Wicor Models

We are pleased to say we too have signed up and our first order has gone and should be with us sometime next week (w/e 03.11.2018).

Oh dear, looks like you want to kill off part of our hobby then.  I've recently bought two Hornby locos and that makes three this year so I wonder where I could have got them (including two WR outline) if comments like that had put both Hornby and/or my local model shop out of business.  Typical modern Britain - the race to the bottom in pricing leading to trash quality products and rubbish that sells because it's cheap or prices that are held because the contents are reduced in quantity or weight (a typical trick in the foods sector).  If you want a decent product and good retail service you have to pay for it - end of story.

 

As for artiificially keeping prices high I don't think Hornby are at all like Burberry because in historical terms Hornby's prices aren't really high in terms of teh additional bang you get for your buck after inflation.  And why on earth can't businesses make a profit?

I totally agree with your comments.  The current discount model is unsustainable and will probably kill shops and the hobby, or at the very least make it a niche hobby for the rich and famous.  I have run our shop for 25 years now and still don't understand why I have to give a percentage of my profit to a customer, especially today when costs are rising often faster than inflation, and I need my profit to run the shop and not to finance a lavish lifestyle.  Yes we discount to be competitive otherwise we probably wouldn't still be around but I believe everyone should be prepared to pay the true price, after all you don't expect to go to your favourite restaurant and ask for a discount so why should buying models be any different.   Profit is not a dirty word and is wholly necessary to run a business and the idea that lower prices means more profit doesn't work, certainly not in the long term.  As regards to the legality of requiring a maximum discount for 6 weeks that is pretty lenient compared to other areas of retail.  One of the shops in the village here is not allowed to discount more than a few per cent and if caught his account will be closed.

If the MIG paint is anything like Vallejo (it seems to come in much the same bottles) then it will be very good.

We turned down Valejo several years ago because the quality was no improvement on Tamiya that we stocked at the time.  MIG is superb and now Expo are the UK distributors should be more widely available.  If Hornby could produce a Humbrol acrylic of similar quality and with consistent supply then I would stock them again but you can't keep running out of matt black, silver and all the other popular colours, likewise with Hornby track we need a reliable supply of all their fast moving track items otherwise we have to offer a cheaper version made in England.

We sell more paint than you can shake a stick at - Our Humbrol stand is in the same state.  Some new paints are trickling through, but it really is in a sorry state.

 

Humbrol has always been our biggest selling line, but we introduced AMMO by Mig in April, and that is now close to overtaking Humbrol in sales volume.   Both availabilty and quality are better, and lots of modellers have converted, perhaps never to go back.

Like you Gareth we sell so much paint, even our Games Workshop rep can't believe how much of their paint we sell. and I can honestly say in the 25 years we have been trading the MIG paint range is one of the few products that have sold from the day we put the stand in.  We have had grown men almost in tears because we are now stocking MIG paints, powders, washes and textures.  We stopped Humbrol acrylics a couple of years ago as the supply was poor and the quality even poorer.  The Revell acrylics are really good and we've stocked them since their introduction some 12-15 years ago.

Just to put it into context, Bachmann announced the Brighton Atlantic in 2013 for delivery in 2015.  It is now 2018 and we may see it later this year that will be 5 years from announcement to delivery which is the same for the Birdcage coaches and, back in the day, the Southern N Class.

Don't panic Mr Mainwaring the models are coming!!  We just don't know when exactly.

A friend and I visited the shop today. After a good look round,seeing some good bargains that were on offer, my friend decided to buy a Hornby single chimney Castle. First of all the chap serving us tried to force it into the wrong box and then realising his error, found the correct one. In the process of putting the loco into its correct box, the chimney came off, which dropped onto the floor. After a cursory search, we were told that they didn't have time to continue as a Rep was due any time. I asked for their card, and said we were heading for a pub lunch, I would phone later to see if the chimney had been found. I did phone and got a very curt "no!"

Needless to say, neither my friend nor I will visit the shop again. I presume the man and the lady (his wife?) are the owners, who did not inspire any confidence at all. Certainly lacking in good manners and customer service. Everyone has a bad day from time to time, but I won't find out if that was a one off, as I will take my custom elsewhere.

