Westward Models, where did they go

[hayfield]

 

I know Westward Models went to Chris Parish of Puffers of Kenton (then to Pickering) Like many in North west London/ SW Herts we were all drawn to to the emporium especially the downstairs inhabited by John Redrup

 

Christmas eve I received what purports to be a Westward LSWR T9  in the dark blue box ref number WK11 the only name was Puffers of Pickering.  Its a dead ringer for the Wills T9's I have,

 

I do have also a Westward Beattie well tank WK15, a Westward Terrier WK 16 and what I believe is a LSWR 700 (this is a guess). Added to this I always see GWR railcars come up from Time to time

 

 

I was told the SEF SR Q1 was from an earlier manufacturer, was their T9 from Westward? If so what a pity the GWR rail cars were not taken into the range

 

Simply can anyone shed some light on the range please

 

 

[Blandford1969]

Sadly didn't the range die with Chris? -

 

The Westward T9 had a full length set of frames rather than those in the SEF one which just covers the drivers.  Its a shame they have gone as the T9 frames would be helpful for many modellers doing T9's or other LSWR 4-4-0's 

 

It would be nice to see some of those detailing parts reappear, its a bit like Craftsman that did useful detailing parts which have gone.

[hayfield]

The Perseverance frames were/are full length, but were the Westward chassis the same ?  As my T9 has a fitting in the front whitemetal castings (as the Will did) for the front bogie

 

My Westward Terrier's chassis perhaps is a Perseverance, but the Well tank differs a bit from the usual Perseverance style 

 

Now in the Perseverance catalogue I have (!987) has no Well tank chassis listed, but both the Terrier and T9 chassis are stated as the same as in the Westward kits.

 

Did the chassis change over the years ? do I have a Will T9 in a Westward T9 box ?

 

There are no mention of Westward kits in the catalogue, but there are Perseverance LNER & LMS kits, which were etched brass kits. Were Westward models also under the Kemp Models umbrella ?

[RodneyS]

I think the SEF  Q1 was originally produced by Little Locos, or something similar.

They did a range of non-Southern locos (LNER?) so the Q1 was the odd man out.

As a result it was sold to Dave Ellis of SEF.

 

I have a Westward Terrier which I purchased from Kemp Models in Brighton.

At that time they were in Bristol but I believe there was a tie-in with Kemp and Westward.

Interesting that the range then went to Puffers.

 

I've never had a T9 kit but I'm fairly certain the SEF ( Ex- Wills ) is of the wide splasher variety and the Westward one is of the narrow splasher type.

I was told by someone who knew Bob Wills that he recommended the wider splasher loco as EM gauge wheels would fit easier.

 

I believe the Perseverance range went to Kemp Models but where it went from there I have no idea.

It's all very confusing !

Rodney

 

[hayfield]

That was it with the Little Engines kit, but were others absorbed into the Wills/SEF range s?

 

Chris Parish owned both Perseverance and Westdale ranges. Back in 2011 Chris sent me an email with a PDF attached, I seem to recollect a telephone conversation about availability of products after receiving the PDF, I think I bought a chassis from him and he said he was planning a re-launch of the Perseverance range, I seem to recall in the short term there were no plans to reintroduce the whitemetal kits

 

The list shows 4 variants of the T9   WK11  T9, WK14 T9 sat(urated) both of these with the 8 wheel tender, WK 20 Sat  6 wheel tender, WK19 Sup 9heated?)6 wheel tender.

 

I spoke to another trader a while back and I got the impression that he was showing an interest in the chassis kits. I guess its a case that whoever is in charge of the estate values it more than  a potential buyer does. It may be that as far as the whitemetal loco kits are concerned that the masters may need adapting/renewing

 

Certainly both ranges were with Chris until he passed away, what's happened after someone may be able to enlighten us

Edited December 27, 2021 by hayfield

[Steamport Southport]

Little Engines. I think the link with Perseverance was Perseverance did the etchings for the chassis and detailing parts.

 

ISTR the Q1 was the first kit they did. Wasn't there a Z Class as well or am I getting the DMR version mixed up?

 

 

They certainly liked big eight coupled wheel locomotives and large tank engines. They had quite a few in the range.

 

Off the top of my head A5, A6, A7, A8 4-6-2Ts, N1 0-6-2T and T1 4-8-0T. O1, O3, O4, O4/3, O4/7, O4/8, as well as various 0-6-0s and 4-4-0s.

