RogerE

A thought about layout height. As an ex-exhibition manager (well1989 was the last I managed) it is something I hadn't really thought about, but it is something I am now thinking about as a result of a conversation I had today.

I went to, the ever excellent, Railex, and understandably, considering where it was held, there were a few people in wheelchairs.

As I left I was accompanied by one who was "resident" of the National Spinal Injuries Unit. I got chatting to him and, unwisely, asked what he thought of the show - summarised by:

"A f****ing waste of time, most of time all I could see was black cloth".

We were joined on the trip to the overflow car park by a Dad with a 5 year old boy, who echoed his views, as they had to leave earlier than "Dad" had wanted because the youngster was fed-up with not being able to "watch the trains unless he was picked up by dad".

As I see it the only reason for building a cameo-type layout is to display it. If you are the only person who wants to see it them the optimum height is whatever you want it to be. If however you want to show it to others then you must remember you are showing it to an audience who will range in ages from 3 to 100 and have an eye height of, say 600mm to 1800mm, and for some of those the eye level can't change.

One thing about the Jim Snowdon book is that he worked(*) for LT, and had full access to the drawing office archive, so would be happy to assume that where they differ from the Huntley drawings the Snowdon ones are probably more accurate. His drawings of the Ashbury stock are pretty well spot on, and were used by Clive Thomas when he produced the etched brass Chesham stock that is now marketed by John Redrup's London Road Models.

(*)I haven't seen him since before the book was published so don't know if he still works for LT.

Changing the subject slightly - do we know when Radley will be releasing the other Dreadnoughts in resin?

Just had a look at the Radley site.

At present it looks like the 6 compartment brake is the only resin body kit currently available, the rest look like the original white metal ones.

Will these all be eventually replaced with resin bodied ones, as the white metal bodied ones are too heavy to run as a 5 car rake?

I can see a couple of 5 car sets being purchased - need to start saving...

All that is then needed is Galtea and/or Mayflower (and a H class loco of course)!

Due to arrive 6th October

Was that taken, by any chance, at  Metropolis (Ward Jones) in Cryers Hill?

They specialis in restoring and servicing old buses (they are looking after a RF and RML that I have an "interest" in)

Yes you are right - I missed one because I was organising a model railway exhibition, with a Met. theme, at Chesham the first weekend, and missed the second weekend because I had to work!

Everyone seems to have forgotten that steam rained supreme on the Chesham branch one weekend in July 1989 (the Chesham centenary celebration).

Ok it was 9466 and Sarah (I seem to remember Met 1 failed, but was due to take part)

They cannot be nine compartment then.

The 3rd class  Dreadnoughts were the first nine compartment coaches on the Met. Later when all coaches became 3rd class the ex-1st class Dreadnoughts, which were 7 compartment, became the coaches of choice for those that knew about them, because of the extra leg room.

The Bogie (Ashbury) stock, except for the brakes, were either 6 compartment (1st class and 1st/3rd compo) or 7 compartment (2nd class, 3rd class). The 2nd and 3rd class brakes were originally 5 compartment.

For electrification the brakes were converted to either 7 compartment 3rds or to 4 compartment motor coaches.

There appears to be a mix-up in terminology.

What are generally known as Ashbury Stock were officially Bogie Stock, as they were Metropolitan's first non-rigid coaches. Subsequent coaching stock were all fitted with bogies, but were known as Main Line Stock, but unofficially were called Dreadnoughts.

If Radley are producing post 1940 stock, and based on the description in Lord of Narnia's post, they are likely to be MV or MW stock, which were derived from the Dreadnoughts. This would make sense based on the Dreadnoughts Radley already produce.

The London Road kits were originally designed by Clive Thomas for a projected model of Chesham. After a lot of badgering (from me) he had agreed to do the remaining steam era vehicles, but then a change of circumstances meant all this came to nought, and he departed to deepest Wales.

He passed the kits over to John Redrup (London Road) who originally sold the individual coaches, but then started selling them as complete rakes only.

Joe Brook-Smith used to produce moulded plasticard "body kits" of all the Ashburys (steam and Chesham modifications), although he produced them to order and never advertised them. I wonder what happened to them after his death?

The only other Ashburys I know of were produced by (I forget their name) who had a whole range of coach side/end kits in etched zinc. He produced them in batches, and you could wait years if you ordered them. I ordered the Met Inspection Saloon from him about 25 years ago after seeing some of the other coaches in his range, and, apart from a note saying it would take some time before they would be available, have never heard from him since!

<edit> Trevor Charlton produced the etched zinc kits

The reason there are four coaches is that there were 2 Chesham 3-set coaches, and the Bluebell aquired a complete set plus one!

<btw> My dad was responsible for them in the last 2 years before they were withdrawn from service in 1960. He could never get rid of the smell of rotten fish though!

These look good, well done.

Now could be very interested in these, as I model Met/GC (steam era) in P4

As you want a 4 coach set I assume you are building the 1905 push-pull set (3rd driver, 3rd, 1st  and 3rd).

The brake on the Bluebell is a bit of a hybrid, having had the end windows redone to how they were originally, but the sides (beyond the compartments) are not correct

As you have already done the hard bit, how about 1st/3rd comp, and 2nd and 3rd brakes (tongue in cheek, and just hoping!)

I do hope my wife, who models Dutch HO, doesn't see this thread. She might get ideas about going to N gauge as well!

The diagrams of the Ashbury's in the Jim Snowdon Metropolitan Stock book are very good - In fact they were used by Clive Thomas to produce his etched brass Chesham Set (now sold by London Road).

Might be worth looking at producing the other steam era variants.

Don't forget that one of them operated on the Chesham Branch of the Met in March 1936, as a trial to see if such a vehicle was suitable.

Tim,

I must have been standing almost next to you at Barbican station.

Looking at your photo, and the one I took on my mobile phone, I have got most of the same people in almost the same positions!

If, like me, your interests relate to the outer extents of the Met, and more than a few years ago, then the current MRJ features a beautiful 7mm model Whitchurch Road.

Additionally a few years ago the MRC produced Uxbridge in S Scale - saw it, as a work in progress, at the Chesham MRC Exhibition to celebrate 100 years of Chesham railway (1989), but never saw it finished.

A final one I remember was the Brill branch in EM - only saw it once whilst visiting an exhibition somewhere north of Birmingham back in the mid-1980s. I think it was featured in an early edition of MRJ

I "came back" to model railways as a result of seeing Allied Marine. It still remains the one layout I would like to have owned.

Whetstone was the layout that really inspired me into P4.

The MRCs Uxbridge S gauge layout was the one to convince me to actually go with what I had always wanted to do and model the Met.

The last 2 are why I am building a P4 Met/GC layout (and have been for about 18 years, and it's still nowhere near finished )