Madreddog

49 minutes ago, johnd said:

Is there a posting where it is actually shown how to remove the roof on these models. Mine seem to not wanting to play along. 

Thx 

 

 

Roof removal at approx. 30:30.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KV5HpTSL2Zk

7 minutes ago, Paul H Vigor said:

'May contain pins' - Sounds like a model railway variation on Punji sticks?

Could also be a way of entering a secret society if you say Ow, eee, yow the correct way.... or maybe it summons the derailment elves????

Rails must think we're stupid and don't check the new price....

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/134336291996?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20180816085401%26meid%3D5443c03344be47199b3bc36b32e0cf18%26pid%3D100970%26rk%3D4%26rkt%3D6%26sd%3D164278741301%26itm%3D134336291996%26pmt%3D0%26noa%3D1%26pg%3D2380057%26brand%3DPECO&_trksid=p2380057.c100970.m5481&_trkparms=pageci%3Aac4ede84-7260-11ed-ba35-de34397b668b|parentrq%3Ad3ba2eca1840ab9e8772ef04fffd621c|iid%3A1

5 minutes ago, Colin_McLeod said:

 

If I refuse to buy Hornby would that be unfair on me too?   LOL 

The reason I, and many others, don't use Bookface is because of their information mining of personal data. I hate this and feel my personal information is none of their business.

Hattons have a major fault with their ordering system which I have encountered. It cannot cope with orders for low stock items where two (or more) people order the same item at the same time. One will be lucky and get the item in their trunk. The other will get a message that looks like the order has gone through. When you check the item isn't in your trunk and the order has vanished.

Just something to be aware of.

I think if a Metro tank were to be made it would have to be almost generic. There are so many variations it would be damn near impossible to settle on one unless... the last batch from 1899. Some from that batch that hobbled in to 1949. Others from the 1894 and 1892 batches also survived WW2.

https://brdatabase.info/locoqry.php?action=class&id=124052&type=S&page=fleet

There are a few surprises in the above list like some of the 1869 batch lasting until 1934. Still, some reading for you guys!

If you are going to use the mill I wouldn't use wood. The frames need to be clamped down very firmly especially if they're thin. If the cutter decides to snag you will bend them and cut material out you didn't mean to. Bolting to either a block of aluminium or steel with lots of clamping point is best.

Tooling needed; Quality milling chuck such as a Clarkson Autolock with it's collets (small version. Beware! they were made in three sizes!). Collets are in two sets of four (metric and imperial). Metric have a groove in the outside of the flange to distinguish them from imperial. You need to know what the spindle fitting is on your mill. I'm guessing MT2 but check first. Many small mills don't use a drawbar to retain the chuck and instead use a flange. It may be the case that you have to buy the original Emco chuck however.

Cutter; slot drill is probably the best option especially if it is a four or six flute. Don't get a two, this is more likely to bite and cause damage. Make sure it is HSS and is a good brand. Don't buy a cheap unbranded one!

To machine the item use lots of *very* thin cuts. Maybe 0.1~0.2mm at a time and go very, very slowly winding that handle. One wrong move and you might be buying a new set of frames!

Some of us refuse to use BookFace. Bit unfair that they exclude people by using that.

Entered!

3 hours ago, Legend said:

I have lost track, and attempted a quick scan on here to no avail, does anyone know when the LMS Crimson ones are due? I have them on order. Just checking they are not already out 

Just had a note through that some (LNWR in my case) have arrived ahead of schedule. Probably going to be a few days until they arrive given how many orders they have to deal with.

21 minutes ago, kevinlms said:

How good is that aluminium for conductivity for track? I was under the impression that aluminium oxide was virtually an insulator and wheels made from such a material (Stephen Poole), were virtually useless.

I think it would be a nightmare trying to keep 224 3 metre lengths clean. According to one supplier this could weigh 76 kilos. Peco code 100 is about 26 kilos. The more weight I add to the decks the stronger the scissor assemblies have to be. My maths isn't very good so I am a little reliant on what I call 'Holbrook Mode'*.

* Holbrook was a lathe manufacturer who made their machines insanely over-engineered. A lathe with the capacity of a Myford ML7 (two strong people can pick one of these up) made by Holbrook would be over a ton and built like a nuclear outhouse.

