BG John Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 It will be interesting to see how many parts it can be broken down into, and if the firebox is separate. The one I started converting my shiny new Mainline one to when they first came out was chosen because it had a Belpaire firebox, and I've got the number plates, boiler fittings and Indian Red paint for it. But I'm starting to think my 1905ish EM layout may be a bit of a dead end, built just to run my existing stock, and I'm tempted to go back even further to the days when the Dean Goods was the latest thing out of Swindon, one of these days when I've done everything else I want to do. I bet Oxford won't produce one that old! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rue_d_etropal Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 just a pity they have gone for a loco already done. I know some want more detail, but all the old Airfix model needed for most people was a better motor. If they do the double framed and military versions then it is worthwhile. Might have been better to doing some pre-grouping coaches. People are crying out for these and neither Hornby or Bachmann have delivered yet. For a first tender loco, how about something different such as a GER E4 , No one has done a 2-4-0 loco yet. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sp1 Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 (edited) just a pity they have gone for a loco already done. I know some want more detail, but all the old Airfix model needed for most people was a better motor. If they do the double framed and military versions then it is worthwhile. Might have been better to doing some pre-grouping coaches. People are crying out for these and neither Hornby or Bachmann have delivered yet. For a first tender loco, how about something different such as a GER E4 , No one has done a 2-4-0 loco yet. A better motor, and a replacement for all the visible gears etc under the tender?.... Oh, and a big heap of coal... Edited January 24, 2016 by sp1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 What fittings are those? It looks very much like 2336 photographed in April 1903 apart from the bufferes. Keith The boiler fittings, and other parts of the loco, look a bit chunky compared to the photo of 2322 I was working to, and the chimney is too far forward. They seemed much sleeker in the early 1900s, with less pronounced smokebox rivets. It would be nice if pretty much all it needs is some Indian Red paint on the frames and the tender lettering changed, and I'm not fanatical about the finer detail as life is too short. I think I'm going to wait to see what the end product is before deciding what to do, as it's likely to appear before I get back to my Mainline one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craigw Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 just a pity they have gone for a loco already done. I know some want more detail, but all the old Airfix model needed for most people was a better motor. If they do the double framed and military versions then it is worthwhile. Might have been better to doing some pre-grouping coaches. People are crying out for these and neither Hornby or Bachmann have delivered yet. For a first tender loco, how about something different such as a GER E4 , No one has done a 2-4-0 loco yet. The double framed locos (2361-2380) were not based on the Dean Goods, being closer to the Stella (which was a 2-4-0). Most importantly, while the Dean goods wheelbase is 7'3" + 8'3", that of the double framed loco is 7'9" + 8'. Which ever way you look at it, the Dean Goods is very old and quite overdue for an update or (like this) a new model. Regards, Craig W 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
MGR Hooper! Posted January 25, 2016 Author Share Posted January 25, 2016 (edited) EP sample: Oxford_Dean_Goods.jpg That clearly looks far better than the Adams Radial from OR. Miles ahead. Infact I must add, the Dean Goods sample looks so much better in EP form than the Adams Radial in it's RTR form. Edited January 26, 2016 by MGR Hooper! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozexpatriate Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 This is a very welcome and unexpected development. Even if the Oxford Rail Adams Radial wasn't met with universal acclaim, I look forward to the Dean Goods with great interest. Presuming the lined livery to actually be accurate with the details modelled, it's nice to see the garter livery more often. That makes at least three announced - a 47xx, one of the Hattons/DJM Kings and the Dean Goods. I haven't noticed any delivery expectations (I haven't looked carefully) but with an EP sample already presented, it seems like this could possibly be a 2016 item. We shall see. Either way, it's a pleasing announcement. