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Hint about SE&CR brake van

Paul.Uni

By Paul.Uni,
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The Stationmaster

The Stationmaster

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As I do believe I suggested some time back ;)  (Not that it was hard to work out what could well happen).. The only problem with this is do I now buy SECR liveried vehicles to go with my SECR liveried engines and passenger stock -  yes, more shock horror

Edited by The Stationmaster
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wainwright1

wainwright1

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2 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

Six wheeled?

 

Weren't they virtually direct copies of the MR 6 wheeled brakes but with an extra veranda? Slaters do one in 7mm scale.

 

https://slatersplastikard.com/linePage.php?suffix=JPG&code=7043#

 

 

The MR one to show what I mean.

 

https://slatersplastikard.com/linePage.php?suffix=JPG&code=7034

 

 

Jason

The South Eastern Railway built some with single verandas which were similar to the Midland ones. These were re-built with a second veranda, but the new end had a double cross rail at the new end. The South Eastern and Chatham Railway built some more from new with double verandas, but single cross rails at both ends.

 

I have two D & S kits, one for each type, to build.

 

All the best

Ray

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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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21 minutes ago, rapidoandy said:

Oooops I let that slip….

 

Interestingly everyone says they are identical to the MR ones. Having studied the works drawings I can say they certainly were not identical.

 

Andy


The Midland ones didn't have the heavy end stanchions on the veranda ends, where the lamp irons are mounted on the SER/SECR ones. Plus other details such as the different number of side planks between MR and SER/SECR design, different side handrails (the horizontal MR ones were split into two sections, where the SER ones were one continuous rail; also, the MR vans had an additional, lower handrail.) There were other minor variations as would be expected given they were being built by different companies: Axleboxes (MR and SER using their own patterns), different suspension mountings, no rainstrips on the SER/SECR ones... It all adds up!

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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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6 minutes ago, wainwright1 said:

The South Eastern Railway built some with single verandas which were similar to the Midland ones. These were re-built with a second veranda, but the new end had a double cross rail at the new end.


Interestingly, the research I've done actually suggests the double-cross-rail is at the end that previously had a veranda - the drawings show the end wall being rather lower at that end than the new "standard" double-ended ones, so it looks as though the second, higher, cross-rail was added to bring the old end up to the same height as the others! 

I assume this is because as built, they only had hinged bars, rather than doors, over the veranda sides. Once the doors were added, they'd want to bring the end up to the same height. The stove and handbrake standard positions pre-and post-rebuild support this, as do the T-shaped strapping on the rebuilt vans, where the new veranda had to be attached to the existing bodywork. This is at the single-crossbar end.

Edited by Skinnylinny
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Dunsignalling

Dunsignalling

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5 minutes ago, Mr chapman said:

Everyone confident it's a 6 wheeler then? Not the dance hall from about the same time period as the goods vans? 

It makes sense not to duplicate yet another kit when there's a prototype that's not available in r-t-r or kit form (the discontinued D&S kit apart). Especially when 6-wheelers generally haven't been done r-t-r (the Oxford GWR Toad being the only other one that springs easily to mind).

 

Also, of course, the Cambrian Dancehall kit can also be made up as the rebuilt departmental version which would need significant extra tooling to do r-t-r.

 

John 

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Graham_Muz

Graham_Muz

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13 minutes ago, Mr chapman said:

Everyone confident it's a 6 wheeler then? Not the dance hall from about the same time period as the goods vans? 

 

1 minute ago, Dunsignalling said:

It makes sense not to duplicate yet another kit when there's a prototype that's not available in r-t-r or kit form (the discontinued D&S kit apart). Especially when 6-wheelers generally haven't been done r-t-r (the Oxford GWR Toad being the only other one that springs easily to mind).

 

Also, of course, the Cambrian Dancehall kit can also be made up as the rebuilt departmental version which would need significant extra tooling to do r-t-r.

 

John 

 

I suggest you watch the video in the OP... 

 

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MarkSG

MarkSG

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16 hours ago, Aire Head said:

Guess I better get these LMS vans finished then and take one for the team :jester:

 

Any chance you could build a couple of GE vans as well, and maybe an E4, while you're at it?

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phil-b259

phil-b259

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1 hour ago, No Decorum said:

Very welcome news. There is now a wide selection of SECR goods vehicles, beginning with the Bachmann triple set of non-SECR open wagons with SECR liveries. Locomotives too. A brake van is long overdue.

 

Indeed

 

Is the SECR going to be the 1st pre-grouping company where a compressive range (i.e. Locos, coaching stock and freight stock) is going to be available RTR?

Edited by phil-b259
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JSpencer

JSpencer

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1 hour ago, No Decorum said:

Very welcome news. There is now a wide selection of SECR goods vehicles, beginning with the Bachmann triple set of non-SECR open wagons with SECR liveries. Locomotives too. A brake van is long overdue.

 

There were the odd Dapol wagons in SECR colours first, normally as limited editions, then these Bachmann collector club items appeared at roughly the same time as the grey SECR C class (as they were generally bigger than most SECR wagons prior to - say - 1917 - they could pass as the later types that Rapido are doing).

The company that cannot be named did one, generally the right size and early SECR era but with wrong brake gear... and there was also a Dapol limited addition for a small model shop in the south only last year....

A nice bunch of stand ins but I don't see myself wanting to mix these with proper SECR wagons.

 

You could supplement these stand ins with various other vans and open wagons done in private owner liveries dating from that time (simply southern recently released a Queenborough Portland cement van with apex roof based on the Dapol dublo salt wagon!!) done by various makes including the nameless one... which TBH are way too big and look like giants next actual LCDR/SER/SECR pre 1916 rolling stock.

 

Finally last year we finally had Rails/Dapol 3D printed vans (though the roofs have cracked painting on all of them now in my case). Which really helped and now proper SECR wagons and vans in injection moulded form Rapido, even if they are mostly apt for SECR grey...

Vans covered only a small proportion of wagons on the SECR, and really you would want a train weighted at about 70-80% opens (with tarpaulins in most cases) to look SECR especially in the early days.

 

The brake van covers the full SECR era and maybe SER days too. And I'll be buying everyone in SER and SECR colours, plus maybe a BR one.

For the Dance hall, well the Cambrian kit can fill that gap.

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Skinnylinny

Skinnylinny

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59 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

 

Indeed

 

Is the SECR going to be the 1st pre-grouping company where a compressive range (i.e. Locos, coaching stock and freight stock) is going to be available RTR?


I think the Linton & Barnstaple Railway pips it to the post, with locos available from Heljan, carriages, wagons, and brake vans from Peco, and even some RTP buildings by Bachmann. All in pre-grouping guise! But as for standard gauge, maybe? Does pre-1923 GWR count?

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