1 hour ago, wirey33 said:

 

I don't like to knock a man who obviously thinks out of the box, but thin wood and cheap track will not a make good bed fellows.

 

And a bit of thinking out of the box from me....how about routed grooves in an mdf board and copper tape applied to the sides and a little on the top surface? That would provide the electrical contact you require, over a long distance. You probably need to paint the mdf to provide a good surface for the tape to adhere to. 

 

Discuss...

The deck frames are aluminium ladders with the ply bolted to it, this is what the 700 drilled and tapped holes are for. It gives me a multitude of attachment points. Because it's thin the ply has no option but to obey and be flat!

MDF... weight and dust plus trying to use conductive tape in place of rails could be extremely problematic. One small wrinkle and you get a derailment in a difficult to get to place plus MDF doesn't, in my experience, ever have a nice edge post-cutting. Cutting the grooves is doable, I just need a router. I have suitable guide rails for my saw and the right adaptor for a router. Getting the grooves accurate means it would have to be done on the mill though. I wouldn't want to do that, it would make an awful mess. 

New wireless DC control system. Looks interesting and the perfect thing for larger layouts.

Introducing: Infinity - Model Railway Control [and beyond] | Gaugemaster (gaugemasterretail.com)

47 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

Please don’t denigrate people who might very well be reading this post. They couldn’t predict the future and made their choices.

Fair point but why would anyone pay £300 for a kit which retailed for £50-60 for which the tooling still exists? This is why I said 'silly' because at any point production could've restarted if C*opercraft weren't involved. The tooling is back with Slaters now. Some of the Midland coaches are back in production but not the Toplights or Clerestories as yet...give it time.

Moral is don't overpay for something where a new batch could be made even if you have to wait a while.

Have I ever seen an item and the must-win-at-all-costs mentality descends? Yes. What was the item? Motorcycle dealer's badge. What did I bid for the item? £101. What did I win it for? £6.50. Why did I want it so bad? Dad owns a motorcycle that was sold secondhand through that dealer in 1957. Both original badges on the bike had been polished to oblivion. Chances of finding another? Virtually zero.

Another vote for a heat gun here. If you have loads to do it's safer and you don't get the risk of fumes released from the plastic.

Have a look and see if they still make them for aero modellers. There used to be an Irvine branded one amongst others.

I'm sitting here sniggering at the silly people who were paying £300 for the Slaters kits on Ebay some time ago.

23 minutes ago, Nick C said:

Based on what's been shown above I'd definitely go for 2mm aluminium strip 'rails', screwed straight to the deck (which I assume will be MDF or ply). You'll get them cheaper by going to a proper metal supplier, which I assume you've already been dealing with anyway! Easy enough to make a few 16.5mm spacers to get them aligned correctly. Much easier then trying to lay flex straight...

Nice idea but 2mm aluminium isn't that easy to get. Most of the suppliers I have previously used don't go below an 1/8" (3.175mm) It would cost about £1700 for the 224 lengths needed.

Regarding the decks; they are to be 3.6mm ply to save as much weight as possible.

Seeing as they're making a number of 00 4-4-0's how about a LMS 2P?

This means, as we wait for their next announcement, we can say '2P or not 2P?'

I'll see myself out....

3 hours ago, DCB said:

 

Respect That is awesome engineering.  However.  How on earth are you going to raise and lower it?   Its like the 00 Nellyvator, great concept but don't work because the load on the deck is too heavy and getting enough travel on the lift system is a major hassle.   An 00 six deck unit with decks at 6" intervals will stand 66" high. 

Mine never left the scribbling stage , but was single track, around 9/10 feet long and 6 decks and I couldn't work out how to lift it quickly and accurately especially when not loaded evenly.   so plan B is the deck is a single track lift between levels, the deck the sides of an Aluminium ladder and I still haven't worked out how to lift and lower it.

Have a look at linear actuators with a pair of linear rails of sufficient length. The latter act as guide rails which, correctly attached, will prevent twisting. Regarding the actuators; you'll have to find one with enough travel and load capacity.