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Craigw Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 This is a very welcome and unexpected development. Even if the Oxford Rail Adams Radial wasn't met with universal acclaim, I look forward to the Dean Goods with great interest. Presuming the lined livery to actually be accurate with the details modelled, it's nice to see the garter livery more often. That makes at least three announced - a 47xx, one of the Hattons/DJM Kings and the Dean Goods. I haven't noticed any delivery expectations (I haven't looked carefully) but with an EP sample already presented, it seems like this could possibly be a 2016 item. We shall see. Either way, it's a pleasing announcement. The Dean Goods is in the Pre WW1 livery, the other two will be in post 1925 liveries. Post WW1 livery for all but the Express passenger classes was plain, unlined Green. Craig W Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 In broad terms, lined, garter and black frames for this class would mean from circa 1906. Early in WW1 a Khaki livery was introduced, but this changed to plain, unlined, green for all classes. Post war, as Craig W says, lined green with Garter was re-introduced but only to the then express passenger classes/modern 4-6-0s. The garter was replaced circa 1928 by the twin shields. Of course, the Dean Goods saw Government service in both world wars, allowing ROD etc liveries. So, lined with Garter for a goods or tank is going to be pre-WW1. Praise be to Oxford for doing a proper pre-grouping model, i.e. not one based on an inaccurate preservation scheme, e.g. Hornby Urie-liveried T9, Bachmann 'Birchgrove'. Thanks for a loco we can actually use on a pre-grouping layout. The unlined green is the classic inter-war appearance, as with the original Mainline issue. I will, of course, find a use for both, and will look to have up to 3 further pre-war examples with round top fire boxes, probably 1 with black frames and 2 with Indian Red. This is the best news since the Hatton King. Now, the perfect accompaniment for the Deans good, because, it, too, had a long life and can be represented in both pre and post WW1 liveries, and, because it, too, was found everywhere on the system, is, of course, the beautiful little 517 Class 0-4-2. Incidentally, the 517 lagged behind the Terrier, but was significantly ahead of such icons as Hardwicke and Gladstone in the Wish List Poll. Go on Oxford, give that a go!. 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold farren Posted January 25, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 25, 2016 About time the deans got a new model. And I was just wondering what Hornbys new exclusive face book press releases would be over the next few months. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Mikkel Posted January 25, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 25, 2016 With a good coat of grime, I think we can allow the lined version up to the end of the war, as not that many locos were in fact repainted during the was as far as I know. It would be good to find out how far back the lined version is correct (assuming it won't have a topfeed). We need someone with the right RCTS volume to tell us when then Belpaire firebox was first introduced on these engines, and on which ones (as some had roundtopped fireboxes up to a least 1910). The same goes for boilers and smokebox. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 2322 had a Belpaire firebox with Indian Red frames and the earlier monogram on the tender, but no topfeed, in the photo I have. As I said above, this is the one I started converting my Mainline one to. The lining on the model illustrated looks very heavy, compared to photos of the real thing. I know they're in black and white and it's difficult to tell how prominent it was in real life, but it does look a bit overpowering, so I hope it's more subtle on the finished product. I'd love to be able to just repaint the frames and change the tender lettering. Then I just have to worry about converting it to EM. I suppose I could carry on with my Mainline conversion, and produce an outside framed one instead. It would be easy to change the wheelbase due to the tender drive. I'm not sure if it would be the original tender drive, or a new one though. The only question then is how I justify two goods engines on my sleepy branch line! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 This is a very welcome and unexpected development... Hear, hear. Not least because it's an 0-6-0, a type we really cannot have enough of. The mechanism layout is going to have to be compact to fit in the small diameter low centreline round top firebox boiler. It's got the Crewe wheelbase of 7'3"+8'3", which opens the way to the use of the same mechanism layout in many other small engines built in C19th: whether Oxford choose to go on and offer such RTR, or leave it for those of us who enjoy mangling RTR into a different outward shape. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 From RCTS Part 4:OR76DG001: 2309 was built in 8/1883 with an S0 boiler, had an S2 from 2/91, B2 from 2/02 and a B4 from 6/10. it was superheated in 3/22 and withdrawn in 4/31. OR76DG002: 2409 was built in 11/1891 with an S2 boiler, had an S4 from 9/04, B2 from 7/07, and a B4 from 1/11. It was superheated in 1/19 and withdrawn in 4/53 OR76DG003: 2475 was built in 3/1896 with an S4 boiler, and had a B4 from 5/06. It was superheated in 4/22 and withdrawn in 10/40 Not being an expert on boilers, which does 2309 have? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Boar Fell Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Now listed at £95 on a well known retailers website. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Bigcheeseplant Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 It may help looking at the Martin Finney instructions http://www.brassmasters.co.uk/gwr_2301_dean_goods_0-6-0.htmas there were two widths of footplate, fluted or plain coupling rods two shapes of cab cut aways and that's before you get into boiler, smokebox and chimneys! