Hornby Class 50 - faulty chassis

[vac_basher]

There has been some discussion in regards to whether the Hornby Class 50s have/don't have a problem with the chassis, similar to what the Heljan 47s were plagued with.

 

I can confirm that this problem definitely exists on some of my models and may need bringing to the manufactures attention. This is not what you expect on a model with a £95 price tag (and I have about 20 of them )

However it's not exactly the chassis which is bending/breaking. It seems to be the plate/cover that the lights are mounted on at either end of the chassis....

 

I first noticed a problem which I reported in this post: http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php/topic/366-Hornby-class-50s/page__view__findpost__p__131114

 

Earlier today I needed to remove the body of another of my Class 50s and noticed that the body was very tight. When I finally managed to get it off I discovered this:

 

I have since inspected the rest of my fleet of Hornby 50s and can report that the vast majority seem to not be affected, while 4 (50007 non-weathered version + the other 3 have been professionally repainted, so their original identity is lost) are definitely affected and another 2 (50031 & 50027) are showing signs that they most probably are breaking up.

 

My models have always been well cared for and have never been dropped or involved in collisions, as I rarely run then.

 

It sickens me to think that my 20 Hornby Class 50s may soon be fit for scrap.

I hope Hornby manage this issue as well as Heljan did, as unless this is sorted I certainly won't be purchasing any more of these models. I was lucky none of the bodies on mine were damaged.

 

Check yours and let us know how you get on.

 

Feeling very much like 50034 today, Furious

[Mod5]

OK having discussed this thread with the Admin Team in the time it has been removed from view on the forum we have agreed to replace it with a comment.

 

Thus forum is read by the Manufacturers and I think it is fair to say that comment on here can be influential in certain circumstances. What helps is when the subject matter is discussed in a calm and sensible manner without resorting to hysterics or scaremongering.

 

I can confirm that this problem definitely exists and we need to bring it to the manufactures attention.

 

Whilst we accept that you will of course be quite alarmed by this discovery it does not automatically mean that every other model is affected. Your mention of "we need to bring it to the attention of others" isn't very clear. Does that mean that you have or are in the process of contacting either the Manufacturer OR the Dealer that sold you the items? Or are you asking 'Us' to do this on your behalf?

 

Is in fact the problem linked to an over tight or misaligned screw as discussed in the thread you link to? Have you checked to see if the others are over tight or misaligned?

 

No one on the Admin Team would expect any member to put up with faulty goods. We do believe though that there is a way of dealing with these problems that is far more effective than posting a bold statement as a fact without evidence to support it.

 

So if other members check their own models it would be helpful if they could post in this topic and let us know if in fact they are suffering from this problem or not. If it appears that there is a wide spread problem then of course any evidence collected here could be very useful for Hornby in their investigations.

 

This is also a good time to point out that the Dealer is always your first port of call to discuss any problems and your rights are well covered by legislation. Once a dealer has had opportunity to examine any defective model it is then up to them to deal with the Manufacturer. Your contract is with the Dealer and not the Manufacturer.

 

We would not wish to stifle genuine criticism if a problem exists but by the same token we will not tolerate wild unsubstantiated accusations.

[vac_basher]

For a while, when my post wasn't appearing you had me worried about my freedom of speach rights

 

Please don't take the follwoing the wrong way, as I'm not bickering. I'm just trying to clarify any initial misunderstandings there may have been in my original post.

 

Whilst we accept that you will of course be quite alarmed by this discovery it does not automatically mean that every other model is affected. Your mention of "we need to bring it to the attention of others" isn't very clear. Does that mean that you have or are in the process of contacting either the Manufacturer OR the Dealer that sold you the items? Or are you asking 'Us' to do this on your behalf?

 

Of course not all models are affected. In fact, I did mention that only a small minority of my Class 50s are affected.

And of course I wasn't asking "you" to contact the dealer and/or manufactor for me

 

 

Have you checked to see if the others are over tight or misaligned??

 

No, I have not checked the torque of the screw. As can be seen in the third photo, these plates/covers don't always beging to break around the screw. From my point of view I really can't seem to see how the screw could be the source of the problem.