 

 

 

Jason

Edited December 28, 2021 by Steamport Southport

[RodneyS]

Ah yes, Little Engines.  I knew it was Little something !

I'm fairly certain that the Q1 was the only kit absorbed into the SEF range.

Rodney

[Steamport Southport]

6 hours ago, RodneyS said:

Ah yes, Little Engines.  I knew it was Little something !

I'm fairly certain that the Q1 was the only kit absorbed into the SEF range.

Rodney

 

Yes, it was.

 

Would love to know what happened to the others. They seem very good. Got a J11, J11/3, D11/2 and an O4 in the pile. The loco types are probably why I got them for a reasonable price as all apart from the J11/3 are now available RTR.

 

1980s quality with etched bits. Good clear castings. Good instructions in the two that have them, not a problem though as they seem straightforward. Up there with the best white metal kits IMHO.

 

The address says Gosforth, Newcastle Upon Tyne. I wonder whether there was a connection to the other NE kit manufacturers.

 

 

Jason

[SRman]

I can't speak for the railway kits, but the bus kit range went to ABS Streetscene and are now with the Model Bus Federation (MBF). However, many of the bus kits just disappeared, so some of the rarer ones command silly prices on online auction sites.

[Steamport Southport]

I forgot they did buses. Sometimes they pop up in the Hattons second hand section.

 

Here's the page on the Hattons database. Not all are on there as usually items get added when they get an item in stock, but may be of interest.

 

https://www.hattons.co.uk/stocklistdatabase/3155845/0/westward/mfrnest

 

 

Jason

[31A]

On 28/12/2021 at 01:38, Steamport Southport said:

Off the top of my head A5, A6, A7, A8 4-6-2Ts, N1 0-6-2T and T1 4-8-0T. O1, O3, O4, O4/3, O4/7, O4/8, as well as various 0-6-0s and 4-4-0s.

 

One of the 4-4-0s was the LNER D16/3.

 

[37114]

13 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

I forgot they did buses. Sometimes they pop up in the Hattons second hand section.

 

Here's the page on the Hattons database. Not all are on there as usually items get added when they get an item in stock, but may be of interest.

 

https://www.hattons.co.uk/stocklistdatabase/3155845/0/westward/mfrnest

 

 

Jason

If I recall, Westward Kits had a link with the owner of Westward Travel who were a local operator in the area North of Bristol hence the bus kits as well.

[John M]

I attempted to build a Westward T9 in EM Gauge as my first whitemetal kit building attempt about 30 years ago. The kit was for the narrow cabbed version of the class with crankpin splashers and superheated boiler.

 

My initial attempts at the build were unsuccessful as the running board, splasher and cab castings were designed for OO gauge and there was insufficient clearance for EM gauge (Markits wheel sets). In the end I decided to assemble the loco rather than leave it in the scrap or dispose of it.

 

I appear to have replaced the whitemetal running board, buffer beams and valences with scratchbuilt nickel silver parts retaining the whitemetal superstructure, I remember assembling the cab side sheets at a slightly off vertical to the spectacle plate to provide sufficient clearance for the drivers, but appears barely noticeable on inspection, or maybe my eyesight is not as good.

 

The chassis appears to be Perseverence full length which was weak at the front end with cut outs for the bogie wheels.

 

The tender had an all whitemetal chassis and rather flimsy dummy main frames.

 

30 years later my main criticism of the loco is the heavy and rather crude smokebox  casting, ( though I may have obliterated the the rivet detail in an attempt to clean up).

 

Still the finished kit looks reasonable, I should sort out the engine tender power pick up, with a Mashima motor & DJH gearbox and smokebox balanced by a weighted tender she should be a fairly good puller.

[Dunsignalling]

On 27/12/2021 at 10:23, hayfield said:

 

I know Westward Models went to Chris Parish of Puffers of Kenton (then to Pickering) Like many in North west London/ SW Herts we were all drawn to to the emporium especially the downstairs inhabited by John Redrup

 

Christmas eve I received what purports to be a Westward LSWR T9  in the dark blue box ref number WK11 the only name was Puffers of Pickering.  Its a dead ringer for the Wills T9's I have,

 

I do have also a Westward Beattie well tank WK15, a Westward Terrier WK 16 and what I believe is a LSWR 700 (this is a guess). Added to this I always see GWR railcars come up from Time to time

 

 

I was told the SEF SR Q1 was from an earlier manufacturer, was their T9 from Westward? If so what a pity the GWR rail cars were not taken into the range

 

Simply can anyone shed some light on the range please

 

 

Splashers should be the giveaway.