 

Tod

I have just had this post pointed out to me and would like to take time to reply.  To begin with I'm very sorry if you felt our customer service was lacking.  I spend a lot of time with my staff working on ways to constantly improve our customer service as it is the face to face contact that gives the "bricks & mortar" shop the edge over internet stores.  Had I have seen this post earlier I would have been able to look at the CCTV tapes and see what went wrong and how we can improve to give even better service.  With regards to the incident the loco was placed, not forced, into the wrong box but upon realising my mistake I then located the correct box.  As I was putting the loco into the correct box I knocked the chimney off which disappeared under the counter.  As I have dropped coins and other items I know if I can't see them on the floor they can easily get lost amongst the items we have stacked beneath the counter which, as it proved, took two of us well over an hour to eventually locate the missing chimney, which we managed to do later in the day after the visit of 2 reps and many pre-Christmas customers.  once located I decided that I couldn't sell it as it was a damaged model I would use it for spares and put it in my scrap box.  I recall you trying to come behind the counter to look for yourself which is a definite no in any shop.  I doubt you got a cursory no but the answer when you phoned was no and however you dress no up it is still no.  I was made aware of your disappointment at not being able to buy this model and you will, no doubt, appreciate my disappointment at not being able to sell it to you.  I also remember you having a problem with the fact that I don't have a test track in the shop, your assertion that every other model shop has one and your suggestion of how it could run across the counter.  I am sorry that you feel unable to visit the shop again despite our attempts to help you make a purchase and your disappointment at not getting the model you wanted.

Dave

Isn't that the area that just has the internal user Army van instead of a loco?  Not seen much excitement about that on here!!!

Don't we have 47625 "City of Truro" too?

 

http://news.Bachmann.co.uk/2018/02/city-truro-class-47-sales-area-exclusive/

Yes we do!

I would be surprised if there was 100 to 150 retailers stocking Bachmann in the whole country.

 

And if there are, where are they? I can only think of about 10 in the North West.

 

 

 

 

Jason

There are at least 25 Bachmann stockists in Yorkshire alone, we're in Hampshire and here we have 8 Bachmann stockists and this is repeated throughout the country.  Our rep's area stretches from the South East right down to Cornwall and I believe he said he had one of the smaller areas but even so he had over 100 outlets.

Would the reps really have as many as 100-150 shops each on their patch? I'd be very surprised if it was as many as that

 

I really like the idea of the reps limited editions and think it a good thing to share amongst the shops smaller than those that can commission a full run of their own

Yes they would and possibly more in some areas.

How's that even possible but yes you're right and the ebayer seems to have a box load going by the photo which is a bit worrying considering only 1 is allowed per customer order.

You can still buy these between £131 to £155 from retailers depending where you go.

Some shops may have imposed a one per customer limit but it was not a Bachmann instruction.  We often see items on Ebay and have them in store considerably cheaper but unfortunately the thought process is "it's on Ebay therefore it's cheap".

If I were the Bachmann Rep I would be quite interested how this individual got hold of 6 units and subsequently selling on eBay for stupid prices in such quick time.

The Bachmann rep has no control over the product once it is bought by the retailer, the vendor may have gone to more than one shop to buy.  Also Bachmann cannot dictate the price a product is sold at, the only person who can is the purchaser, if nobody was willing to pay an inflated price then the price would have to come down but it seems that some people want an item so badly they are prepared to pay any price just to get it.

We have not been able to get Hornby points now for months, so in the end we resorted to breaking up clearance train sets and packaging the points out of those. Even those are running out now.

Alex

I don't know why you can't get Hornby points as they have been in stock for most of this year and we've had no problem with the supply of standard points and if we had we would have sold the customers Peco Setrack points as a suitable alternative.  Earlier this year Hornby express points were OOS but we had plenty of Bachmann ones which are cheaper and just as good.  I would have a word with your rep if you are still having a problem.

Our copies of Railway Modeller come direct from Peco and we have a distributor locally who delivers our copies of Hornby magazine.  I do not stock Railway Magazine Modeller and have eventually persuaded the publisher by refusing delivery and they are no longer sending it out to us.  Having said that our sales of magazines has dropped dramatically over the last two or three years and we now only sell about 12 of each a month.

Dave

Just wondering?

Do we know for sure that these new Hornby prices are taking into account the fall in the value of the pound....or is that another price rise to come?

 

 

Across the board, price rises are only slowly beginning to affect retail prices, as in a lot of cases, currency is purchased in advance by businesses.

In general, the effects on the high St. will be seen in the coming months, or early next year.

 

It is possible that the fall in the exchange rate is being applied here by Hornby, but if not yet affected, they could be raising their prices again by 15% or so, in the coming months.

 

I hope I'm wrong.

 

 

 

.

Copied and pasted from the email received from Hornby:

Pricing

We have not reviewed our overall Recommended Retail Pricing since January 2014, since which time we have managed to absorb increases in our cost base.  However, you will not be surprised to hear that, like many other businesses, we are currently facing higher costs as a direct result of the adverse exchange rate movements following the Brexit referendum decision.  Unfortunately, we can no longer absorb these cost increases, and are today announcing new prices, effective from Monday 10^th October.