 

We do believe though that there is a way of dealing with these problems that is far more effective than posting a bold statement as a fact without evidence to support it.

 

...will not tolerate wild unsubstantiated accusations

 

Did you see the photos?

 

So if other members check their own models it would be helpful if they could post in this topic and let us know if in fact they are suffering from this problem or not.??

 

Appologies if I wasn't clear, but this is the main objective I had in mind with my original post.

[10800]

And of course I wasn't asking "you" to contact the dealer and/or manufactor for me

 

You weren't exactly clear what you meant by 'we' either

 

 

Appologies if I wasn't clear, but this is the main objective I had in mind with my original post.

 

Not quite, you appeared to be asking for others to get on to Hornby and report back: "Check yours and bring the problem to Hornbys attention. Let us know how you get on."

[vac_basher]

Right Rod, I see what you mean. I could have phrased that better really.

Sorry for the confussion!

 

P.S.: Great avatar of the Western on the seawall. I've just ordered one in the same livery, which I'm going to renumber to D1062 B)

[Red Baron]

From my perspective I am pleased the potential issue has been raised... I take issue with the thread subtitle. as there is not a definte problem until we see repetition on other 50's elsewhere. Please dont think I am in any way denying that there is a definite problem with the models in your photos but as yet we have no proof there is a definite problem with the model en mass.

 

I would suggest that the title is edited pending further evidence. Have other forums been searched? Are there other similar examples elsewhere?

[vac_basher]

Fair enough. I'll edit the subtitle in a moment. It would (indeed, could!) be very bad luck if just mine were affected

 

I've searched the old RMweb and there doesn't seem to be much mention of this.

[Mod5]

For a while, when my post wasn't appearing you had me worried about my freedom of speach rights

 

Lets be straight about this so there is no misunderstanding. I take into account your use of smilies before I say that on this forum as I suspect is true on all other forums there is no right of free speech. What is posted on here is always subject to the approval of the forum owner Andy. He is the one who ends up in court if it goes wrong so he has the ultimate say.

 

Please don't take the follwoing the wrong way, as I'm not bickering. I'm just trying to clarify any initial misunderstandings there may have been in my original post.Of course not all models are affected. In fact, I did mention that only a small minority of my Class 50s are affected.And of course I wasn't asking "you" to contact the dealer and/or manufactor for me

 

As picked up by Rod you were not clear in your initial post and I see now that you accept that.

 

No, I have not checked the torque of the screw. As can be seen in the third photo, these plates/covers don't always beging to break around the screw. From my point of view I really can't seem to see how the screw could be the source of the problem.

 

Since the thread that you linked to referred to the screw I merely asked had you checked that. I did not say that was the problem as I am not qualified to do so. Once again seeking the assistance of the supplying dealer can only be to your advantage here.

 

Did you see the photos?

 

Yes I did and I am assuming here as it is not clear that you are referring to my mention of wild unsubstantiated accusations. Your photos prove little on their own other than there is a problem with that model in the photo. Wild accusations come from as has been pointed out the title of the thread and statements within it such as definitely exists.

 

Appologies if I wasn't clear, but this is the main objective I had in mind with my original post.

 

I accept your apology but would now urge you to think a little before you use this forum for such threads in future. You have in your means the ability to approach the supplying dealer with your models and discuss the problem with them. Once you have done that then maybe you would be able to come back and let the members know what has been said. It is pointless you or anyone at this stage contacting Hornby but that does not mean that it is ruled out. Do some work yourself and then you may well be in a stronger position to approach Hornby if you need to.

 

As I said before if others wish to check their models and come back to the thread and post that would be helpful.

[vac_basher]

Totally agree Mod5.

I'm glad everything has been cleared up.

[D400]

Totally agree Mod5.

I'm glad everything has been cleared up.

 

Okay I don't wish to get involved to some political argument, however I have experienced exactly the same problem myself - the model concerned was a 50002 Superb in Revised NSE. Same component (what shall we call it chaps? light mounting board?) crumbled to nothing at all.

 

Unfortunately the loco was an ebay purchase so I didn't have a dealer to contact - and I didn't feel it was particularly fair to place any blame on the person selling the model!

