Dave Beaman Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 With an arm now on the signal, you’ll be needing a lamp behind it. I like to have working lamps in my signals and I have had a request to show how I fit these so here goes. I use my own cast whitemetal combined lamp/bracket that has a 3mm hole for an LED to be fitted from the back but similar products are available from MSE or SSS. Some of these are designed to have a bulb fitted from underneath but the basic idea is the same. Looking at the back of the lamp casting, drill a 0.8mm through hole in the lower left corner. Bend the shorter leg of the LED (the “negative†terminal) back on itself as per the photo and thread it through the drilled hole. The body of the LED should locate in the larger hole (DO not glue it in!) Where the short leg fits in the little hole, apply a bit of flux and secure it with a quick dab of 145°solder. This will be enough to hold it in position andenable you to change the LED should it ever fail without destroying the lamp casting. At this stage, trim the protruding leg of the LED from the front of the lamp case but leave the other one until the wire is attached later. Keep the cut off LED leg as you can use it as a ladder stay later! With the arm in position, make a mark on the back of the post just below arm level and drill a 0.8 mm hole in the post. This is for the lamp wire. I use some very fine equipment wire I got from All Components which is thin enough not to show up too much but strong enough for the job. With the signal post secured so it won’t move (in a vice preferably) and the arm set to danger, offer up the lamp case to the post and align the LED with the arm. This the fiddly bit…apply a bit of liquid flux to the joint and while holding the lamp case in correct alignment, carefully solder it to the post with145° solder. I use a 13watt Antex soldering iron for this job. When cooled, check that the arm clears the lamp when it swings up and down and the LED aligns correctly with spectacle holes on the signal in both positions. Cut a length of wire off about 3†longer than the signal and bare about 7mm off one end. Thread the plain end into the hole in the post until it appears at the ‘ole at the bottom. Pull it through, leaving just enough to allow you to solder the wire to the long leg of the LED. Wrap the bared section around the long leg, tuck it as close to the back of the LED as possible and check it’s not touching the other leg. Carefully solder this on with electricians solder. Trim the long leg off the LED as close to the wire as you dare and retain the offcut. These make useful ladder stays! To complete the electrical circuit, solder an earth or negative wire to any convenient metal part (I usually drill a hole in the baseplate near the bottom of the post and fasten the bared end of the earth wire to it ) so that it will run next to the live wire from the LED. These 2 wires can then be taped together o run a sleeve of “heatshrink†tube over them. Solder a 1000 ohm resistor to the positive lead, bare a little bit of the earth wire and you are ready to test the lamp. The 1000 ohm (1k) resistor enables you to connect up 12v dc from your model railway supply or even a 9v battery. Let there be light! More soon Jon F. Very impressive Mr Fitness, I might even try that myself.Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 8, 2012 Author Share Posted April 8, 2012 Very impressive Mr Fitness, I might even try that myself. Dave. If you can manage the 5" gauge stuff, this should be a piece of..... .! JF Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 8, 2012 Author Share Posted April 8, 2012 (edited) Since I've been fixing servos directly to the signal bases I've been struggling with testing the completed signals on the bench. Knocked this up from a few scrap bits of wood and a spare SERVO4 board.I can now stand a signal on the top with the servos fitting through the hole and connect the wires up to the board.The switches are connected to each servo output and there is an output for the lamps as well.I can set up the board for each servo I test with the MERG setting box and observe the mechanisms working through the open front.I tested it with the GW signal shown previously but I'm sure you've all seen enough droopy signals for now......JF Edited June 3, 2015 by Jon Fitness 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N15class Posted April 8, 2012 Share Posted April 8, 2012 That is a good idea, as you make so many signals. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 9, 2012 Author Share Posted April 9, 2012 (edited) A quick u/q fix!Just a simple signal for our layout, but I've added some extra detail from my own castings. When anything is bolted through the tubular posts (on the real thing) there is a casting fitted against the post before the nut is added, just to spread the force of the nut being tightened. I produced a couple of masters in brass and I've fitted some of the resulting castings to see how they look. (I think I may need to be a bit more careful with the alignment!) I think they'll look OK after a coat of paint but would welcome comments....CheersJF Edited June 3, 2015 by Jon Fitness 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N15class Posted April 10, 2012 Share Posted April 10, 2012 the tester has a touch of Wallace and Grommet about it!!!! 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 10, 2012 Author Share Posted April 10, 2012 the tester has a touch of Wallace and Grommet about it!!!! and quite a bit more Heath Robinson as well!JF 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 11, 2012 Author Share Posted April 11, 2012 All finished. Weathered and installed. I'll blend the base in later. Cheers JF 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 13, 2012 Author Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) Another signal for the layout. 