BrushVeteran

Here is my image of 31418 taken at Norwich in 1981. It does not have the high intensity headlamp and these weren't added until the buffer beam shrouds had been removed upon its Extra Heavy Overhaul as part of its life extension refurb later on.

A pub that I now enjoy when in London, The Southampton Arms, is not actually at a station but a five minute walk from Gospel Oak Station. Turn left outside the station and head up to the traffic lights, turn right on to Highgate Road and the Southampton Arms is on the right just before the railway overbridge. In fact the Gospel Oak to Barking line almost go's over the top of it.

A good 'spit and sawdust' real ale pub with normally 8 or 9 beers, plus unusual ciders all from independent breweries. Basic pork and hot cheese rolls are a speciality and occasionally someone walks in and 'tinkles the ivory's'. Good bus connections from Euston Road or West Hampstead.

I was first introduced to railways at a very early stage when my mother used to take me along the path that leads from West End Lane to Finchley road, along side Finchley and Frognal Station in North West London. We lived for five years until 1955 in a maisonette in Rosemont Road , off the Finchley Road and we had a back yard which had a wall leading to the embankment alongside the Midland Main Line just north of Haverstock Hill tunnels where I would stand a gaze at everything that went past. In the distance you could also see trains alighting the tunnel from Marylebone at Finchley Road as well as Bakerloo and Metropoiltan trains on a constant stream to and from Uxbridge, Amersham and Stanmore. If I craned my neck over the wall to the right I could also see freights and the regular Broad Street to Richmond electric Oerlikon units. 

My paternal grandfather was a staunch railwayman having started as an errand boy at Marylebone Goods Yard working for the GC, later as a goods guard. He did take me on a few visits, notably to the Exhibition of Locomotives & Rolling Stock at Willesden roundhouse in May 1954................I still have the programme and that was my introduction to BR diesels as a four year old............and the Fell!!  He also took me to the new Cricklewood East  diesel depot in 1962 where I was introduced to Alec Swain and Brian Haresnape which started my interest in railway photography. After we had been around the depot we were given a lift back to West Hampstead Midland station in almost brand new BRC&W/Sulzer type 2 D5403................a trip that I very much cherish.................hence Heljan's OO reincarnation of it a few years ago!

We moved to Oxford in 1955 where my father's work allowed me to enjoy casual trainspotting along the main Oxford to Banbury and Oxford to Bletchley line which were about half a mile away and Dad and I would cycle to. I was also interested in buses and City of Oxford's livery became my iconic magnet which eventually led me to a 41 year career on the buses! I would often go back to London in the early 1960's to visit all my relatives and that's when I first started to write down the numbers but only on diesels. Later visits to Oxford Station when steam was nearly at an end would see me banished to the other end of the platforms as I sought to cop my beloved diesels!..........and I am not joking, the ex.GWR steam enthusiasts took their loss very hard and gave me a hard time as well. I took up colour slide photography in early 1964 and spent all my pocket money on film but I think it was worthwhile judging from some of the complimentary comments I receive from my Brush Veteran flickr site. My enthusiasm and respect for Brush Type 2's, Class 30/31's, prompted many visits to Stratford where I was allowed to roam and photograph with much encouragement from the local depot management.............. but  I think it was the Triang models that started me off on that one but look at what we are about to receive...........never had it so good! Visits to Liverpool St., Finsbury Park and Kings Cross always followed and I was never disappointed!

I briefly gave up collecting numbers when the TOPs renumbering started as I really didn't want to start again but I did and got involved with monthly depot visits with the railway interest section of our work sports and social club where I would often drive the coach on part of the journey. I do not train spot any more having given that up in 2002 when the last regular class 47 duties came to an end around Oxford. My spare time includes restoring former Oxford buses...........I own six and part own a further three............ recording the Oxford Bus fleet history and also I participate in a bit of consultancy work, some with a model railway manufacturer. I have a large model railway layout in my loft with far more stock than I will ever need or use. Why do we buy so much.............and I think I know the answer to that...........and so do todays manufacturers! I can't really drum up any enthusiasm for the modern railway scene but I do respect it and travel on it when I can get a seat!