I think we can conclude that this is a direct result of the referendum, and yes Ron, let's hope it's the last major rise for some time but.............

Dave

Today we were given the price lists which come into effect from Monday 10th October (next week). You are warned that there are some large increases in RRP on their way. Bachmann no longer stand alone on this front.

 

Changes to percentage margins, and a request for a low ceiling on the amount of discount we can offer mean that there is likely to be a large reduction in the amount of bargain prices around. Also, many of the basics across all the Hornby ranges where we have enjoyed a better margin in the past few years, have been brought into line, so increases will result here too, across the board.

 

The changes ahead are as a result of revised terms by Hornby, and are not the result of decisions taken by retailers. So please do not direct any negative thoughts on this to your retailer - this is beyond our control. Thank you.

Having looked through the new prices I am grateful that the increases are as low as they are, around 12 to 15%, the camera trade has endured 25% and more on their prices.  It still brings Hornby prices in below some of Bachmann's so while none us wanted this we should not be surprised after the referendum vote this year and the dramatic fall in the pound against the dollar.  I have just seen some of Trumpeter's prices for their plastic kits and the make Tamiya look cheap so this, I'm afraid, is the new order.

So has anyone actually got a 8 pin plugged decoder to fit? Seems to me that the angle of bunker as other as noted will prevent any 8 pin decoder being used. Really seems to be a loco that should have has a 6 pin socket if Hornby actually realised they existed, or possibly a Next 18 socket. The one good thing about this loco is that actually does not have miles of over long wires that Hornby normally seem to have fitted.

Simple answer - yes but......  It's not easy, I guess the engineer gave the dimensions of a standard Hornby R8249 decoder and the space in the bunker seemed made for it.  Nobody took into account the wiring harness.  I have now done 3 locos for customers and on all three I have cut all but the Red, Black, Grey and Orange wires out of the harness, unscrewed the socket from the chassis and lost as much of the harness as I can under the socket screwing back into place to trap the wires.  Then plug the decoder in and put the whole thing up into the body.  I read in one of the mags (Hornby?) that they had to use a DCC Concepts direct plug decoder so I am going to order a dozen shortly to ease the fitting problems, especially on my own version when it arrives.

Hattons are rearranging their web presence and eHattons is closing.  http://www.ehattons.com

 

As of 7th August the eHattons URL will be transitioned to the .co.uk URL which will become the only portal available.  Hattons are emailing eHattons users asking them to update their bookmarks.   The co.uk site was previously used in the main to sell in-stock items to UK buyers though could be used by anyone to order anything offered and at the same price as eHattons.

 

As I have had an ongoing issue with the eHattons site refusing to place items into the cart I have asked them (again) to look into this and confirm it will not be carried over in the transition.  I used co.uk as a back-up to place orders.  Hattons cannot replicate the problem so may I ask anyone here - specifically those of us who use a Mac and browse with Safari - to notify myself in the first instance via PM so that I can co-ordinate feedback to Hattons IT manager?  What is required is your location (town and country), the version of OSX and the version of Safari you are running.  Your real name is not required.  Anyone with the same problem using any other platform is also welcome to pass the information to myself first.  There is a possibility that multiple single emails to Hattons might not be co-ordinated.  I have evidence myself to show this to be the case as they claimed to be unaware of my multiple previous messages and conversations on the subject.  In my case the blue Add to Cart button darkens briefly when clicked but do not place anything into the cart; the View Cart link also shows the cart to be empty.

Rick, have you tried an alternative browser? Recent changes to eBay's checkout have caused me problems with Kaspersky's 'Safe Money' extension combined with either Google Chrome or Microsoft Edge, refusing to actually pass on my logins to eBay or PayPal.

 

Internet Explorer still works with 'Safe Money', so that has been my work-around for now. If that fails later (perhaps through updates), I will have to disable 'Safe Money' for the websites involved.

I'm with SRman on this, I am a Mac user and find Safari often doesn't work on some sites especially shopping carts and checkouts.  I tend to use Firefox mainly as it's 90%ish reliable and if that doesn't work I go to Chrome.  Unfortunately IE is no longer available for Mac.

Dave

10-05-16 Update.

 

Long time no speak on RM-Web without an update.

 

We keep growing instore / online and plenty of stock to choose from.

 

For those who cant make it in store check out our website - www.agrmodelrailwaystore.co.uk. Price beating big boys.... 