 

SEF only ever did the later T9 with the full width ones, whereas all the Westward T9s I've seen have the fancier narrow type with separate covers for the crankpins.

 

However, I don't know enough about Westward to rule out them possibly having done both versions.

 

John

Edited December 30, 2021 by Dunsignalling

[Steamport Southport]

I had a feeling  I had a Westward 64XX but on looking it's a Stephen Poole one. I do have some packets of detailing parts for things like coach bogies and buffers though.

 

A quick look online for a Perseverance T9 gives these results. I don't know how comprehensive this list is as I have a vague memory of them doing an L12.

 

WK11   LSWR/SR/BR Class T9 narrow cab, watercart tender, superheated Urie rebuild

WK14   LSWR/SR/BR Class T9 narrow cab, watercart tender, saturated Drummond original

WK15   LSWR/SR/BR 2-4-0T Beattie Well Tank

WK16   LBSC/SR/BR Class A1/A1X 0-6-0T

WK17   LSWR/SR/BR 700 Class 0-6-0, Urie rebuild

WK19   LSWR/SR/BR Class T9 narrow cab, 6 wheel tender, superheated Urie rebuild

WK20   LSWR/SR/BR Class T9 narrow cab, 6 wheel tender, saturated Drummond original

WK21   LSWR/SR/BR 700 Class 0-6-0, Drummond original

WK22   SR/BR Light Pacific 4-6-2 original condition but with vee-cab

 

 

 

https://sremg.org.uk/model/00steamkits.html

 

 

 

Jason

[ThePipersSon]

I have tried to attach the Puffers catalogue from 2006. I hope it helps.

It does list Westward loco kits, but from personal experience, it was not that simple.

PricelistforPuffersProducts2006.doc

[hayfield]

 

As you can see the box is of the type used by  Westward Kits and has the correct kit number, but not like the Labels on my other kits and no Westward title

 

 

A Puffers of Pickering label, but the SR T9 hand written. NP written in black ink

 

It may be a second hand Wills model which was put into a Westward box?

[hayfield]

11 minutes ago, ThePipersSon said:

I have tried to attach the Puffers catalogue from 2006. I hope it helps.

It does list Westward loco kits, but from personal experience, it was not that simple.

PricelistforPuffersProducts2006.doc 107 kB · 2 downloads

 

 

Thanks for the list. I have a PDF which Chris sent me in 2011, much the same but no loco kits

[Battledown]

I built a SEF T9 with a Perseverance chassis, Portescap RG4-1219 motors over 30 years ago. The Perseverance range of chassis were designed by Rod Neep  but marketed with Westward kits. I also built a 700 class from a Westward kit which came with Perseverance chassis. Both were much modified to produce the original saturated versions with shortened smokeboxes. I still have them and they are both still runners.

[russell price]

I have a built westward 5400 pannier and an unbuilt double railcar, oh and lots of westward Plaxton supremes and Dominants. All are excellent kits , the pannier is very closely related to the Cotswold 1600 and 2021 and certainly the same master builder. 

Edited December 31, 2021 by russell price
Correct the auto correct

[russell price]

The pannier is a Wooton under edge example whilst the railcar is kemp models. Remember going to wooton under edge to get parts years ago.

[Jol Wilkinson]

The Perseverance/Westward range of products  have now moved into the hands of another well established kit producer.  They need sorting out, being totally undocumented, which will take some time. Some products may no longer be economically viable.

[hayfield]

Jol

 

Thanks for taking the time to reply and happy new year

 

Very interesting news, I had a chat prior to covid and whilst it was not confirmed I got the impression that steps were afoot by said person to obtain part or all of the range

 

I would imaging that etching methods have moved on greatly since the Percy masters were drawn, however the range still is well regarded on the S/H market and there are quite a lot of chassis listed that are either not available or very hard to obtain. Great news

 

I am not to certain about the viability of the westward masters, when I spoke to Chris I think he had given up on the range. Certainly the railcars are very sought after and the NuCast partnership are proving older sets of masters can be refurbished into new kits

 

The first piece of good news for 2022, thank you