JamesSpooner

4 hours ago, Keith Turbutt said:

 

I was sorry to have lost out on the DJH 84xxx that Tony had for sale. It would have been a nice addition to my 'collection' of BR Standards. I only need an 84xxx and 77xxx to have an example of each one - I do however have both DJH kits to build! It's strange that Bachmann did not capitalised on their existing products . For example they produced an Ivatt 2MT 2-6-0 but did not take the opportunity to produce the equivalent Standard 78xxx which would have only required new loco and tender bodies. It was left to Hornby to produce it.  Similarly Bachmann's Ivatt 2-6-2T could, with a new body become an 84xxx and their BR Std 4 2-6-0 could, again with a new body, become a Std 3 2-6-0 77xxx.

 

While on the subject of the 84xxx class, I believe in the 60s they were being considered for use on the IOW as replacements for the ageing 02s. I saw this one at Eastleigh in Jan 66 on the occasion of the LCGB S15 farewell railtour, which included an Eastleigh shed and works visit. This never happened however, the IOW Steam Railway in preservation now run the similar Ivatt on their line - I think they may even have two?  

 

They do indeed and I took a photo last September.

Nigel

16 minutes ago, PMP said:

As far as I’m aware the Tortoise isn’t being replaced, it’s still a standard Circuitron product. As Jol points out the Smail is DCC ready, but can also be used on DC. 
The Cobalt point motors have a good reputation in both DC/DCC versions and are smaller. I’ve yet to try one though.

As my Fulgurex motors have failed (some are thirty five years old) I have been replacing them with DC Cobalts and I haven’t had a problem with one yet.  In the fiddle yard I was lazier and started with some cheap H&M SM3s off eBay, replaced a few with SEEP but couldn’t get on with them so have converted the whole area to Peco and they have also been very reliable.

Nigel

58 minutes ago, Northmoor said:

It looks like an almost perfect recreation of Lavenham, complete with identical track plan.  Compare with the third photo on its Disused Stations page:

http://disused-stations.org.uk/l/lavenham/index.shtml 

Yes, well spotted!  It is very heavily based on Lavenham.  There are some differences as Lavenham was very short on headshunts and long on bollards and ground signal protection equipment for shunting with horses and chains.  I tweaked it to enable a J15 to shunt with three wagons and so changed the name to Elmham Market to save any embarrassment!
 

Nigel

Just now, St Enodoc said:

 

See:

 

http://www.minsocam.org/msa/collectors_corner/article/mohs.htm

I’m quite happy to be proved wrong!
 

Nigel

11 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Thanks Andy,

 

Then shouldn't it be Moh's hardness scale?

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

Surely if the surname has an s at the end of the word, then the possessive apostrophe has to go after that letter?  If I think of St James’s Square in London, James is treated as a name in its own right, but an apostrophe and additional s are added on.  I accept in pronunciation there might be some difficulty, but in the case of the aforementioned square the last s is almost treated as silent.

Nigel

10 hours ago, Blandford1969 said:

Lavenham ?

Based on it but renamed Elmham Market as I tweaked the headshunts to make it shuntable by locos without chains or horses…

7 minutes ago, Tony Wright said:

Good evening Nigel,

 

I think Semley is one of the finest model railways ever made. I've never seen it in the flesh, but the photographic evidence shows it to be outstanding. 

 

However, and I'm certainly not belittling it, because the standards achieved are in a different universe to any I might inhabit, it's nothing I could ever aspire to, and it's not one of the Class one steam-outline layouts I was talking about. No one alive, of course, will ever remember seeing the prototype in 1912, not even many spectators' children, but I do remember the SW main line in steam days. Not, of course, displaying the pre-Grouping grandeur, but a Bulleid Pacific bucketing through Basingstoke, regulator in the roof, whistle screaming and 14/15 heavy bogies clattering behind. Or, the same thing in the closer intimacy of Winchester station, or Whitchurch, or........ 

 

All of this means multi-wheeled, really big engines, whirling outside valve gear (on the rebuilds) and 500 tons of heavy-metal at well over a mile a minute! I admit, the innate trainspotter in me leans towards this (personally-witnessed) scenario, and, I accept, it's not for all. 

 

So, with the admitted qualification, where are the big P4 steam-outline layouts depicting what I've just described? I really hope they exist........

 

Regards,

 

Tony

Good evening Tony,

Obviously, being set in 1912, Semley doesn’t have Bulleid Pacific’s, but it does have six coupled outside Walschaerts valve gear (with fully working rocking levers) express locos (in the form of the Drummond paddle box) hauling ten or a dozen coaches at speed.  I do totally sympathise with your comments on the layout sitting in a totally different universe from that which most of us inhabit.  Awe inspiring to watch though.

regards

Nigel

2 hours ago, Tony Wright said:

Good evening John,

 

Very impressive running - thanks for showing us; my compliments.

