indeed!  I have a Nu-Cast T14 kit that has been sitting in a cupboard for years...I'll have to start it one of these fine days!

(Version with full paddle covers and the hole for the key included)

851 arrived this morning. Perfect runner straight out of the box... it is a really impressive model - well done, Hornby.

Now, where can I get finely-etched smoke deflectors to add to it?

Mike

Is kmrc at btconnect dot com the best place to send comment?  (The current CADs are still a disaster zone.)

'A disaster zone'.  Hmm… are we talking of a populated area after the passage of a hurricane or of the early stages of development of a non-essential, therefore luxury, model for the 'richer' end of the model and toy market?

Just wondered….

Nature doing its worst again https://twitter.com/DrLucyHawkes/status/1060993605182111746

…as the ill-informed discussion on Twitter continued, counsel for the defence interjected, 'M'lud, I refer the court to my previous statement in post 5316 of this thread', then retired to a small, dark room for the rest of the weekend.

 

 

My saga segments take some time to prepare, because my ADSL is glacially slow at uploading pics. 

You have my deepest sympathy.  

When I moved from rural Maine-et-Loire (commune of about 400 inhabitants) to what is in broad terms 'suburban' St Malo (general area well over 50,000 inhabitants) I expected to catapult into the modern age and have an ADSL that was actually worthy of the name.

Wrong. 

The ping test shows that a carrier pigeon would probably be faster for much of the day. Uploading anything bigger than about a megawhatnot?  I set it going and take the dogs for a walk.

Mike

Wonderful story and photos - thank you for sharing them.

As for the 'package tour' element, with all its herded nastiness...I shudder at the thought!

Mike

It is very interesting to read this thread but I find it sad that the significant differences between rail travel in Europe in general (rather than just in the UK, which is what the OP writes of) and rail travel in, say, Australia, the USA and New Zealand, are being lost in the arguments about detail. 

I will generalise a little: in Europe, rail is heavily used for essential day-to-day travel, not just in, around and between urban areas but also throughout the whole extent of the countries concerned as well as for tourist travel 'for leisure', as one might call it. I know more about New Zealand than the other two countries mentioned above but would suggest that in all three (and doubtless many others, too) urban rail travel is well used (albeit in NZ only in the rather limited Auckland and Wellington suburban areas), whilst inter-urban and long distance rail travel is pretty much limited, as has been said, to leisure travel only. (OK, some parts of the USA might claim exception to this generalisation...). 

I fear apples are being compared with oranges.

The one-offs and rarities have great appeal to the collecting fraternity who, in commercial terms, are at least as important as those of us who take models out of their boxes and use them, with or without alteration. 

 

As for Mr Drummond's Car (as it was officially known), I followed my conscientious approach of only voting for items I would actually buy so yes, I did click on it, even though I would have to apply a hefty dose of Rule One to excuse running it.  

 

Making it work should be quite simple. Lack of adhesion won't be an issue because, prototypically, it'll never need to move more than itself. A Black Beetle under the coach portion sufficed more than adequately on a kit-built example (Jidenco?) that I once observed.

 

John

All your points taken, John. My comment was merely meant as an observation, of course.

I (like you, I strongly suspect) am a 'user', not a 'collector', so did not vote for the Car as I could not conceive of using it! On the other hand, I admit to voting for some of what I referred to as exotica - the Adams 0395, for example, as it was long-lived, did not look much like anything else (opinion!)  and I would probably buy a couple. Not the least reason being that the Falcon Brass version as built by me does not really stand up to close...or even distant...analysis!

Mike

Thanks for the information, Graham. Poll duly completed with what I hope are at least realistic aspirations!

At the risk of sounding negative (which I never mean to be), there does seem to me to be a lot of unrealistic exotica in the lists of all companies and eras, and of one-offs, which are never likely to be taken up by RTR manufacturers.  In the SR context, Drummond's Bug would be an extreme example of this: I'm not sure how this could be made to work reliably to RTR expectations and the interest in it, apart from the pure novelty factor, would be limited! Many of the lesser-known pre-grouping locos - despite the repeated calls for such items - might fall into the same category aided, no doubt, by the non-Southern/LSW/LBSC/SEC infidels who would say that most of them all look the same anyway!!

Mike

Indeed it is, so it is nowhere near Dawlish.

And nothing to do with the sea wall, of course, despite the press attaching the story to the sea wall collapse of a while ago.

Once again the press at its disingenuous best!

Agree your point about real prices to pay as distinct from cover prices - like you, I paid just over £21 for this book.

I agree also about the publicity photos of the apparently real cover, which is rather why I feel piqued about being conned over the supposed content. It is that, rather than any question of value for money which upsets me!

Mike

Alert to misrepresentation!

This morning I received my copy of Vol 5 of the Pullman series, which is advertised (with a picture of the cover) in most places, including on Crécy's own web site, as 'Golden Arrow and Ocean Liner  Express Pullmans Trains'.

The actual cover as received shows 'Golden Arrow' only, and indeed the book only covers that train - there is nothing whatsoever in it about other ocean liner pullman trains. Moreover, at the back of the book (on page 224) there is an advertisement for Volume 6, said to be in preparation for 2019, to cover 'The Ocean Liner Express Pullman Trains'.

Caveat emptor - Volume 5 is NOT what the advertising leads you to believe it is. If you are expecting information about, say, Southampton-bound ocean liner pullmans, forget it. I have, of course, represented this directly to Crécy as well as to the bookseller from whom I bought my copy.

