Heath Town and other signalling diversions

[Andy Keane]

Paul, when you put in sensors at the ends of tracks for your automation how far from the buffer stops do you place them? Clearly a bit of a gap is needed but I was wondering how much? Say six inches or is that too big and wasteful on track space?

thanks

Andy

[5BarVT]

7 hours ago, Andy Keane said:

Paul, when you put in sensors at the ends of tracks for your automation how far from the buffer stops do you place them? Clearly a bit of a gap is needed but I was wondering how much? Say six inches or is that too big and wasteful on track space?

thanks

Andy

Ah . . .
In the scenic section I haven’t got that far yet but I will do it for visual effect i.e. where I think trains would have stopped in reality (given constraints on length).

In the hidden sidings it’s right at the end because I use micro switches.  You can see a couple beyond the Hymek in this post.

Paul.

 

[Andy Keane]

1 hour ago, 5BarVT said:

Ah . . .
In the scenic section I haven’t got that far yet but I will do it for visual effect i.e. where I think trains would have stopped in reality (given constraints on length).

In the hidden sidings it’s right at the end because I use micro switches.  You can see a couple beyond the Hymek in this post.

Paul.

 

Ok - I see - and I assume this is based on pretty much an instant stop rather than any deceleration. I was thinking of allowing a few inches for the slow down.

Does your Hymek not biff its nose?

[ISW]

1 hour ago, Andy Keane said:

I was thinking of allowing a few inches for the slow down.

Does your Hymek not biff its nose?

Andy,

 

If it's non-scenic, then a 1-inch cube of sponge makes a good 'safe' self-conforming bufferstop.

 

Ian

[Graham T]

Best to take the jam off first though 😀

 

 

 

Is that my coat?  Thank you!

[St Enodoc]

7 hours ago, Graham T said:

Best to take the jam off first though 😀

 

 

 

Is that my coat?  Thank you!

That's a shame, Graham. If you'd tried a bit harder I'm sure you could have worked Victoria into that somewhere.

[5BarVT]

23 hours ago, Andy Keane said:

Ok - I see - and I assume this is based on pretty much an instant stop rather than any deceleration. I was thinking of allowing a few inches for the slow down.

Does your Hymek not biff its nose?

Don’t forget I’m using Traincontroller. The deceleration is triggered off the track circuit, the micro switch is just the final stop from crawl speed.  Deceleration distances are generally 36” apart from the short sidings which are 24” or 12”l

Paul.

Edited May 5, 2022 by 5BarVT
Speeling\gremmar

[5BarVT]

It's been a bit quiet here for a couple of weeks - 'bin on holiday, ABROAD!

There aren't any railways on Lanzarote, not even any disused ones so you'll have to wait a bit for those photos.  There is interesting flora though.

If I didn't know better I would have said that someone has stuck the branches in the artificial Christmas tree upside down.

No railways, but plenty of cycling.

 

For various reasons I hadn't done any serious cycling since last at La Santa in 2019 and the tree shown earlier is about 750' up from where I started.  First round trip (13 miles) was hard work but OK.  By the next day my muscles went on strike!  After nearly two weeks I was managing 17.5 miles and a climb of 1000' so a good holiday.

 

Now we're back home, inspired by my regained prowess I sorted the bike and headed off round the Wirral Circular Trail today.  Target was to cycle the Joint Line from Hooton to West Kirby and on to Hoylake then return by Mersey Rail.

Hadlow Road

 

Hoylake

But I was still feeling quite good, so off I rode past New Brighton,

 

and Wallasey Town Hall (where my Great Grandfather was Lord Mayor),

 

from where you can see Pier Head and the Liver Building (and a Mersey Ferry),

 

to Birkenhead Woodside, or at least, all that's left of it.

By that stage I'd done 28 miles, so when I came out of Woodside and saw the tower of Hamilton Square station announcing "Frequent Electric Services" I decided to "Let the Train take the Strain". A good afternoon out.

 

Now although no physical modelling took place while I was away, quite a lot of e-modelling was done after the morning rides and before the evening meal.  More on that in the next post.

 

Paul.

[5BarVT]

Just found the Gold theme (after seeing others as Premium members).  Having to get used to the different colours!