Secondary drive option would be a larger ballscrew but these can be a minefield. Most you see are cheap for a reason. These can be driven with a stepper motor. Ballscrews often come as a kit with bearing blocks and motor coupling.

Third drive option is a trapezoidal screw and nut. This is the strongest of the three but will have to be driven from a gearbox and a decent motor. This option does require a lathe to machine the ends of the screw and a mill to make the bearing blocks.

With all options there must be a safety interlock. You do not want a failure to send the whole lot crashing down. A door bolt each end operated by a servo would do this job.

I have also seen these lifted with cables. There was a video of one somewhere but I can't find it. It was in G scale I think.

3 minutes ago, D9020 Nimbus said:

Split chassis are widely used in N gauge models, though. Many of the Bachmann/Farish diesels have this type of mechanism.

I can see why. The majority of my N gauge stuff was made in Poole. I was having to clean the wheels and pickups often. Given how fiddly modern models are I wouldn't want to take them apart for servicing.

I would be interested to see a longevity comparison between the two systems of current collection on modern models.

Looks like this thread has taken the diversion to Bicker Central from Maddening Junction....

28 minutes ago, toby_tl10 said:

I don't know enough about split chassis, hopefully someone can enlighten me on that. I own a Rapido J70 and haven't had problems, and I believe others have reported it as a smooth and reliable runner.

The majority of manufacturers have gone over to wiper pickups because this doesn't suffer the problem that split chassis often do. Using axles with an insulation bush in the middle and having a chassis made in two halves also with insulating bushings is a very cheap way of making a model. This sounds good but the axles are now trying to do two things. What has always happened is that the conductive coating on the chassis halves wears out and then you get running problems. Some models got alot of use and it wore through the coating resulting in reliability problems in the long run.

It was used by Mainline whose tooling was inherited by Bachmann. They have been replacing split chassis models with wiper pickup versions.

Now we come to the unpleasant subject of DJ Models who also went down the split chassis route. It was pot luck if you got one that ran alright or not. Their reliability was not good... some failed after less than two years if you were lucky enough to find one that ran for that long. Many of these models are now being sold under the EFE Rail brand. I have no idea if they fixed some of the poor design choices made by the previous manufacturer.

Have Rapido solved the problems with split chassis? I don't know.

Raise and lower? I have to get my head around copying something like this;

This is where I have mostly come unstuck. It has to be welded together but, though I have had a bash at aluminium MIG welding, this needs high strength welding. Mine doesn't look bad but with the forces this might endure could cause a failure if they aren't 100%. The greater issue is that if they aren't 100% accurate binding and jamming could occur.

Problem two; my lathe has too smaller spindle bore to machine some of the parts needed. 31.75mm bore when I need 40mm.

48 minutes ago, H2O said:

Apologies, the site said 'track' so I thought it included the sleepers. Perhaps they should have listed it as 'rail'...

 

Good luck with your project by the way.

No problem, it was a good suggestion.

Quite a few have rightly pointed hunting at shows.... technical problem; I don't have a driving licence. My Dad used to take me to shows but he cannot drive anymore. It makes things much more difficult to get around when he can't be left on his own in case he falls.

24 minutes ago, Paul H Vigor said:

Big engineering - are you building a model railway or a Space Shuttle!? Doesn't 'look' as though money is any object? After all that work, 'spoil the ship for a ha’p’orth of tar' springs to mind?

I save up then buy a bit for the project. What you see in the pics was three years work/saving.

23 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

... or the OP has access to workshop facilities and materials professionally?

 

CJI.

Nope. Though I have a basic qualification I have never worked in engineering.

21 minutes ago, Paul H Vigor said:

Maybe. But after all that metal craftsmanship, why settle for rusting steel track?

I'm tight but not that tight. Steel track's only use is for derelict sidings where it adds a layer of realism!

46 minutes ago, H2O said:

I don't think you will find brand new track cheaper than £1.39 a metre in the link I posted above. Although SS is not as easy to solder as N/S the op seems to me a handy person when it comes to diy :-)

True but it doesn't come with sleepers. I know how to make a jig but making the track would take weeks. Time wouldn't be as issue but trying to solder stainless ain't easy.  Did you know DIY stands for Destroy It Yourself?