OO Gauge GWR Toplight Mainline & City Coaches announced

[Steamport Southport]

Can't be in 1908 to 1912 condition as they were built until 1920.....

 

It's also pretty debatable whether many got a paint job between the utility brown and BR crimson.

 

 

 

 

Jason

[The Johnster]

Yes; the austerity brown livery was not applied after 1945 and even the BR transition version of the 1945-end of 1947 livery was not applied after 31/5/48.  So the post austerity chocolate/cream livery only lasted 3 years tops, paint was difficult to obtain in what was still an austerity economy (due to whatever was produced being used firstly for export to address the dire balance of payments problem), and this was a relatively small batch of coaches, so the chance of this livery being used on a set is not high, which is not to say ot didn’t happen!  
 

One assumes that at least one set got austerity brown livery though, as Dap have produced this livery, and this was only used for 2 years, 1942-1945. 

[Neal Ball]

13 hours ago, Guardian said:

That would also be my guess, but let's see how Dapol reverts to my respective request...

I wouldn’t hold your breath….. It seems Dapol don’t like engaging with their customers, two emails to them recently have been ignored.

 

My first email was about these carriages, with the second being about the Pannier Poll I ran a while ago. Neither had the courtesy of a simple “Thank you” by reply.

 

Accurascale have shown the way about listening to feedback and as a result will probably be the stronger company for it. In those respects, I would have preferred Accurascale to be making the Toplight carriages.

[Neal Ball]

Progress seems to be slow / ground to a halt, or of course they don’t see fit to tell their customers….

 

https://www.Dapol.co.uk/OO-Gauge-GWR-Toplight-Mainline-City-Coaches-Announced

 

 

Thats been the same message since they were launched in February.  Which of course could be, “we are just plugging away and are too busy to up date our website” but you would have expected some progress in the intervening time. There is still no artwork shown for the shirtbutton liveries, which will be my preferred choice.

 

It will be interested to see if they actually show decorated samples for Q2… (April, May, June)….

 

I also see that comments have still not been enabled on their site. 
 

Maybe it’s simply a case that they need to employ a Marketing Manager, so one who can actually engage with the customer.

[Hal Nail]

1 hour ago, Neal Ball said:

Maybe it’s simply a case that they need to employ a Marketing Manager, so one who can actually engage with the customer.

I have several Dapol 7mm models which seem to have turned out pretty well even without my input and I doubt having updates would have speeded up delivery, so I'd rather not pay more by way of passed on cost.

[Neal Ball]

19 minutes ago, Hal Nail said:

I have several Dapol 7mm models which seem to have turned out pretty well even without my input and I doubt having updates would have speeded up delivery, so I'd rather not pay more by way of passed on cost.

If they market properly it would add pennies onto the final cost, less of course if they market properly as they might get an increased production line.

 

There is a danger they will fall behind their competitors, a factor I would suggest doesn’t particularly bother them.

[Paul.Uni]

https://www.Dapol.co.uk/OO Gauge Toplight Coach Update

[Siberian Snooper]

The Lake livery looks good, what a pity they didn't migrate to the southwest in the early part of the 20's.

 

 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Siberian Snooper

[Steamport Southport]

6 minutes ago, Siberian Snooper said:

The Lake livery looks good, what a pity they migrate to the southwest in the early part of the 20's.

 

 

 

What do?

 

They weren't built until 1920!

 

These are London area carriages built to replace the Holden style four wheelers that migrated to the countryside.

 

 

Jason

[Siberian Snooper]

I know that they were built then and that they were London commuter trains, but that surely doesn't prevent one from being a little whimsical, does it?

 

 

[Steamport Southport]

33 minutes ago, Siberian Snooper said:

I know that they were built then and that they were London commuter trains, but that surely doesn't prevent one from being a little whimsical, does it?

 

 

 

Not at all.

 

But you don't know whether people are being serious, we did have a question earlier in the thread about whether they got 1908 to 1912 livery.

 

 

Jason

[Michael Hodgson]

The latest update shows models in various liveries minus running numbers.   There were numbers in the illustrations for the  initial announcement and as there is more than version of each coach, hopefully this update is merely showing an intermediate stage in the production process.

[sjrixon]

I'm no expert.. But, they do look nice. Glad I pre-ordered a few.. 

[Neal Ball]

7 hours ago, Paul.Uni said:

https://www.Dapol.co.uk/OO Gauge Toplight Coach Update

 

They don't really seem to have made much progress since February. Still no Shirtbutton livery details and whilst the current ones are nice, the project doesn't look as if its moved forward since February.

 

But of course Dapol are very secretive and certainly don't want to share details with RMWeb... wait and see!

[MG 7305]

My understanding is that GWR rolling stock tail lamps handles went from side to side as did the loco lamps.   Fore and aft handles are for lesser railways.  Are Dapol aware of this?

[Hal Nail]

2 hours ago, MG 7305 said:

Are Dapol aware of this?

What is the context for this?

[Steamport Southport]

1 minute ago, Hal Nail said:

What is the context for this?

 

Tail lamp in one of the photos is wrong.

 

And considering they are apparently fitted then it might be a slight issue.

 

"In the image below is a view of the coach ends. The luggage compartment end of the All Third Brake coach can be seen to the right which is fitted with a directionally operated lamp – this lamp is not removable."

 

https://www.Dapol.co.uk/OO-Gauge-GWR-Toplight-Mainline-City-Coaches-Announced

 

 

GWR tail lamp.