 

I'd love to see an A4 with 15 on, running at very high speed over P4 trackwork. I'd never suggest for one minute it can't be done, but until I see it (and not just one A4 - Bytham has 15 - but at least another 50 big ECML express passenger steam-outline types), then my jury's out. I've seen it done in EM several times (Retford, Carlisle and so on).

 

 

Retford - an early view.

 

 

And a much later one.

 

 

Carlisle from a few years ago.

 

 

And another Carlisle shot.

 

Both Retford and Carlisle are vast, prototype-based layouts in EM, representing steam days. 

 

Where are the P4 equivalents of these? 

 

One thing I would point out (and if I'm wrong, please shoot me down), in my experience good main line running in P4 can be easily (note the italics, please) achieved, but only if it's with diesel-/electric outline. Preston in P4, certainly, and Mostyn, but where are the P4 steam-outline equivalents? I say 'easily', because, believe it or not, I actually converted an RTR diesel (Bachmann) to P4 for a fellow club member by the simple expedient of taking out the original OO wheelsets and substituting P4 ones (Ultrascale, I think), all in less than an evening's work. I certainly don't have the requisite skills to do that with a steam-outline equivalent! 

 

 

 

Preston in P4 is certainly a prototype equivalent, but, at the time I took these pictures, it was electric-/diesel-outline in operation. I think the plan was eventually for steam-outline, and I'd love to know if this ever came to pass.

 

And.........

 

 

It's really rather easy to convert an RTR electric-outline loco to P4 (not my work). 

 

I know the debate is hackneyed now (Barry Ten has wise words), but, I must have photographed over a thousand layouts by now over the last 40 years, but I've never photographed a Class 1 main line in P4 which runs steam-outline. They surely must be out there, but maybe my 'prejudice' precludes the builders from asking me to take pictures...............

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

Tony,

I fully accept steam outline P4 main line layouts are rare, but they do exist.  It has been my privilege to visit Martin Finney’s Semley a couple of times.  It is an approximately forty foot long model of Semley station on the LSWR main line and is set in 1912.  Each visit a full day’s operation of that line, based on the working timetable, has been run and not only does it look magnificent but it runs beautifully too.  I am only a bodger in EM and could not aspire to model to such a standard, but can certainly appreciate the skill and effort that has gone into creating it.

Nigel

Ah, the Oxford comma.

Nigel

In terms of cheap, this was an old Airfix kit that I detailed and converted into one of the later Toad D’s which had the concrete weights added to each end…

Nigel

2 hours ago, St Enodoc said:

Fair enough but, as I understand it, one's executors are obliged by law to maximise the value of one's estate for the beneficiaries (no doubt one of our resident experts will tell me if that's wrong).

I think it depends on how the will is drafted.  If a dying spouse (husband) leaves his entire estate to his surviving spouse (wife) then all the executors have to do is ensure it is all transferred over to her.  It is then up to her to decide what to do with it all.  She can sell items, give them away or bin them…

Nigel

Well if we are talking of Trigger’s broom, Merddin Emrys is a good example.  Originally constructed at Boston Lodge in 1879, the boiler was built by Hunslet in 1969, the bogies date from about 2005, the tanks a similar date, the cab 1988, in fact probably the only original bits are the name plates….  Still the original engine though… 😊

Nigel

10 hours ago, micklner said:

GER Horsebox. Nothing else obvious.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/204428139690?hash=item2f98dddcaa:g:29IAAOSwuBNk2N7K&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAAsCZeIeHurl18pTXg2HltL0CYCSkon8856juEyaEfFoBjq3pqO6EUKB34kOoxN0D8OIbCx78%2FfJc9MO4Fq%2FJZj9Q2pj6dcxOyPugurCQd4Au8f5vlsZdnqMWGxRsoLVUg%2B7GgGcoIet4MNRqvNTJSqxZS2yOYtfl8uEVT02iERztbAtKm%2Fm9gNdOBAscUF2o5TvoLSzDeBKqpfk5%2F5MgUu1boHR5J5hlI4eGjYWKOT17c|tkp%3ABk9SR8Tg88_AYg

I have found that a polite call through to Dan (or a letter - not email) and being patient (he is now in his 80’s) generally gets good results as he still has a stock of 4mm kits.  I am currently making a GER push pull set, based on the Saffron Walden branch sets, from a D&S kit I bought from Dan last year.

Nigel

I’m not sure about NPCCS not being painted brown but Stratford certainly continued painting ex GER coaches in brown through the 1950’s.  There are several colour photos demonstrating that in the various East Anglian colour albums and I attach one taken by RC Riley at Cambridge in 1958.  Not sure about copyright rules so please respect that.

Nigel

Looking at the photos provided I can’t see any of the cab etches or the tender rear (amongst other things). Not to say they aren’t there, but they don’t show up in any of the photos so possibly only part of a kit anyway.