I think I have diesel in my veins amongst some of the real ale! .............and yes I do have some ancient images to show you all!

First Picture image me in my mothers arms copping a B1 on a North London line freight in 1952.

Second image shows me a 3 years old watching the shunting by West Hampstead Midland Finchley Road signal box. 

Third image shows me at four years old watching a class 11? on an engineers train at the same location in 1954/5.

Forth image show me with my family at Banbury Road Oxford signal box with a K1 heading towards Bletchley.

Fifth image shows me at 15 striding down Oxford's down platform to photograph D5858 on a York-Bournemouth southbound working in September 1965.

Sixth image shows D5502 crossing the Midland main line at West Hampstead as it proceeds to Acton along the North London line.

Seventh image shows 5504 passing Finchley & Frognal signal box on a westbound North London line freight. I spent many a time in that signal box listening to the horn blasts so that the bobby knew where the train was heading!

Eighth image show D5500, the pioneer, at Liverpool St.

Ninth image shows D5681 outside Oxford MPD awaiting the northbound return Bournemouth-York in 1965

17 hours ago, BrushVeteran said:

If I may politely inform you that it should feature a louvred engine room external access door on each side. This was modified on all the 'toffee apple' pilot scheme EE engine conversions D5500-19, including D5518 which became 31101, upon changing from Class 30 to Class 31 during 1968-9 when they also received their first rail blue repaints. I have attached images to help.

I have also noticed that the depicted model has Mirrlees exhaust ports which are incorrect as my images show.

8 hours ago, Fredo said:

Hi,

Will the model of D5617 suitable to be renumbered as D5631 or are there any differences?
Thanks Fred

The forthcoming model by Bachmann of D5617 would be suitable for renumbering as D5631.

If I may politely inform you that it should feature a louvred engine room external access door on each side. This was modified on all the 'toffee apple' pilot scheme EE engine conversions D5500-19, including D5518 which became 31101, upon changing from Class 30 to Class 31 during 1968-9 when they also received their first rail blue repaints. I have attached images to help.

20 hours ago, stovepipe said:

 

I have noted a few additional 'GFYE Arrows' to your list - D5517,5521,5568,5603,5608,5613,5619,5628,5648,5652,5653,5662,5670,5688,5800,5802,5809. So 79 examples in all.

 

For the GFYE with Crest style I have 121 examples, and for the early BFYE (4 bodyside D numbers) I have 62 examples. Still 14 locos unaccounted for. Not sure why I started on this, but I suspect Russell Saxton's postings might have planted a seed!

As this thread has expanded somewhat I thought I would add to Stovepipe's comment regarding GFYE/BR Crest and Blue FYE cab logo's at both ends variations. These are based on my photographic evidence as originally modified but I would add that the D prefix was in most cases obliterated/painted out at an early stage.

BR Green with crest FYE :- D5522; 5523; D5524-5; D5527; D5531-2; D5534; 5536; D5537; D5540; D5544; D5547; D5551-3; D5555-8; 5559; D5560-3; D5565-8; D5571-83; D5585-92; D5594; D5596-8; D5600-3; 5604-5; D5607-8; 5609; D5611-3; 5614; D5615-6; 5617; D5618; 5619; D5620; 5622; D5623-6; 5627; 5629; 5631; D5632-7; 5638; 5640; D5641-2; D5644-5; D5648; D5650-6; D5661; 5664-5; 5667; D5669-72; D5674; D5676; D5678-81; D5683-4; 5685; D5687-9; D5691-5; D5697; 5698; D5800; 5801; 5803; 5805; D5806; 5809; 5811; D5812; D5814-5; 5817; D5820; D5822; D5828-9; D5834-5; 5842; D5856; D5860.