Paul.

[5BarVT]

Apologies for the radio silence. As always, a number of reasons, the main one being that no modelling has taken place for some time.

Some of it is a bit of C requires B complete, which requires A, which itself needs C . . .  But I have been contemplating hard in the interim and am coming up with some ideas.

There may be an update sometime!

Paul.

P.S. Pontificating on other threads has not been disturbed by this impasse . . .

[DavidMcKenzie]

I'm glad I'm not the only one who seems to end up (far too often in my case) in that situation 🙂. 

 

All the best,

Dave

[5BarVT]

Thought I ought to post today, seeing as the nights are now drawing in (for northern hemisphere readers).

Paul.

[5BarVT]

NUMBER CRUNCHING or Going Round in Circles

 

10 days ago I mentioned being a bit stuck.  The next gradient board really needs the one after done first but as I have been building the gradient from the bottom I didn’t know what height to build beyond the gap.  Add to that a floor that isn’t level so I wasn’t sure where to measure from for positioning the support . . .

The layout is built on a variety of IKEA IVAR frames which support shelves above and below the storage sidings and cupboards on the scenic side.  I have spent the past week with a spirit level going round the shelf supports measuring the cross levels and longitudinal height changes around the layout.  Those figures have gone into a spreadsheet so I now know the relative heights of support shelves around the room.  That has allowed me to create a datum for the room (bottom of the lowest leg) and relate heights to that.  I’m happy with the accuracy as going round the whole room I have an error of only 1mm.  Given that I was measuring to 0.5mm accuracy at best and that error are cumulative I was pretty pleased.

 

Then I went back into Xtrack Cad and updated the height (z coordinates) round the layout including the gradient bits that I have already built and added the height at the top of the gradient.  [I haven’t upgraded from v4 yet and sometimes it gets a bit strangulated about its gradient calcs when I mess around with fixing and unfixing points, but I have found that if I delete heights and reinstate then it gets back on track so we have got there now.]

 

That has given me an absolute height for the rail level at the support and the spreadsheet converts that to distance from the support shelf below that I need to install my new support.

 

So, either over the weekend, or after being away next week, some new construction might happen.  And that might mean a photo!

 

Paul.

Edited June 22, 2022 by 5BarVT
Tryping

[5BarVT]

ACTION!

 

So to show that I have actually done something, here is the support for the gradient tracks fixed in place and with one of the side bearers bodged in position.

 

 

And, no, there isn't room between eventual rail level and the bottom of the board above.  About 10mm to be cut away before trains can run.

 

Paul.

[5BarVT]

NON STICK

As well as doing not much on the layout I have been wrestling with non stick black tak and white tak.  The first reel of double sided 'black tak' worked reasonably well with my WAGO 222 connectors and when that ran out I ordered what should have been the same.

Unfortunately, this was the result.  Now polyamide moulding and gloss paint are not going to be the easiest substances to bond but I haven't been able to find any double sided tape that will work.

Speaking to friends at Wirral Finescale using hot melt glue was suggested.  An investment has been made and first results are very pleasing.

After only 15 mins they are resisting being dislodged far better than any of the tapes.

Thank you WFRM!

Each of the more recent boards will now be removed in turn and the WAGOs refixed.

 

Paul.

[Andy Keane]

4 hours ago, 5BarVT said:

NON STICK

As well as doing not much on the layout I have been wrestling with non stick black tak and white tak.  The first reel of double sided 'black tak' worked reasonably well with my WAGO 222 connectors and when that ran out I ordered what should have been the same.

Unfortunately, this was the result.  Now polyamide moulding and gloss paint are not going to be the easiest substances to bond but I haven't been able to find any double sided tape that will work.

Speaking to friends at Wirral Finescale using hot melt glue was suggested.  An investment has been made and first results are very pleasing.

After only 15 mins they are resisting being dislodged far better than any of the tapes.

Thank you WFRM!

Each of the more recent boards will now be removed in turn and the WAGOs refixed.

 

Paul.

