Bachmann announce NEW Class 47

[wombatofludham]

Interesting announcement.  Depending on the first livery announcements, I expect there will be room for both the Bachmann and new Heljan models, after all there were over 500 of the things made.

This does suggest Bachmann see their future increasingly in the premium end of the market, taking their cue from Sutton and Accurascale, who have shown there is a market for high spec, high detail models for which people are prepared to pay a premium, although in fewer numbers.

Look forward to see what liveries will be in the launch batch.

[MikeParkin65]

1 hour ago, Max Legroom said:

Looking forward to a unnamed banger blue version. The sort that made us groan when it came into view back in the day.

There surely will be but it will be squeaky clean like this (Glos and Warks railway last Sunday) :)

[richierich]

No mention of drop in EM or P4 wheelsets like Accurascale / Sutton / Calavex?
 

Motorised Serck radiator shutters would be interesting. A very noticeable feature when you use to see Class 47s running around at York Station on platform 9/10/11 into the then Headshunt. 
 

It’s nice to see standards improving. But as prices continue to rise, its going to be interesting to see where the market is heading long term . . . 

Edited August 3, 2021 by richierich
Question ref P4 and EM.

[woodenhead]

5 minutes ago, richierich said:

It’s nice to see standards improving. But as prices continue to rise, its going to be interesting to see where the market is heading long term . . . 

In the same direction as all other hobby markets.

 

It is what it is, Bachmann have to compete with SLW, Accurascale, Hornby and Heljan, if they try that on price alone they will simply fail.

[Downer]

47s are too late for my chosen period, and I’ve never liked the look of them anyway, so there’s no chance of me buying one. Yet for some strange reason this seems like an exciting announcement. For the modelling community as a whole perhaps. 

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

Isn't anyone's wallet breathing a sigh of relief?  Honestly, I'm disappointed.

 

Mind you, 'it's coming out too soon' - that's a new level, well worthy of the Olympic fortnight.

[woodenhead]

Just now, Dr Gerbil-Fritters said:

Mind you, 'it's coming out too soon' - that's a new level, well worthy of the Olympic fortnight.

It's the ribbing that makes the difference

[atom3624]

I liked the 'engine detail highlighted by internal lighting' and not 48 hours after A/S mentioned this for their Deltic ....

 

Do we have an idea of pricing yet - are any going to be less than £200?

 

Al.

[Wolf27]

47 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

 

Awww.

 

I've had to put up with years of people whining about things taking longer than originally anticipated and now we get the other extreme. Just accept that you're unhappy and move on rather having to tell everyone that you are; none of us will ever be able to afford everything in life we want at the drop of a hat and if you've not got the money you'll just have to accept there'll be another occasion when you have.

 

In the meantime please stop sounding like spoilt brats.

I’m glad you said that.

[gridwatcher]

This is all good. Bachmann needed to do something to up the ante and get 'back in the game'  So  a big thanks then to Heljan, Sutton, Accurscale et al for pushing them along...... Cannot wait to see the dec samples. 

[TomScrut]

37 minutes ago, Flittersnoop said:

if there will also be a step change in the price charged for a single loco? Over £200 for a DCC-ready diesel, perhaps?

 

TBH, even if there is if the detail and quality are a suitable step up I cannot complain. Whilst I am one for whinging about prices going up I don't think I ever have when the product has improved as a result of it.

 

At least the price premium associated with the fans and glazing are optional too.

 

The bogies look amazing on this model.

[TomScrut]

5 minutes ago, atom3624 said:

Do we have an idea of pricing yet - are any going to be less than £200?

 

I expect you'll know tomorrow!

[rembrow]

52 minutes ago, TomScrut said:

 

And they obviously do if the development has cost them a million quid (I think it said in the video)!

 

How many people have enough 47s already and not buy any? How many will shove them on eBay and buy these? How many don't have any 47s but want one? I am probably rare being in the latter category!

I think you've hit the nail on the head. There are already two good versions of the 47 that have been sold for many years, Bachmann and Vitrains. I have completed my requirements for EWS, Freightliner, I/C swallow, RES and Virgin liveried models, and was not planning on adding to them. I don't feel the motivation or need to chop these in while they remain serviceable. With two competing models of a class that has been well served by previous models  someone is going to lose I suspect, as I'm not convinced there will be a huge market. We will see.

[woodenhead]

3 minutes ago, TomScrut said:

 

I expect you'll know tomorrow!

According to @AY Mod's evil twin

[Mophead45143]

1 hour ago, woodenhead said:

First the Peaks, now a completely new 47 plus a 69.

 

Bachmann are certainly fighting back now, I wonder how this might impact EFE going forwards - that had some use of Heljan models in the first draft of announcements, but a Peak and a 47 in direct competition with Heljan must alter that EFE relationship.