BR Blue with cab double arrow logo's each end :-5500-1; D5502; 5503-5; D5506; 5507-14; D5515; 5516-19*; 5521-2; 5525; 5528; D5529; 5530; D5531; 5532; D5533; 5535-6; D5538; 5539; D5542-5; 5546-7; 5549; D5550; 5552-5; 5558; 5560; 5563; D5564; 5568; 5570; 5572; 5574-6; D5578; 5580; 5582; 5585; 5587; 5593-5; 5597-8; D5599; 5603; 5607; 5610; D5612; 5615; 5621; 5624; D5628; D5630; 5634-5; D5636; D5639; D5641; 5642; 5646; D5649; 5650; 5652; 5654; D5658-9; D5666; D5670; 5671-6; 5675; 5679-80; 5684; 5686-7; D5696; 5697; D5804; 5817; 5825; D5830; 5831; D5832-3; D5836; 5837-8; D5839-41; D5844-5; 5846; D5847; 5848; D5849-50; 5851-2; D5853-7; 5858; D5859-62.  *5519 received a partial repaint at Stratford after sideswipe collision repairs and original style serif numbers were utilised on A side.

Any additions to these would be welcome.

On 02/02/2024 at 01:13, MidlandRed said:

I have D5662, 5665 and 5815 recorded as  syp with centre double arrows (from 1967/8 observations) - no photos unfortunately. Happy to be corrected on fye on these - but could they have had FYE added separately later. 
 

Im pretty sure D8237 (Liverpool St pet pilot) had double arrows (amongst other members of the class). 
 

@Halvarras as well as the varnished and re-logoed locos, there were quite a large number of class 30/31s put into blue livery in 1967/8 with the four arrows and inboard numbers (with Ds). Presumably the criteria Doncaster used was the general state of the paintwork? 
 

@russ p Accurascale are doing D5803 in green, FYE, central arrow logos - I sincerely hope so as I have one on pre-order!! However I’m not sure if you actually meant the green/four arrow logos? 

D8234 was the Liverpool St. pilot and had received a green repaint FYE and logos with block numbers (as per blue locos) , along with D8213; D8229; D8235; D8236; D8240 and D8243. D8231 received logos but retained serif numbers as did D8242 but this loco also retained SYP. D8243 later became ADB968000 retaining its logo's.

I understand Russell Saxton had a photo of 31294 in green livery. He and I collaborated on quite a few livery subjects and it would be shame if all of his extensive research was 'lost'. I do hope that someone may have his archive somewhere.

Class 31's that received interim overhauls with the re-engine programme and received re-varnished green paintwork/full yellow ends with double arrow centrally placed logo I have recorded as follows:- D5513 (serifed numbers); D5514; D5518; D5520; 5523; D5529; D5557 (logos on cabsides); D5561 (logos on cabsides); D5573; D5592; D5600; 5605; 5610; D5612; D5617; D5618; D5621; D5623; D5624; D5630; D5634; D5637; 5638; 5643; D5647; D5660; D5663; 5665; D5668; 5677; 5685; D5690; D5691; D5692; D5693; 5694; D5698; D5699; D5801, D5803; D5806; D5808; D5810; D5811; D5812; 5813; D5814; D5815; 5816; D5817; D5818; D5819; D5820; D5821; D5822; D5823; D5824; D5826; D5827; D5828; D5829; D5842; D5843. I have photographic evidence of the majority of these.

As I mentioned in a previous thread about Class 31's D5545; D5655-D5670 had 1600hp uprated Mirrlees engines and had an additional roof hatch covering a larger radiator header tank adjacent to the fan grille on A side No.1 end, which these engines carried after the equipment was removed on EE engine replacement. The panelled in additional roof hatch remained. I would also add that several of the D prefixed loco's in this list lost the prefix before blue livery was applied.

At some stage I will compile a similar list from my archives showing Green livery FYE retaining the BR crest, of which there were quite a few.

1 hour ago, russ p said:

 

Thanks for that, were 5557/61 headcode or disc locos

Both were headcode box versions.

The following numbered Class 30/31 received the small double arrow logo in place of the original BR crest whilst in BR Green SYP. Most if not all of these logos were applied whilst the EE re-engine progamme was being undertaken with many locos with existing superior green 'paintwork merely being 'touched up and varnished.