Paul

I have been wondering about a hot melt gun - I see you opted for Bosch. Did you do much research on what to get? Are you happy with it?

thanks

Andy

[5BarVT]

Yes I did do some research.  The sort where you go round and round in circles not sure where you’ve got to!

Gun manufacturers are very cagey about the temperature of their guns including having different figures in marketing and technical literature.  They all seem to claim that their guns will only work with their glue, but their glue is fine with everybody else’s gun . . .

The choice seems to be hot or cool, 7mm or 11mm (ignoring commercial 43mm), mains or rechargeable (again ignoring dry cell operated - thinking whole life cost).  Cool seems to have fewer options for glue and 7mm fewer options for guns so I settled on 11mm.

The Bosch got good scores on Screwfix (within walking distance for me so no transport costs) the only down side noted being the stiff cable when setting it down.  It’s a slight pain if you drape the cord at an angle over an edge - it will rotate the gun - but I soon got used to how stop it.  I like the long nozzle on this one which is one reason why I didn’t go for the rechargeable.

Having circulated a number of times I thought “just go for it” and I’m not disappointed.  Early use says the bog standard glue stick it came with works for my electrical connectors and will do cardboard construction at a later stage.

Paul.

[5BarVT]

Another slight minus for the mains Bosch: there is no power switch so if used frequently but intermittently you either unplug each time or need to use it in a switched socket.  Again, something I’m happy to live with.

Paul.

[Sasquatch]

On this side of the Atlantic it's possible to find 110V glue guns that have a separate stand, like most kettles available these days.

Much easier to use and very handy indeed!

 

The one I got was from Walmart, under $20, is not a rechargeable, just needing to be placed back on the juice if needed again. The gun is good for about 5 inches of 11mm glue before it starts to cool. 

 

Regards Shaun. 

Edited August 2, 2022 by Sasquatch

[ISW]

On 02/08/2022 at 13:17, 5BarVT said:

Now polyamide moulding and gloss paint are not going to be the easiest substances to bond but

Screws are always a good alternative, but there seems to be no place in the WAGO to drill suitable holes for the screws! I'm guessing they are designed to fit in 'clip in' fixings?

 

Ian

[Harlequin]

2 minutes ago, ISW said:

Screws are always a good alternative, but there seems to be no place in the WAGO to drill suitable holes for the screws! I'm guessing they are designed to fit in 'clip in' fixings?

 

Ian

"Wagoboxes": https://www.wago.com/gb/enclosures

 

[5BarVT]

MASTER OF ALL I SURVEY (Sort of)

Still no modelling as such but, as hinted at some time ago, part of the problem is designing the gradient when I didn’t know exactly how the boards line up.  So I have been using skills I didn’t get at Uni ‘cos I was an electrical engineer not a civil.  (Cue responses saying ‘and you’re still not civil . . .).   11 boards measured to the mm so far, including any out of squareness and with 7 installed and measuring across the room from known datums I feeling pretty pleased with the result.

I will soon run out of avoidance engineering!

Paul.

[Andy Keane]

12 hours ago, 5BarVT said:

MASTER OF ALL I SURVEY (Sort of)

Still no modelling as such but, as hinted at some time ago, part of the problem is designing the gradient when I didn’t know exactly how the boards line up.  So I have been using skills I didn’t get at Uni ‘cos I was an electrical engineer not a civil.  (Cue responses saying ‘and you’re still not civil . . .).   11 boards measured to the mm so far, including any out of squareness and with 7 installed and measuring across the room from known datums I feeling pretty pleased with the result.

I will soon run out of avoidance engineering!

Paul.

Paul

Have you tried one of those natty laser based spirit levels that shine lights around the room for doing all this work - the chap who does our odd jobs of building swears by them.

Andy

[JeffP]

The Magnusson one from Screwfix is excellent, but any will need a (cheap) tripod to be fully useful.

[5BarVT]

I looked into a laser level.  The ‘less expensive’ type need a planar surface (flat wall) to work.  As my room is full of shelving I would need a fancier gyro based device and that put the cost up into the £00s as I recall.  I sorted the vertical alignment using old fashioned sprit level and straight edge (where I needed a greater span).

What I’m working on now is the ’plan view’.

Thanks for the suggestions anyway.

 

Paul.