 

What can we expect tomorrow in the main announcement?

 

You say 'the peaks', but it has only been the marker light 45/0 that has seen any upgrade. There's still no 45/1 of any kind, or a marker light 46. And there are detail issues with the headcode variants, (particularly for BR blue modelers) that need addressing through new tooling's. 

 

It would be wonderful if the 44's, 45/0's, 45/1's & 46's, and all the nose variations of each could be represented in an all new model, as Bachmann have announced here for the 47's. I appreciate it will be a long time off, if it happens at all.

 

There aren't many 'classic' mainline diesels left that made it to TOPs, which could do with a modern tooling makeover. 

 

Could do with improvement?

 

Class 31 - Hornby model well detailed, but generally considered to lack some of the character in terms of shape that a modified lima model achieved.

Class 40 - Bachmann model is good, but class 40 fans would argue it could do with the Accurascale treatment!

Class 44/45/46 - Detail errors on most existing Bachmann variations, could do with an upgraded / new tooling as per recent marker light 45's. The new Heljan class 45 already seems flawed in terms of shape, so best bet is for Bachmann to revisit these as they've already made a start.

Class 50's - Hornby model good, but some debate about cab window profile.

 

Everything else seems to be covered.

 

Anyway, back to the Duffs! Is this FINALLY the 47 that's been needed in 4mm?

 

Cameron

 

[woodenhead]

1 minute ago, Mophead45143 said:

 

You say 'the peaks', but it has only been the marker light 45/0 that has seen any upgrade. There's still no 45/1 of any kind, or a marker light 46. And there are detail issues with the headcode variants, (particularly for BR blue modelers) that need addressing through new tooling's. 

 

It would be wonderful if the 44's, 45/0's, 45/1's & 46's, and all the nose variations of each could be represented in an all new model, as Bachmann have announced here for the 47's. I appreciate it will be a long time off, if it happens at all.

 

Ask an N gauge modeller if he would be happy with a couple of Peaks let alone one of every flavour.  

 

Holding out that tomorrow will be the day...

[luke_stevens]

38 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

 

Awww.

 

I've had to put up with years of people whining about things taking longer than originally anticipated and now we get the other extreme. Just accept that you're unhappy and move on rather having to tell everyone that you are; none of us will ever be able to afford everything in life we want at the drop of a hat and if you've not got the money you'll just have to accept there'll be another occasion when you have.

 

In the meantime please stop sounding like spoilt brats.

 

Wow! I threw the cat amongst the pigeons with that comment, didn't I? It certainly wasn't international...

 

 

I don't believe I've ever complained about how long things are talking to arrive. Having had some experience of manufacturing I know schedules can be variable and are apt to slide. Maybe it is just time for some balance from "things are arriving too slow" to "things are arriving too fast"? No delivery schedule will suit everyone. 

 

I approach my modelling by trying to be responsible with my purchases and budgeting. I am happy to accept that there will always be things I would "like" but won't be able to afford / budget for. I do hope we're not moving to a point were we can't express "disappointment" with the actions of a a manufacture? I was under the impression that polite feedback was positive. I'm not saying I will never buy from Bachmann again, or that I will post snotty reviews, or that they are crazy. I just pointed out that Bachmann's change of policy form the start of this year does not suite everybody; a justified view i would have thought.

 

Most manufactures announcements give time to "plan", "prepare" and "save": all good habits. This allows the customer to choose what they are going to commit to. Short notice announcing lessen that choice by change it to deciding what to cancel. 

 

Spoilt brats would be "I want it all and I want it NOW". My approach is more "I want to be allowed time to make my choice. 

Luke

[MRDBLUE17]

Hi everyone,

 

Certainly an interesting announcement from Bachmann and not something I was expecting to see. I like the launch video and the tooling shown off does look like a further step change from Bachmann in many areas. It does look very good. I also noted they said the later variants with the stainless steel grills over the radiators could be done too which is potentially great for some current machines to appear. 
 

look forward to seeing what liveries/numbers are in the first lot to tempt. 
 

Cheers

Mark

[Mophead45143]

7 minutes ago, rembrow said:

I think you've hit the nail on the head. There are already two good versions of the 47 that have been sold for many years, Bachmann and Vitrains. I have completed my requirements for EWS, Freightliner, I/C swallow, RES and Virgin liveried models, and was not planning on adding to them. I don't feel the motivation or need to chop these in while they remain serviceable. With two competing models of a class that has been well served by previous models  someone is going to lose I suspect, as I'm not convinced there will be a huge market. We will see.

 

Surely it will be a case of the better model wins? If people are prepared to wait to compare the two that is. 