2 arm shunt for exiting the lower yard. This one will have to wait a week or two for paint as I'm off down to the IOW for a short break.Totally off subject, the place where I keep my wreck bus had a bit of a shunt around and I managed a rare shot of it. It's usually pretty much buried behind other resto-jobs and the running fleet.I managed a bit of work on the lower deck interior while I was there. ( I won't re-panel the exterior until nearer completion. Some clumsy oaf will probably dent it!)JF Edited June 3, 2015 by Jon Fitness 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 26, 2012 Author Share Posted April 26, 2012 (edited) Well, it's nose back to the lower quadrant grindstone.This next signal is more or less a straight kit build of a Scale Signal Supply GW5 wooden posted 3 leaf route indicator. There will of course be a few mods (lamp, sevo operation etc) but I'll be using the original bits in the kit.The first little problem I encountered was the side plates were wider than the supplied post but a good few strokes with a file sorted that out. The plates were then superglued to the post after cutting and setting to the required gap.This is the rest of the etch as suppliedand the various fittingsThe operating arms were fitted with small lengths of tube to act as spacers and bearings and the lengths of these adjusted to fit all neatly in the gap between the plates.A captive nut was soldered on one side plate, and a washer on the other. I used a chemically blackened bolt to hold these in position while I soldered them, the blackening preventing the solder from affecting the bolt.The base plate in the kit isn't big enough for my purposes so I cut a new one 50mm x 30mm. and drilled/countersunk a hole for the provided 8BA screw. A matching hole was drilled in the post base and the post/base fastened/glued together.Next was the arm pivot. A small length of tube was soldered to the provided plate, a small cut out made in the post and the pivot assembly glued and pinned. The lower pin was left untrimmed as the lamp case bracket fastens on to the other end of it.]The supplied lamp case is a solid brass casting so I carefully drilled it out to accept a 3mm W/W LED from underneath.That'll do for now!JF Edited June 3, 2015 by Jon Fitness 10 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N15class Posted April 26, 2012 Share Posted April 26, 2012 I am always surprised how easy you make it look. Also the techneque is so straight forward and usable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 27, 2012 Author Share Posted April 27, 2012 I am always surprised how easy you make it look. Also the techneque is so straight forward and usable. Hmm I think the same when I see the loco and scenery people at work! JF Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 28, 2012 Author Share Posted April 28, 2012 (edited) The shutter arrangement on these signals sits on a substantial bracket on the front of the post and this is the etch folded up ready.This is the rest of the etch parts for the shutter box, ready to fold up.The shutters slide up and down in channels either side of the box and this is provided for in the form of a lost wax casting strip. This was tinned on the reverse side, cut in to 2 pieces and a length soldered each side of the box etch. This was then folded up and assembled ready to accept the shutters.The shutters themselves are a bit of a tight fit in the guides and both these and the guides needed a little fettling to get them to run up and down. I fear I may have "over fettled" these though as there is now a tendency for them to tip a little. Oh well you live and learn (then forget and do it wrong again if you're anything like me!).The shutter box was then soldered to the bracket per instructions, the lamp (unlit!) and some bracing strips added and once everything appeared roughly the right shape, 2 of the supplied pins were soldered to the bracket2 holes were then drilled in the post and the bracket assembly pushed onto the post, checked for alignment and finally secured with superglue.A quick word on how this signal functions might be helpful here so..Each of the shutters has a route name on it (usually of 5 letters or less) and is lifted into position in the display by pulling the appropriate lever in the 'box.The weight bar for the actual signal arm is within all the other operating arms on the post. It has a cross bar fastened to it in such a way that if any shutter is lifted, it lifts up the weight bar thus moving the signal arm with it. When the shutter is lowered, the signal arm returns to danger by gravity. There is no direct link from signal lever to the arm.On the model, the same principle applies so all the mechanics must be free working and on the etch, an extra spectacle plate is included to add extra weight to assist the signal to return to danger. I'm going to have to be careful with the paint then!Oh and there's more problems now. I've just realised I have forgotten to make a channel in the post for the lamp wires. They should have passed under one of the side plates. bollicks!More soon.JF Edited June 3, 2015 by Jon Fitness 8 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Steve Hewitt Posted April 28, 2012 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 28, 2012 A quick word on how this signal functions might be helpful here so.. Each of the shutters has a route name on it (usually of 5 letters or less) and is lifted into position in the display by pulling the appropriate lever in the ‘box. The weight bar for the actual signal arm is within all the other operating arms on the post. It has a cross bar fastened to it in such a way that if any shutter is lifted, it lifts up the weight bar thus moving the signal arm with it. When the shutter is lowered, the signal arm returns to danger by gravity. There is no direct link from signal lever to the arm. On the model, the same principle applies so all the mechanics must be free working and on the etch, an extra spectacle plate is included to add extra weight to assist the signal to return to danger. I’m going to have to be careful with the paint then….! More soon. JF Jon, I've got some of these to build in 4mm scale, where gravity is certainly not sufficient to bring the arm back to danger. I plan to use a further servo to drive the balance arm for the signal arm. Its controller will then be connected so that it clears the signal concurrently with any of the route boards being displayed. Similarly it will return to danger when the route board is returned. Steve. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted April 28, 2012 Share Posted April 28, 2012 I've got some of these to build in 4mm scale, where gravity is certainly not sufficient to bring the arm back to danger. I plan to use a further servo to drive the balance arm for the signal arm... I, too, have been thinking about how to do a 4mm route indicator. My current thinking is to use a light return spring mounted below the base for the arm return, rather than the extra servo. Mind you, it's all thought experiment at the moment... Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 28, 2012 Author Share Posted April 28, 2012 Jon, I've got some of these to build in 4mm scale, where gravity is certainly not sufficient to bring the arm back to danger. I plan to use a further servo to drive the balance arm for the signal arm. Its controller will then be connected so that it clears the signal concurrently with any of the route boards being displayed. Similarly it will return to danger when the route board is returned. Steve. Sounds like a good idea but.. theres always the option of a spring like I did on the earlier one I made Steve! JF Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 28, 2012 Author Share Posted April 28, 2012 I, too, have been thinking about how to do a 4mm route indicator. My current thinking is to use a light return spring mounted below the base for the arm return, rather than the extra servo. Mind you, it's all thought experiment at the moment... Nick A spring would work and if the one I'm building now doesn't behave itself it'll get sprung too! JF 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 30, 2012 Author Share Posted April 30, 2012 Well, it’s not pretty but the wires for the lamp are in. The earth wire runs from the LED to a side plate then from the side plate down to the brass base plate. The poz wire runs down from the LED, round the edge of the “gap†in the post then out through the base plate. A coat of Squadron green filler to cover them up and I’ll work on the rubbing down to see if it will smooth out. A couple of coats of white primer should hide the rest. Also fitted are the lamp-man’s staging/platforms. The actual mechanics of the signal have put up a bit of a fight this afternoon but I think I’ve got it all running reasonably smoothly now. I have soldered all the rod linkages up now using various methods of coupling ranging from sewing pins to simply soldering loops of wire to things as I can remove the operating bars from the signal for painting and maintenance with all the rods still attached. Chemically blackening the operating bars has made things easier as I could solder pins and links to them without risking soldering the whole thing solid! My camera battery ran out before I’d finished assembling it all but suffice to say, the lash up is currently stood on the “servomatic†test rig, servos fitted, adjusted, each shutter sliding up and down as required and the signal arm returning to danger by gravity. I’ll post a few more pics and a link to a test run video tomorrow (or later today!) More soon. JF 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted April 30, 2012 Author Share Posted April 30, 2012 (edited) Camera batteries duly re-charged and heres a few more pics and a rather wobbly video clip! Sorry the vid clip finishes before the last movement of the signal; Windows movie maker seems to clip off the last bit when I was reducing the file size for posting here.GW RItest.wmvNow I know it all works I can proceed with the tidying up and final fitment of the ladder before the strip down and paint shop beckons.Oh and the the arm will be getting a "ring" on it too!More soonJon F. Edited June 3, 2015 by Jon Fitness 9 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debs. Posted April 30, 2012 Share Posted April 30, 2012 I`m absolutely-loving this thread; what an inspiration! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted May 5, 2012 Author Share Posted May 5, 2012 (edited) Paint cans and paint brushes having been waved in the general direction of the signal, it's time to re-assemble.I had left the ladder off until final assembly as the way I have made the rod linkages meant I wouldnt be able to fit it all back together with the ladder fitted.To make re-assembly a bit easier, I masked a few bits off before spraying, ready for easy soldering. A little patch was left on the base-plate and the ends of the ladder left clean. I managed to fit all the operating linkages from the servos to the operating arms and the signal weight bar, but I left off the shutters (for now) These were cleaned and chemically blackened to avoid any paint getting in the slides or any of the moving joints before being once more checked for free movement. Once I was happy with these, I took them out again to put on the wording. These were produced on the computer using MS Word and printed onto sticky label paper, cut out and stuck on. The font (if you think this looks right) is Agency FB set at 18 and 24 points.The signal arm having been painted and glazed was connected up and secured at the back with a home made cast backblinder which provides much need balancing weight to further ensure the arm can return to danger by gravity.The final drive rods from the operating arms to the shutters are 0.5 brass wire. The ends were bent 90deg., pushed through the holes in the shutter arms and tiny etched washers from the kit etch soldered to the wire. The shutters being chemically blackened werent affected by the solder, making the job a lot easier resulting in a nice tight but mobile joint.The ends of the wire were then snipped off and trimmed with a minidisc in the drill.Finally, the ladder was added and some wire ladder stays provided.Final painting was then completed and the signal placed back on the rig for final testing.Here's the usual wobbly video... RI finished test.wmvMore Soon!JF Edited June 3, 2015 by Jon Fitness 11 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
N15class Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Excellent work as usual. I always like to see the wooking signal on your test rig. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Debs. Posted May 5, 2012 Share Posted May 5, 2012 Absolutely gorgeous work, John ........you should be deservedly proud! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon Fitness Posted May 5, 2012 Author Share Posted May 5, 2012 Excellent work as usual. I always like to see the wooking signal on your test rig. Absolutely gorgeous work, John ........you should be deservedly proud! Ta! JF Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portchullin Tatty Posted May 7, 2012 Share Posted May 7, 2012 That is very impressive Jon! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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