That said, if you accept that the book is only about the Golden Arrow, then you will probably be happy (despite the hefty cover price), even though some of the technical detail of the carriages has already been covered in previous volumes (2 and 3 in particular). There are masses of pictures and a lot of information in Vol 5, for sure, but I do get the impression that it has been 'padded out' somewhat by more trivial matter than in previous volumes. Makes one wonder what the advertised Vol 6 will be like in reality if and when it appears.

Very naughty, Crécy Publications. I feel a public correction would be in order.

(Edited for typos)

Mike.

I select OO for Oxford items and got OO plus O gauge plus N gauge. It was funny at first seeing the same OO gauge Landrover model with 3 different prices £14-50, £4-50, £2-50 until I figured out that the filter had not worked.

 

To be honest, Hattons current (old) site was for me the best out there. A joy to visit and research. Rail's site is right pain to use.

 

After toying with the New Hattons site, the old is much clearer and easier to use. This thing looks like most cloud tech based rubbish we have now where the user experience is at the bottom of the list of IT priorities. Good job today's IT people don't design cars. They would put the steering wheel in the boot.

I have just encountered the same things that have already been mentioned, though I acknowledge that the site is in its infancy...PLEASE do not ditch the old one before the new one is working properly, though.

Agree JSpencer's comments highlighted in red!

Try Paris Montparnasse in the peaks. Loads of push-pull suburban trains, and the peak-hour TERs to Le Mans via Chartres tend to be loco hauled. This is now my preferred route to and from Paris, with very comfortable 80s loco-hauled stock. I join at La Ferté Bernard.

Off topic, I know, but I agree with you entirely regarding comfort, and the wise traveller in France who is not in a hurry might take note of the fact that Corail stock is by far more comfortable than anything more modern - especially the TGVs in their various forms!

When I lived near Saumur, and was not pressed for time, I would take the direct service to Paris Austerlitz, in preference to the TGV to Montparnasse, because of its refurbished Corail carriages, which must surely have about the most comfortable seats of any current European stock. Three other advantages at the time: it avoided a change in Tours or St Pierre des Corps and the fare was significantly cheaper than on the TGV...which led to the third, that travelling first class was an even more comfortable experience.

It did take twice as long to reach Paris, though, having to reverse if it went via Orléans, rather than just St Aubrais.

For the uninitiated, both Orléans and Tours suffer from very awkward geometries as a result of their railway histories as 'terminal' cities that became both terminal and through routes, which mean that through trains via both - to Angers and Nantes, for example - have either to miss the city centre stations or reverse in each of them.

I can't promise it'll be perfect but it has better functionality.

Someone may have said this already (if so, my apologies) but I implore you and the design team not to presume that everyone has a smart telephone and design changes to the site (those discussed here, or any others, for that matter) around that presumption. Too many web designers today do that, which makes their sites difficult, if not impossible, to use on a normal computer.

Just a little plea!

Mike.

Is that tube on the LHS where the key goes?

 

Mike.

Interesting: was it a Drummond design originally, like the T14, which could explain the keyhole?

Coat, hat etc.

The title doesn't actually make any mention of the word 'Maunsell' ........ so perhaps the OP is leaving the topic open for the possibility of other restaurant coaches* - such as a decent LMS one ??!?

 

* Perhaps the OP could revise the title to Restaurant Cars ?

Point taken - I stand corrected !!

My SR version arrived this morning and despite the lack of lining (like many, I would have preferred a lined version) it is certainly a fine model. I think most that can be said about the livery has been said already but if, as it seems, Hornby have taken the livery from plate 100 on page 93 of Mike King's book, it is undoubtedly correct, even to the writing being in yellow, rather than gilt, and the heavier block lettering used in that period (cf. photo of earlier livery on page 65 of Gould).

On the subject of the panel beading, comparing it with my open third it feels finer on the restaurant car under my engineer's finger, but then the open third beading has rivets, which distorts the impression a bit. That said, even allowing for light effects on photography, vertical (at least) beading is almost invisible in the photos mentioned above!

In any event, the presence of beading is not a reason not to have lining - since the open third has it over its beading, and very successfully, too.

Mike.

PS:  Since they are unquestionably with us now, I wonder if the OP could remove the question mark in the title of this thread?  (!!!)

I do wonder whether the Hornby message omitted the all-important detail "at a price the market would be perceived to bear".

 

Restaurant cars are, after all, not everyone's cup of tea (sorry) since many of us struggle to run more than a very short train in our limited space layout. Thus the market is limited anyway. So, if adding lining to this particular vehicle has the effect of pushing the price up beyond, say, £70, this might reasonably be expected by Hornby to be more than the market will pay. And Hornby is not currently looking for slow-sellers. 

Agree what you say, but then Hornby still have a re-run of the pullman observation car (for release this autumn, they say) at a penny short of £75, which by the same logic is neither suited to a small layout nor likely to be a fast seller. That said, when I see the prices that are being sought for second hand ones - a staggering £100 - they might be on to a (minor) winner!

No, Dave, don't do it.

It would make you a hostage to fortune in these days where everyone feels he has the right to say anything to anyone. You'll be well aware of the commercial principle by which for every one positive comment, report or element of feedback, there are many more negative ones. I'm not thinking here of controlling the news, as is suggested above, but the simple pragmatism of not creating something which, later, you may not be able to control—certainly from the point of your image and customer confidence.

Interesting to read that certain Chinese factories are 'discontinuing business' for US customers — a very small rattle being thrown out of the cot as a result of the US/Sino trade war that has been declared, one wonders?

The world moves in mysterious ways.

I wonder if there is a commercial opportunity here for one of the well-known and respected transfer companies to produce a special-to-type sheet of lining for the SR version of the restaurant coach (among others)?  I appreciate the lining would be very fine and therefore highly fragile, but not beyond the bounds of possibility, perhaps. Who knows?