 

My money will be that the Bachmann model beats the Heljan one hands down, in terms of getting the shape right anyway!!!  

 

Cameron

[IRC]

Glad I didn’t pre-order those two Heljan ones now! I wonder where Heljan go from here?

These do seem to be the ultimate class 47 looking at them.

Let’s hope the price isn’t too horrific.

Also looking forward to seeing the painted samples and running numbers chosen. I wonder if they will replicate some of their earlier limited editions that go for silly money second hand?

Still, Christmas is coming and maybe Bachmann have timed that just right?

[MikeParkin65]

14 minutes ago, rembrow said:

I think you've hit the nail on the head. There are already two good versions of the 47 that have been sold for many years, Bachmann and Vitrains. I have completed my requirements for EWS, Freightliner, I/C swallow, RES and Virgin liveried models, and was not planning on adding to them. I don't feel the motivation or need to chop these in while they remain serviceable. With two competing models of a class that has been well served by previous models  someone is going to lose I suspect, as I'm not convinced there will be a huge market. We will see.

By going up market with the specification Bachmann will be able to justify higher prices and crucially they wont need to sell as many to make a decent return. Its equivalent to the car market - most of the profit is in the 'extras'.  

[G-BOAF]

30 minutes ago, atom3624 said:

I liked the 'engine detail highlighted by internal lighting' and not 48 hours after A/S mentioned this for their Deltic ....

 

Do we have an idea of pricing yet - are any going to be less than £200?

 

Al.

Umm Accurascale mentioned internal lighting at the time of their original announcement in 2018, as also the moulding of engine detail in the chassis block (visible in the initial stereo prints). They have recently (re)confirmed the printing of this decoration.

[newbryford]

3 minutes ago, luke_stevens said:

 

Wow! I threw the cat amongst the pigeons with that comment, didn't I? It certainly wasn't international...

 

 

I don't believe I've ever complained about how long things are talking to arrive. Having had some experience of manufacturing I know schedules can be variable and are apt to slide. Maybe it is just time for some balance from "things are arriving too slow" to "things are arriving too fast"? No delivery schedule will suit everyone. 

 

I approach my modelling by trying to be responsible with my purchases and budgeting. I am happy to accept that there will always be things I would "like" but won't be able to afford / budget for. I do hope we're not moving to a point were we can't express "disappointment" with the actions of a a manufacture? I was under the impression that polite feedback was positive. I'm not saying I will never buy from Bachmann again, or that I will post snotty reviews, or that they are crazy. I just pointed out that Bachmann's change of policy form the start of this year does not suite everybody; a justified view i would have thought.

 

Most manufactures announcements give time to "plan", "prepare" and "save": all good habits. This allows the customer to choose what they are going to commit to. Short notice announcing lessen that choice by change it to deciding what to cancel. 

 

Spoilt brats would be "I want it all and I want it NOW". My approach is more "I want to be allowed time to make my choice. 

Luke

 

Apologies for going O/T, Andy Y has enough to contend with normal discussions, never mind this one.

 

I don't think expression of disappointment isn't allowed, more the over-reaction of the description of the initial disapointee.

 

The answer is budget for an emergency slush fund put aside for these surprise announcements.

(Maybe not a true comparison, but I am also lucky in that I have some savings specifically set aside in case of any domestic disaster outside of model railways - such as the washing machine breaking down)

 

I've just used my model slush fund on a very nicely priced Hornby 60 that appeared in Bargain Hunters.

That's my "unplanned purchase" budget used up until I can replenish it by selling something else - or saving up the fund again slowly.

In the meantime, if anything comes along sooner that I haven't got funds for then I'll have to make the choice if I want to sell something else to fund it.

It's a hobby - it's a choice - it's my choice.

 

I'm sure the new 47s will be around to purchase for some time to come. Plenty of time to save up for one, not that they are high on my fleet list.

 

[SouthernBlue80s]

I have a fleet of 4 Heljan tubby 47s.

I have put a lot of work into them over the years, weathering, built handrails etc. But they just don't cut it any more when sat next to my newer models.

 

So they are up for retirement. Two new Bachmann blue ones for me to start with. 

 

Well done Bachmann

 

 

[G-BOAF]

8 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

By going up market with the specification Bachmann will be able to justify higher prices and crucially they wont need to sell as many to make a decent return. Its equivalent to the car market - most of the profit is in the 'extras'.  

 

Judging by the look of the model, it proably WILL be over £200.

However given Accurascale are brining out similar specification 37s and 55s for 'just' 160/170 it is still difficult to justify the price vs spec. Given Bachmann's larger overheads, I would say £180-190 would be 'justifiable' but sadly I can't see Bachmann keeping the price so keen.

Then again 180 is the ballpark for current releases from Hornby in D&E.