Nigel

3 hours ago, lezz01 said:

Have you tried the Dolgellau to Welshpool main road that's quite exciting! It's also a bit straight up and down as well. I had forgotten how exciting it was until I tried out a new way back from Porthmadog in May as I was fed up with the big dogleg going via Llangollen and Bala. So I did it via Dolgellau, Welshpool, Craven Arms and over Clee Hill to Kidderminster. It was shorter but not any quicker and a good deal more exciting!

Regards Lez.     

That’s my usual route back from Porthmadog to the south east (A470 then A458). Afficionados say the Tanat valley route is quicker back to Shrewsbury but I have too many friends who have rolled their cars on that road to feel comfortable with it.

Nigel

7 hours ago, billbedford said:

 

Just to add another thought. Coach brown was initially used for painting pre-grouping coaches that had carried a painted finish. So my thinking would be that it would have been close in tone to varnished teak, of course, teak darkened with age leaving a range of possibilities. Even so, the colour of teak would be the best starting point for working out an acceptable coach brown. 

I have been going through a number of my books with colour photos in them and I have a surprising number with ex GER carriages painted ‘Stratford brown’ in the 1950’s.  I don't disagree with anything that has been said on this subject before but would add that (and I also have to note here that 1950’s colour emulsions varied too) the colours of the carriage sides varied quite considerably so it would be entirely possible to have several carriages in a rake, allegedly all painted the same colour but, looking to the observer as though the tones were different.  That might be partly mixing, as has been observed before, or fading, as has also been observed, but, from a modeller’s perspective, the key point is that a range of colours can be used in a rake of carriages, and they all stand a good chance of being representative of the ‘real thing’.  In fact, it is likely that a totally uniform rake of carriages will not be representative.  Possibly the moral of the story is to match a colour to a photo and defy an onlooker to say it is wrong!

Nigel

13 hours ago, Bernard Lamb said:

There have been several kits available going back over several decades. Funny that nobody ever mentioned a lack of suitable wheels.

Why on earth should a manufacturer of RTR moels bother with the 5% or so of people who want to model to minority standards, who often cannot agree with each other and in this case have several types of wheel to select from depending on version and period. Accurascale are doing a brilliant job. I am sure they can sort the wheat from the chaff in respect of viable options. However i do think that it would be better if folk did not muddy the water with obscure fringe ideas. Do what people have done who are serious abot getting it right. Make or modify as required

Bernard

When I spoke to one of the Accurascale guys at Ally Pally about options on the Buckjumper he admitted to being a P4 modeller himself and said they would be in touch with wheel manufacturers to ease regauging to the wider gauges.

Nigel

13 hours ago, t-b-g said:

 

There were three parts to what Malcolm did. The first was to inlay rectangles of plasticard into the upper solid panels, which reduced the rather too deep effect. The second was to flush glaze and the third was to alter the roof profile. This he did simply by filing, as the plastic was thick enough to allow material to be removed without going through. It removed the bit of a "hump" that the Kirk roof has and made it more of a curvy shape.

 

None of it was very difficult or took very long but it made a decent difference. 

 

He also fitted nice corridor connections and added the alarm gear.

 

I always thought his glazing could have been a bit tidier and when I did the one for Roy, I made a rebate by adding strips of thin plastic along the vertical edges. That allowed the glazing to have a surface to sit against and I could make them slightly undersized and fit them with varnish, which gave a better look than the one Malcolm got. I have some of his carriages here and this is an example.

 

 

We LNER modellers and BR ones too, should be very grateful for these kits. They made modelling the LNER and ER so much more accessible when there was very little available for us. With a little bit of work they scrub up very nicely.

Tony,

Thank you very much! 
 

Nigel

7 hours ago, t-b-g said:

 

It was interesting to see how things changed in the locos, from being almost exclusively kit built, especially with regard to mechanisms. As RTR locos got better and we had a member of the team who made a bit of a name for himself as an EM converter of RTR (Pete Hill) the proportion of RTR gradually increased. Carriage and wagon stock was the same.

 

I wonder if the Kirk you mention was the one I did. Malcolm Crawley developed techniques to really improve them, enough to disguise the origin and allow them to fit in with more modern kits. There were one or two types that were covered by Kirk kits but not easily available from other sources and I recall "doing a job" on one for Roy using Malcolm's methods. Making the upper panelling look less heavy by filling in the recesses with thin plasticard, level and straight flush glazing and sorting out the roof profile made quite a difference.

 

Roy was much happier building in brass, so anything plastic is not likely to be by him. If it is scratchbuilt it is almost certainly by Geoff. Plastic kits are likely to be by other members of the gang. 

Tony, I would be really interested to hear more about Malcolm’s techniques for improving Kirk Gresley kits, given the range has just been taken over by Precision and may be restarted.

Nigel