D5513, D5610, D5638, D5643, D5662, D5665, D5677, D5685, D5802, D5813, D5815, D5825, these are the only ones I have seen photographic evidence of.

22 minutes ago, osbornsmodels said:

I don't ever recall the livery on fleet #332 so what year was that applied? I don't think it sits well, do you? Nice to see a few background shots of the old Cowley Rd. garage side on.

332 was the first repaint into the two colour scheme in April 1970, the first vehicles actually receiving this livery fron new being the three diverted Bristol VR's from Southern Vectis also in April 1970. The first NBC poppy red repaints started in November 1972 so the two colour scheme was vert short-lived although 157 vehicles received it including five Bridgemasters.

The image I previously put up of 332 was after its repaint in preservation in 1983 so I have uploaded the 1970 images of 332 and 902.

A couple of Oxford's new Streetdeck Electroliners fleet. Ninety one of these will be coming in over the next year!

The Stagecoach Oxford City fleet will contribute fifty five ADL Electric E40EV's in a similar livery scheme!

18 hours ago, Mike_Walker said:

No doubt Graham Waring will be along with a selection.  In the meantime may I offer...

 

306, 306MFC, a 1962 AEC-PRV 'Bridgemaster' 2B3RA with Park Royal LD43/29F body at Gloucester Green bus station, Oxford.  1 July 1968

Well if you insist Mike!

A small selection of former City of Oxford buses that still exist today belonging to a small group of us known as Cherwell Bus Preservation Group. The AEC Regent V with Hants & Dorset fleetnames is in its former Provincial paint scheme and shows it back in its former home at Cowley Road bus depot upon arrival from H&D at Southampton in 1975................and it still isn't anywhere near finished yet having owned it now for almost fifty years! It was transferred to Gosport & Fareham (Provincial) in 1970. The liveries depicted show the eventual progression from the original tri-colour scheme to a short lived simplified two colour livery before NBC rec and white dominated the fleet. As a matter of interest there are still around thirty or so red buses running for Oxford Bus Company (the successor to City of Oxford Motor Services) in various permutations of red but these are due to disappear within the next few months as the all electric Streetdeck Electroliner fleet wipes out the last of the modern hybrid or plain diesel vehicles so I'm please to provide a representation of the old schemes.

I would like to echo what most people have already said and wish all Hattons staff a happy future, in particular Richard Davies and Dave Mylett who I dealt with during a couple of Heljan projects.

I have to admit that I was never a big user of Hattons preferring to patronise my local model shop, one of who's directors was a personal friend, but I did do a bit of a deal with Norman Hatton a couple of times when he was trying to thin down his shelves full of Hornby Dublo 'Presflo's'. At that time Christine was a mere teenager helping her Dad so perhaps she just wants to retire and enjoy life leaving the business and staff in happy circumstances and giving them more chance of a brighter future. I for one mourned the loss of the 'brown paper and string' a few years ago  so I hold with that as a lasting memory of Hattons.

You never know they may rise again in true 'scouse' fashion!

22 minutes ago, alexross42 said:

I have a related query that I hope someone can help with, I thought it better to add to this thread rather than start a new one...

 

I've recently acquired a few slides that have been produced by 'CCQ' and 'Modern Image Slides' but I cannot find any information about either company and suspect they may have ceased trading some years ago - if that is the case, what becomes of the copyright in this instance? If the stock/assets of the company are sold on to an individual or other business presumably the copyright goes with it?

Thanks,
Ross.

I may be able to help a little with this one.

CCQ originated Oxford and as far as I can remember their collection was sold to Ron White of Colour Rail.