Well done Anthony, it's good to see that despite the doomsayers a new business in the world of model railways can not only survive but thrive.  We started in 1994 surrounded by prophecies of doom and disaster and here we are, 22 years on, still going and still able to match or even beat the so called big boys.

Dave

We are a very small seller, but with an account direct with Hornby, not with a wholesaler. Unless an email went astray, or I failed to read some small print somewhere, we did NOT receive this offer. I checked the recent Trade News bulletins they send and it's all about stuff that I couldn't possibly want in a million years, not about stuff that I might actually want.

 

For the sake of circulating an email to additional recipients at no further cost, they could have kept a few more people happy.

 

When they set up the new discount scheme we were told that the "big boys" did not get the extra 10% quarterly rebate over (I think) £40k. This was to give small shops an advantage. Perhaps this is how they level the playing field.

 

We only have "new tooling" releases on order with them now (Class 71, MN, B12, Peckett, Q6, coke hoppers), absolutely no way that we ever buy any reissue/relivery/renumber release (unless a direct customer request for minimum order of 2).

I don't know where your shop is so I don't know your rep but we certainly had an email from our rep with a list of discounted items recently.  We took the decision not to order anything from it mainl because we have existing stocks of the items on the list, apart from those items we would never sell in a month of Sundays (or any other day come to that).  We've also recently received another offer to coincide with the Toymaster show, but again this came directly from our rep not Hornby Sales.  As I have said before on this forum I can only speak for us as Wicor Models but having dealt with Hornby for the best part of 20 years we have never had any real problems or quibbles and if there has been an issue it has been dealt with promptly (except on one recent occasion but that is not for public consumption yet - too soon!).  We have been assured by our rep and his managers that the retail trade is an important part of Hornby's ongoing business plan and nothing that I have seen makes me think otherwise.  Despite some of the doomsayers above shops are a vital component in he UK economy and the percentage of internet sales is very small compared to shop sales nationally.

Red Mackay visited us a couple of years ago. He is the Supply Chain Director. Spent a lot of time with us, listened to us, acted on some of our suggestions and wrote to thank us for our time and input.

Dave

An open question for any of the retailers around here if I may.

 

When did you last see anyone above sales rep level?

Due to a lack of trade information, their new computer system means that for the time being, we do not have the information to which we traders have relied on so much in the past.

 

We know they have arrived at Hornby, but we have not had ours yet. We would expect them to arrive next week so that Hornby get them on to our August monthly account.

 

I too have tried to order more, but await confirmation that the order has been accepted, or rejected.

 

Sorry I can't been any more specific, but we retailers simply do not have the relevant information made available to us any more.

Hear, hear like you we have no idea when ours will arrive.  What's worse it seems some shops are getting supplies as usual and others not.  The new software and distribution system has fallen over big time as even in stock items like paint and glue ordered 6 weeks ago still haven't been delivered.  Let's hope this mess is sorted out well before Christmas.

Dave

Like Sawyer Models ours will also be arriving on Monday. Unfortunately I am away until Wednesday so they won't appear on the website before Wednesday morning. I can also confirm the LBSC version is not yet available.

Dave

Not for the first time, I am intrigued. Not about the tactics of Hornby or Bachmann, or Wonky Models Ltd for that matter, but by the enormous interest in this sort of locomotive. After all, RMwebbers, by and large, are well-informed people who know what ran where and when.

 

So, do I not like MNs? Fine locos in my view, and I saw them all, albeit most of them rebuilt by then, no doubt.

 

My confusion is caused by the very narrow sphere of operations of these locos. After all, their Route Availability meant they didn't really venture beyond Exeter, hardly saw Sussex in service, seldom slummed-it on a secondary route, still less a single line. They were heavy express locos, and that's that.

 

So, do all those enthusing here really have substantial main line layouts, on which an MN might look at home with 10 or more on the back? And, if not, wouldn't the Light Pacific be a more appropriate choice?

The Merchant Navy was classed as a mixed traffic loco as it was the only way Bulleid could persuade the wartime authorities to allow him to build it.

Indeed the annoying thing about these forums is that when a manufacturer does a cracker, it increases the risk of caving in and buying one.

 

This year alone, I have caved in  4 times so far for items I did not really want.

 

Mind you it was Hornby's promo video that made me switch the order from the full P2 to the TTS version. Should look well on my BR era southern layout....

I was thinking along exactly the same lines!!

Just a thought painted BR Green it might look like a Bulleid creation

So has anyone had their pre-order bumped up from say £76 to say £97?

Unfortunately the RRP is now £112.95 meaning that Bachmann's 15% rule makes the minimum price for this model £96, any less and we run a serious risk of losing our Bachmann account.

Dave