OO Gauge GWR Toplight Mainline & City Coaches announced

[sjrixon]

They are looking really nice, thankyou Dapol... I'll be happy to place a pre order.. 

[Harlequin]

Since these coaches were designed to run as close-coupled sets of six, how realistic would it be to run them in other combinations? The set of three that went to Wales at the end of their lives obviously gives one excuse for doing so but what about the interim?

 

You can see on Dapol's drawings that the inner buffers, where the coaches would be close-coupled, are correctly short. So would those buffers have been replaced to run in other combinations?

 

[Mike_Walker]

I wonder if these will be made in China or Wales as I believe their wagons are.  It would be nice to see the latter just to prove we can do it as well!

 

Can't really justify these in deepest Kernow but if they do a corridor 3rd I'll jump at it!

[Miss Prism]

11 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

Since these coaches were designed to run as close-coupled sets of six, how realistic would it be to run them in other combinations?

 

Other than the three that ended up as gas-lit miners' stock (with normal buffers), the sets weren't broken up as far as I know, and they carried on their normal suburban duties even after their 'City service' was taken over by the Met.

 

As most of us would acknowledge, this stock is a weird choice for any manufacturer's entry into the Toplight world, but, and here's the thing - they are undeniably cute. That is why they will sell. I understand the coaches will be available separately, so a bit of rule no 1 could manifest itself in a 4-car set, or a pair of brake 3rds masquerading as a B-set, or even an autofitted pair.

 

 

 

[GWR8700]

Very nice!

So these were just used on London services until the sets were broken apart and transferred to South Wales?

Does anyone know if they were used on the GC/GW mainline and did they any make it to Devon/Cornwall by the 20s/30s?

[Mike_Walker]

It is very possible that they appeared on the High Wycombe to Princes Risborough section of the GW/CC Joint on through Paddington to Aylesbury trains via Maidenhead, you could certainly get away with Rule 1, but not in the far south west.

[The Stationmaster]

2 hours ago, Miss Prism said:

 

Didn't the service extend to Aldgate (or had that stopped by then)?

 

Aldgate seems to have gone in and out as a destination and I don't think - without checking - that there was ever a time when all the through trains terminated at Aldgate.   The through trains in earlier years - prior to the 1925 'cull' seems to have been rather unusual by GWR standards as originating stations seem to have been subject to quite a lot of change - for example High Wycombe only lasted for a year or two and was then cut back to start from Bourne End.  The most consistent starting and terminating point was probably Uxbridge (Vine Street).  

 

Going back to broad gauge days the oldest service timetable I have is for May 1866 and at that time there were  5 Down through trains and 4 Up, weekdays only, between Windsor and Aldersgate Street (which had only opened in December 1865 and later went through various name changes over the years, always including Aldersgate until it finally became Barbican).  things had changed considerably by my next oldest Service TT - June 1891 which had the following originating stations for Up trains - Reading (1), Windsor (1), Uxbridge (3), West Drayton (1), and @outhall (1);  the 4 morning trains all terminated at Moorgate Street and the three afternoon trains terminated at Aldersgate Street.  The only through movement to Aldgate was an 'as required' light engine which stood there during the period of the passenger service although it appears to have moved back to Moorgate Street at sometime during the day so i suspect it might have worked as a turnover engine at Moorgate Street.  The Reading service was something of an oddity as it left Reading, logically, at 08.05 but there was no evening back working, and only a morning back working which went as far as Maidenhead.

 

Moving to July 1901 things had got much more complicated because the through trains, now running to/from Aldgate, were far more integrated with not pnly the Hammersmith service but also ttrains through to Addison Road and Richmond. The predomonat starting and terminating point was firmaly established as Uxbidge (vone Street (5 Up trains and 4 Down) there was the one from High Wycombe  (via Maidenhead - no back working), only 1 from Windsor but 2 back, 1 each from West Drayton and Southall and 4 which started at Bishops Road having come empty from West London.

 

All of which of course pre-dates the City sets but I'll try to dig out some more through services for their period of operation apart from the 1929 one I've already mentioned. 

 

[Edwardian]

First, a round of applause from me.

 

And three cheers:

 

• With this release, Dapol gives us welcome variety for stock, breaking away from the exclusively Collett designs that really didn't dominate the real GWR between the Wars as much as they dominate GWR layouts set between the Wars. The toplights are an attractive design and I think will be very popular. Further, it's an original choice. Note that, Margate, an original choice. 

 

• They look excellent, from the sample pictures, too.

 

• They are intended to match a loco release. Joined up releases. At last!

 

My only regret is that I will not be buying them, for the same reason I won't be buying a 61XX; I simply don't have layout scheme involving that sort of suburban GW traffic. As a consequence I am not at all familiar with the prototypes, so cannot really comment on the prototype fidelity of what has been shown so far.  One cannot always make favourable assumptions, sadly ...

 

So, I won't be able to justify buying these. Very much my loss.

 

However, I noted with a deal of excitement:

 

"Dapol further advise that Toplight Corridor coaches are currently in design and will provide details later in the year"

 

I have to restrain myself from a row of dancing emojis at this point.

 

Excellent.

 

Whether these be wooden and panelled, or the unfairly overlooked, steel bodied corridor toplights, the corridor types are a fit for me and I can promise that I will buy any Dapol makes.