 

https://www.gwra.co.uk/auctions/86690/2021mar-lot-715.html

 

 

Jason

[Hal Nail]

1 minute ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Tail lamp in one of the photos is wrong.

 

And considering they are apparently fitted then it might be a slight issue.

 

"In the image below is a view of the coach ends. The luggage compartment end of the All Third Brake coach can be seen to the right which is fitted with a directionally operated lamp – this lamp is not removable."

 

https://www.Dapol.co.uk/OO-Gauge-GWR-Toplight-Mainline-City-Coaches-Announced

 

 

GWR tail lamp.

 

https://www.gwra.co.uk/auctions/86690/2021mar-lot-715.html

 

 

Jason

 

Gotcha. Just under the heading the devil is in the detail!

[MG 7305]

https://www.gwra.co.uk/auctions/86690/2021mar-lot-715.html

 

Small point, that is a loco lamp (side mount) and operating department rear lamps had a rear mount.  However the point is made and I have emailed Dapol about it.  I look forward to seeing their prototypes in due course to see if they have made the change.  I do not have a need for Waterloo and City stock or a miners' workmen's train for Glyncorrwg, which is where the preserved examples at Didcot ended up.  However I am extremely interested in the promised mainline toplights.

[Steamport Southport]

2 minutes ago, MG 7305 said:

https://www.gwra.co.uk/auctions/86690/2021mar-lot-715.html

 

Small point, that is a loco lamp (side mount) and operating department rear lamps had a rear mount.  However the point is made and I have emailed Dapol about it.  I look forward to seeing their prototypes in due course to see if they have made the change.  I do not have a need for Waterloo and City stock or a miners' workmen's train for Glyncorrwg, which is where the preserved examples at Didcot ended up.  However I am extremely interested in the promised mainline toplights.

 

Guards van lamp. GWR loco lamps were red

 

Loco lamps also didn't have red lenses. They had a slide like this one.

 

https://www.gwra.co.uk/auctions/great-western-railway-locomotive-head-lamp-embosse-2021mar-0376.html

 

 

 

Jason

[Neal Ball]

5 hours ago, MG 7305 said:

My understanding is that GWR rolling stock tail lamps handles went from side to side as did the loco lamps.   Fore and aft handles are for lesser railways.  Are Dapol aware of this?

Can we check with some of our RMWeb “sage” on this - sorry my reference books are not to hand. @The Stationmaster and @Miss Prism any comments? Thanks

[Miss Prism]

Edited May 30, 2022 by Miss Prism

[The Stationmaster]

1 hour ago, Neal Ball said:

Can we check with some of our RMWeb “sage” on this - sorry my reference books are not to hand. @The Stationmaster and @Miss Prism any comments? Thanks

Right - first of all the lamp in that linked photo is actually a side lamp (the big hint being that the wording actually describes it as such and refers to the two bullseye lenses.  So it is all too obviously not a tail lamp if you bother to read the description of it (and I think that it might also be painted the wrong colour for a side lamp but I don't when black for side lamps was introduced).  And the photo also shows that the red slide is in place behind the visible bullseye hence it looks red.

 

GWR passenger carrying coaching stock lamp brackets is a little discussed area.  Many photos clearly show lamp irons arranged in the same way as GWR loco lamp irons BUT some photos show the lamp iron on some gangwayed stock as being flat and part of the face of the gangway.  And of course the City sets actually had three lamp irons.  So what was this all about?  The answer is fairly simple although it might take a bit of digging to establish when  the change occurred.  The City sets reflect the requirement - at the time they were introduced - for passenger trains to carry side lamps in addition to a tail lamp.  Hence the three brackets although it's debatable on them, and other passenger vehicles, if the side lamps actually shone towards the front as well as to the rear as the brackets effectively would keep the lamps within body gauge.  The side lamp brackets were like loco lamp brackets but the tail lamp bracket was 'flat'.

 

Auto trailers are alas not a good guide in respect of passenger stock lamps because they had to carry a head lamp as well as a tail lamp and in traffic often only used the one bracket for the two functions,  This meant that they could use a standard loco lamp provided that it had a red slide for use when the driving end was trailing.  But if you look carefully you can also see the 'flat 'tail lamp bracket on the left hand photo.

 

However all of this does raise one potential question - did the City stock carry side lamps when working over the MET? 

Edited May 30, 2022 by The Stationmaster

[Neal Ball]

Thanks @The Stationmaster and @Miss Prism

 

Its interesting that the right hand photo of the SRM has a loco bracket and a carriage bracket. I guess facing and rearwards…..

 

We need a photo of ordinary stock to send to Dapol then

[Harlequin]

5 hours ago, Neal Ball said:

Thanks @The Stationmaster and @Miss Prism

 

Its interesting that the right hand photo of the SRM has a loco bracket and a carriage bracket. I guess facing and rearwards…..

 

We need a photo of ordinary stock to send to Dapol then

There are two photos of the brake compartment ends of D62s 3752 (marked "Local C No.3") and 3755 ("Local C No.5") in Russell P97, Figs 169 and 172. They are in WWII all-over-brown.

 

One carries a tail lamp, the other doesn't. The lamp bracket is clearly a normal "flat" tail lamp bracket and the tail lamp is clearly a normal tail lamp with the handle across the vehicle - so differing from the photo on Dapol's website.

 

I'm sure Dapol are well aware of these photos so I hope the lamp they show was just an issue with the pre-production photos.

 

Edited May 31, 2022 by Harlequin