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Z21 (black) and programming CV's


E Greene
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Hi

 

I've had it a year and locos, signals and points all work fine using it.  I decided to change some of the cvs (speed, etc) so put a loco (several) on the programming track and the light went green but it will not read any cv.  The circle spins for a couple of minutes but says cant find loco.  I tried POM and the same it cannot see anything.  I have an NCE powercab on the other layout and that works fine programming anything.  Can anyone point me how to get the CV function to work as it should.  I'm at a loss as why it wont work as it is fine at controlling the locos for running.  

 

An example a loco is set up and controlled on address 5 on the main screen but when I put the loco on programming, address 5 it does not see anything.

 

Firmware version 1.42

Hardware version Z21b

 

Thanks Eddie 

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As Iain says, can you describe in detail how you are trying to program or read CV's? Are you using the App on a phone and which version of the app are you using?

 

6 hours ago, E Greene said:

when I put the loco on programming, address 5 it does not see anything.

So when you have a loco on the programming track there is no need to specify the address to program it.

 

On the new app with Z21 on a black background there are 3 options for CV programming, Loco(program track). Loco(POM), and Manual.

I am fairly sure that the first two options only work with Zimo decoders. So, if I were you, I would try the Manual option (and then select Program Track).

 

Regards,

 

John P

Edited by jpendle
Typo
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Hi

 

I'm using the Z21 new app.  I've written to Roco but hoped someone else had encountered the.  I've tried the manual option and say selected cv2 but it doesnt return any value.  I've got the app set up on android phone, a chromebook and two tablets which can all control the points, signals and locos fine. 

 

My other layout uses NCE powercab which works fine at programming the cvs. 

 

I've tried using manual set up but the read cv doesnt do anything .  Strange as when i set up the loco addresses and points/signals screens it accepted them fine.

 

Thank you for your kind help.

 

Eddie

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Hi,

 

We need a blow by blow account of what you are doing, the Z21 and the app work fine and I can read CV's with mine.

 

e.g.

 

Put loco on prog track

Select CV programming

Select Manual

etc 

etc

 

As the NCE is on another layout have you made sure that your programming track connected to the Z21 is clean?

 

Regards,

 

John P

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5 hours ago, jpendle said:

 have you made sure that your programming track connected to the Z21 is clean?

I have found that when using the programming track with a Z21 you really do need 100% continuity between the Z21 & the decoder - sometimes, it helps to excert a very gentle downwards pressure on the locomotive when writing or (especially) reading CV's.

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Thanks Gents, but I'm getting nothing at all from the programming.  

 

The Z21 light will go green (and on the top right of the control panel) but it will not read any cv or loco.  It says there is no loco or cv for your selection.  I know the loco is 5 as thats what it is assigned on the main screen and responds to the throttle and light functions no problem.  But when i try it on the manual screen for loco 5 and any cv it says there is nothing there.

 

Hopefully Roco will come back with a fix but I am not impressed with an item that costs £360 (probably more now) that can't just do its functions without having to ask other kind people to help.

 

Thanks Eddie

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A couple of things...

 

1 -  I suspect the problem is sequence of doing things, which might be somewhat pedantic (but I was trying to use a different brand of system yesterday, one which is very 1990's in the way it works, and that was also annoyingly pedantic.)

 

2 - Iain's example of POM reading of CV's relies on three things to make RailCom work, with is necessary for POM reading of CVs: 
a)  RailCom capable decoder (European brands of decoder tend to be RailCom capable, decoders from elsewhere are more likely to be not able to do RailCom)
b)  RailCom enabled in the decoder (usually default to "on" in decoders which are RailCom capable, but programming them elsewhere might change CV29 to turn it off)
c)  RailCom enabled in the Z21 system (which I think is the default setting).   

 

 

- Nigel

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Nigel,

 

POM, whilst your comments are valid, is a red herring here as I only used it to show that the app works correctly when used with a Z21. 

 

If programming on the programming track is required then all @E Greene needs to do is choose Program Track rather than Program on Main and programming of CVs will work using a Z21 - assuming that the programming track is connected to the correct Z21 output, the loco is on the programming track, with clean wheels on a clean track.

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2 hours ago, E Greene said:

But when i try it on the manual screen for loco 5 and any cv it says there is nothing there.

This sounds like you are using POM, so if the loco is on the programming track then it won't be seen.

That's why I asked before for you to give us a step by step account of what you are doing so that we can work out what you are doing wrong.

 

If your loco is on the programming track then from the CV programming screen that Iain shows you need to select Program Track.

After that you just select the CV that you want to read or write, YOU WON'T NEED TO SPECIFY THE LOCO ADDRESS.

 

Regards,

 

John P

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John

 

if the Green Light appears in the Z21 then he is not using PoM, but the programming track.

 

I suspect that he is using the wrong option to start the process hence the Z21 not ‘finding’ the loco. The Manual option must be chosen as has been said several times.

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I'm with John on this, what you have described so far doesn't add up.  Firstly, are you sure you are using a separate programming track which is completely isolated from the rest of the layout?  If so, why have you put several locos on it at once - that won't work unless you are wanting to reset them all and then program them all the same. Try doing one loco at a time on the programming track.

 

First, once you have one loco on the track, go to cv programming and touch the loco (program) button top right.  The, try to read the loco properties. That may or may not work depending upon your decoders. I mainly use Zimo and they always read. Assuming that this doesn't work, click on the manual button at the top of the screen.  Now this is the point where you may be going wrong. Once you click on manual it defaults back to a POM screen. You now have to select program track in the left hand menu.  Once you are in the correct screen the top variable which it will ask you to enter is a cv value (NOT an address value). So, put in cv#1 and then click on the 'read' button. This should return the value set on your loco for cv#1 which is your address.  If you want to change the address then manually change the value and click on 'write'.  It's the same for any other cv values you want to read or change for that loco.    Enter the cv number, read it, write the new value.

 

The method you described of entering an address number and reading is the way you use the POM function. That's fine too if you want to program on the main track but you will need to check the cv#29 settings as Nigel has explained and just beware that this may not work with all decoders.  There's also an argument that if you don't need to use railcom then it's better to have it switched off anyway.  One of the big benefits of the Z21 over the z21 is that it has the separate program track output so you may aswell use it. You're less likely to get in a mess if you stick with one loco at a time on the program track.

 

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I have downloaded the new app and used it. When it comes to IT I am at best a light switch operator 3rd grade but I found the programming function straightforward. I like the fact that it now tells you the decoder make!

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Glad you have got it all working as it should. It's that bit where you go from program track to manual and it reverts back to a POM page that's confusing.  You're not a moron Eddie. If you were you wouldn't even have got as far as trying manual programming of cv values. It's all a learning curve for us all. Enjoy your Z21, it's a great bit of kit. 

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