 

All in all a big thumbs up!

[The Stationmaster]

Don't forget your Edwardianship sir that in all fairness to them Hornby intended to do a joined up release of their 41XX/61XX and the Collett non-gangwayed stock.  I wonder if that intention sort of got lost in somebody's rush to grab a production slot to get the re-badged Oxford Terrier into production 'because it was a Hornby model' (and so get ahead of the upstarts who were going to introduce an update on the Dapol original (which had of course previously been re-badged as Hornby).

[Nick Gough]

One of these sets feature in an accident report, on the Down main at Old Oak Common, from 1927:

 

https://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/docsummary.php?docID=2083

 

Including the preserved 3755.

[Ronny]

One point I don't think has been made yet here is that these lovely offerings will be with us this year! I am so tired of announcements that get me all excited just to read I might be able to get my grubby mitts on them some years into the future. At my age ....

[Clive Mortimore]

The mainline and city toplights look lovely, it is a pity I abandoned my idea of making Farringdon Street in the 1920s some time ago. GWR mainline and city stock, including the artics with Met-Rly sparks on the front, LNER (GNR) Quads, N1s and N2s, LMS (MR) close coupled 4 wheelers with Johnson 0-4-4Ts, Met Rly hauled trains with a Pullman and freights, GWR, MR and GNR freight trains, Met (and GWR joint) EMUs and all those wonderful designs of EMU from the District on Circle line duties. 

 

I agree with Mike Stationmaster that GWR services terminated at Liverpool Street, the bay platform.

 

I do like all the under gubbins, great for when a train derails.

[Flittersnoop]

21 hours ago, Captain Kernow said:

They look very nice but I'm not sure about the authenticity of that dark blue livery.

 

Perhaps some were sold to Longmoor?   

[Flittersnoop]

I shall find a reason to buy a rake of these - somewhere I have a Metro tank kit, reasonably complete but minus a motor.

 

I suspect these non-corridor ones are being made first because most people are waiting for the corridor Toplights.

 

Dare I say it, but for me this announcement is way more exciting than the whole Bachmann 2022 programme put together.

[Dunsignalling]

11 minutes ago, Flittersnoop said:

 

Dare I say it, but for me this announcement is way more exciting than the whole Bachmann 2022 programme put together.

 

 

Agreed, and I'm not even in the market for any of these.

 

I will be when they get round to some corridor ones, though.

Edited February 3, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[JohnR]

Is it my imagination, or has there not been any discussion on the price?

[Dunsignalling]

1 minute ago, JohnR said:

Is it my imagination, or has there not been any discussion on the price?

Sixty quid each, roughly the same as newly announced Hornby coaches. 

[NCB]

Could fit nicely into an Uxbridge (Vine Street) style model of a suburban terminus.

[Pteremy]

Interesting, not least because Accurascale say that they considered corridor Toplights to go with their Manor but concluded that they would be a nightmare to get right (see the Manor thread). 

 

Given the slightly specialist nature of these announced carriages do they give us any clue as to the type of corridor Toplights Dapol might be most likely to go for?

[JohnR]

25 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

Sixty quid each, roughly the same as newly announced Hornby coaches. 

 

Exactly. And Hornby get pelters for their prices. 

[gwrrob]

12 minutes ago, JohnR said:

 

Exactly. And Hornby get pelters for their prices. 

 

Most retailers are selling them for 51 sheets each and considering the detail spec offered I'm inclined to say they're a bargain. The lined crimson lake version especially.

[Legend]

13 minutes ago, JohnR said:

 

Exactly. And Hornby get pelters for their prices. 

Well look on the brightside, a Bachmann birdcage retails at almost £89.95 nearly 50% more , so I don’t think Dapol pricing is that bad to be honest , given the decoration on these . 

[Steamport Southport]

16 minutes ago, JohnR said:

 

Exactly. And Hornby get pelters for their prices. 

 

One rule for Hornby. One rule for the others. Some on here just want to kick Hornby.....

 

 

Personally I see it as how much would you pay for a kit version? 

 

£30 for the sides and ends from Worsley Works is the closest I think you can get to these. No castings or underframes.

 

http://www.worsleyworks.co.uk/4mm/4mm_GWR.htm

 

£50 to £60 for a "quite specialist" RTR coach is about right to me as long as it's a good enough quality. 

 

 

 

Jason

[Dunsignalling]

20 minutes ago, JohnR said:

 

Exactly. And Hornby get pelters for their prices. 

Not from me, they don't. I reckon the remaining Maunsell coaches I have on pre-order are still good value. I'm expecting the new Bachmann Bulleids to cost at least half as much again....

 

I'm not troubled by Hornby's new prices for locos either, because there are only two that interest me this year, one of the six-wheel Sentinel diesels and the Caprotti Black Five.  

 

John

[9402 Fredrick]

I went ahead and pre-ordered the pre-Shirtbutton set(3), plus 6129 sound fitted so I have something to pull it, I'm definitely gonna get a set of the corrider stock (hoping they do more than just the 3rd, composite, and brake 3rd most  pre-WW 2 GWR corrider coaches in r-t-r 00 the past few years and we

 get a restaurant, kitchen, and full brake) cause a 00 gauge King/Castle/Hall/Star hauling a rake of these plus some corridor Colletts on a layout would look amazing.