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loconuts Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 A very good effort from Oxford Rail although the period of the model is in its final build it would not have sported the fully lined livery as shown. It is a superheated version as preserved and to do the fully lined version the smoke box needs to be the flush riveted with the ringed and dished smoke box door. Again cab cut-outs varied between the class. This final build did appear in several unlined liveries and may have received a lined livery in BR black, but to that I cannot be certain. We have the pre-1923 green, the post 1923 green, war time black and BR black. It cannot be made into an outside framed version as the wheel spacing is all wrong, without looking at a drawing of the outside framed version, I believe the wheel spacing is equal + equal. I know that the chassis under the old K's model was different to their inside framed version. But on the whole a very good effort which should keep the RTR boys happy. Loconuts Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 So if topfeed was fitted to some with B4 boilers from 1913 (according to Brassmasters), 2309 must have a B4, but be in post 1913 condition. Removing the topfeed would only backdate it to 1910. 2322, the one I have number plates for, had a B4 from 11/01, so should be OK for my 1905 date if the topfeed is removed. So it may just be a frame painting and tender re-lettering job, as long as it looks better than the picture! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 25, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 25, 2016 The Dean Goods is in the Pre WW1 livery, the other two will be in post 1925 liveries. Post WW1 livery for all but the Express passenger classes was plain, unlined Green. Craig W So are they doing both patterns of smokebox door? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adams442T Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 This looks from the EP to be streets ahead of the unfortunate Adams Radial. Let's hope they consult the right people this time, as a really 'spot-on' Dean Goods should sell really well. 'Proper' clerestory GWR coaches to replace those still limping round from the Hornby stable and decent LSWR coaches would be good too. I can see why Hornby went for the modified LSWR versions, but others lasted quite a long time through grouping, and into early BR service too I believe. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Mikkel Posted January 25, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 25, 2016 From RCTS Part 4: OR76DG001: 2309 was built in 8/1883 with an S0 boiler, had an S2 from 2/91, B2 from 2/02 and a B4 from 6/10. it was superheated in 3/22 and withdrawn in 4/31. OR76DG002: 2409 was built in 11/1891 with an S2 boiler, had an S4 from 9/04, B2 from 7/07, and a B4 from 1/11. It was superheated in 1/19 and withdrawn in 4/53 OR76DG003: 2475 was built in 3/1896 with an S4 boiler, and had a B4 from 5/06. It was superheated in 4/22 and withdrawn in 10/40 Not being an expert on boilers, which does 2309 have? Thanks a lot for looking that up John. I had a look for Volume 4 on the web last night, but couldn't find a copy for sale anywhere (will keep an eye out though), so this is very useful. So are they doing both patterns of smokebox door? If not, this Shapeways replacement from Alan may help the modifiers: http://shpws.me/D9Bp Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edwardian Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 I could use any number of these, as Dean Goods, with variations and back-dating the dearth of 0-6-0 goods designs is solve for at least one pre-grouping company (GWR - and, yes, doubled-framed Armstrong Goods must be represented too). I second the excitement about a what I hope will be a small modern motor-gearbox arrangement. With that tucked in the firebox and daylight under the boiler, doubtless many other classes could be represented using this chassis. And it's sub-£100. Really, that £10-£30 difference makes it possible to have several. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BG John Posted January 25, 2016 Share Posted January 25, 2016 Thanks a lot for looking that up John. I had a look for Volume 4 on the web last night, but couldn't find a copy for sale anywhere (will keep an eye out though), so this is very useful. It would be useful to know the differences in external size and appearance between the various boilers, to see which ones it can be altered to. It looks like all three versions they are doing had a B4, but can it be altered to other types? The RCTS book lists the details I gave for every loco, and there's some more useful information in the text. And will it be straightforward to get rid of the Belpaire firebox, and replace it with a roundtop? Tenders is the other big question, but I'm rusty on all this stuff I used to know. Not just capacity, but coal rails etc., and in their early life some locos had a variety of older tenders. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post exet1095 Posted January 25, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2016 A couple of pics from the Toyfair. It looks pretty good to me. Paul 21 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post exet1095 Posted January 25, 2016 Popular Post Share Posted January 25, 2016 Oops, only seems to let me add one pic at a time... 24 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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