The Modern Image Slides business was run by the late Tony Eastwood and he used material 'rented' from various photographers, including myself. He then sold the duplicate slides as part of his business. Before he sadly passed away he sold the majority of his master slides to Kevin Derrick of Strathwood fame. Several of my images have subsequently appeared in Strathwood publications by agreement but I still retain the original slides and therefore the copyright. If you are in any doubt as to the copyright on the M.I.S. slides then please PM me with the details of the slide and I may be able to confirm if it is one from my archive. Failing that you may care to look at Brush Veteran flickr site which has most of my early images on display. Hope this helps 

I had to provide a preserved double deck bus for the filmset of 'Shadowlands' starring Joss Ackland and Claire Bloom on a very cold and snowy January 1985 morning in Oxford's Longwall St. 

As usual there was a lot of standing around to do waiting to move things and I remember Mr Ackland's compassionate remarks regarding me keeping warm and even getting me a cup of tea from the nearby cafe that was hosting the film crew. Sad to hear of his passing but 1985 was nearly forty years ago so he had reached a very good finale!

If there is any exhibitor or trader looking for an extra pair of hands over the weekend then help maybe at hand. My son Adam, 24, has expressed interest in attending, as I will be there to help man another stand, and he would prefer to be kept busy helping. He has operated many layouts including Retford, Little Bytham, Grantham, Carlisle to name a few and also worked in our local model shop in Kidlington for a number of years. Please PM me if you need any help.

Grahame

4 hours ago, Halvarras said:

 

 

D6964 was one of the original ten dual-braked examples (D6959-68) and the air brake pipe is visible in this photo, supporting this being D6964. It appears to have a data panel on the far cabside. If the Flickr loco's 1972 date is correct then this photo must have been taken between early 1969 (when data panels began to appear en masse) and whenever it was painted blue in 1972. So, with D prefix too (the ER was efficient at painting these out although there were some long-lasting exceptions, e.g. D1103) and decent external condition under the dirt April 1969 seems about right. Definitely not 1979 though, we were well into TOPS by then and the last green 37 (37244 I think) had gone blue in October 1976. (D6964's neighbour, D6965, had become 37265 while still in green livery).

 

There was no need to cut the valance around the buffers, there were trim pieces either side of the buffer stocks that covered the square apertures - these are just visible in the view of 6964 in blue above. Some locos lost these in advance of the general 1980s valance cutting.

I should read what I type more carefully so yes I made a typo. The date is April 1970.

The date is correct but it may be 6964. I rescanned the slide earlier and it looks like there is a D prefix but the previous scan I have of it on my flickr site omits the D. Sorry for any confusion but it is the correct loco.

My offering of D6964 taken in April 1979 at Finchley Road and Frognal station on its way light engine to Willesdan yard.

Please excuse the slight blurring but my Instamatic 200 didn't like moving objects!

I would imagine the armature windings are probably life expired. I had this problem with two Wrenn shunters I once owner and managed to get replacement armatures at the time. However the magnets by then were also very weak so I sold them on. They do consume quite a lot of current so are probably at the top of their power limit.

I can distinctly remember BRCW Type 2's banking the Peaks out of St.Pancras, I used to watch them in there whilst my Uncle was obtaining my Grandad's monthly free coal ration from St.Pancras Goods!  Oh those were the good old days!

5 hours ago, Halvarras said:

 

I wonder what shade of grey paint was used to obliterate the white? Standard green Class 31s always seem to have had a fair amount of grey roof showing through the usual dirt/exhaust soot, unlike most classes, but D5578's roof in its 'post-white' condition always looks close to overall matt black - as in the photo above.

Well judging by these images, the first one of which is not mine and I will remove if the copyright owner insists, the roofs were all pretty much the same and ended up the least cleaned part of the loco. Washing plants were still virtually non-existent when this picture was taken and depots were still employing cleaners to hand clean diesel locomotives. I recall fresh grey paint being applied to one of Finsbury Park's Brush 2's  roof during a visit there in 1966.............mostly on top of the existing  filth!

I think you are pretty safe with standard roof grey of whatever shade and condition you wish to interpret!

45 minutes ago, Big_Bad_John said:

 

Cheers, did the blue one have a white/light grey roof?

Originally a blue roof until Stratford painted it white for a Royal duty, then reverted to grey until it received a standard green repaint in 1964.