 

I have since purchased a bit of a wreck of a Hornby Class 50 which I've stripped down to provide spares to my ever increasing fleet (Laira would be proud - bit of component recovery maintenance )- it donated its light mounting boards to repair the aforementioned chassis - the broken part has long since gone in the bin too I'm afraid (in about a 100 small pieces!)

 

To date this is the only one of my class 50s to be effected, and like I'm sure everyone, I hope it is the only one effected. If parting the body and chassis is even slightly harder than dead easy then chances are something is miss...

 

If Hornby were to provide support for this to their advantage is the fact that unlike other models effected with metal fatigue - the part effected is non-structural and pretty straightforward to replace.

 

Regards,

Bruce

[Red Baron]

Okay I don't wish to get involved to some political argument, however I have experienced exactly the same problem myself - the model concerned was a 50002 Superb in Revised NSE. Same component (what shall we call it chaps? light mounting board?) crumbled to nothing at all.

 

Unfortunately the loco was an ebay purchase so I didn't have a dealer to contact - and I didn't feel it was particularly fair to place any blame on the person selling the model!

 

I have since purchased a bit of a wreck of a Hornby Class 50 which I've stripped down to provide spares to my ever increasing fleet (Laira would be proud - bit of component recovery maintenance )- it donated its light mounting boards to repair the aforementioned chassis - the broken part has long since gone in the bin too I'm afraid (in about a 100 small pieces!)

 

To date this is the only one of my class 50s to be effected, and like I'm sure everyone, I hope it is the only one effected. If parting the body and chassis is even slightly harder than dead easy then chances are something is miss...

 

If Hornby were to provide support for this to their advantage is the fact that unlike other models effected with metal fatigue - the part effected is non-structural and pretty straightforward to replace.

 

Regards,

Bruce

 

 

Interesting - so 2 people have similar issues on a small percentage of 50's I would suspect Hornby will come across this thread and if the instances do continue to surface then they will have to make a decision. What would be interesting to hear is if someone who has had the problem and reported to Hornby or most likely their suppling dealer and got a response?

[Mod2]

I would suspect Hornby will come across this thread and if the instances do continue to surface then they will have to make a decision.

 

I'd suggest that the topic dealing with similar issues on the 31s should be seen as a possible example (note, I'm not using the term 'precedent'). If (stress 'if') sufficient evidence of widespread problems comes to light, it may (stress 'may') be possible to make an approach, but as ever it will be Andy's call. At the moment we are very wary of the possibility of people jumping up and down in the expectation that Hornby's board of directors are hanging on our every word

[Tony Walker]

As it happens, I've recently been amending the lighting circuits on my fleet of 5 class 50's. When I started to work on the light board on 50007 I had the same problem with the coupling cover/light mounting board. Both ends just crumbled away.

I gave Hornby a ring, as I couldn't see the part on the parts list from their website and chatted to a very helpful guy. He said that the part was not available as a spare and suggested either, return the loco to Hornby with a note as to the problem and they would sort it out, or give East Kent a ring, as occasionally they have "odd" locos they strip for spares and may be able to supply me with the parts. I did try East Kent but didn't get any joy.

Rather than risking sending the loco away, I decided to make my own from some stiff plastic. The big problem I had was using one of the broken one's as a template and ended up taking a good one out of another 50 to use as a template. The other porblem was making the upstand parts to locate the light board. Anyway, all worked out well in the end and I don't need to worry about them again, as the plastic won't crumble in the future.

So if you do contact Hornby with this one, then they will sort it out for you and, from my conversation with them, they are aware of it.

[trisonic]

In the world of guitars there have been some instances of "plastic" pickguards crumbling whilst the guitar was in it's case - most instances this was caused by out-gassing from new plastic in a very enclosed area.

The solution was take the things out of their cases and play them.

The manufacturers suggested that they would investigate a different material but the guitarists were then "up in arms" because it wasn't original......

 

Sometimes it can be wise to look outside the box (sic).

 

Best, Pete.

[jonathan452]

Is this problem likely to include Blue BR 50013 Aingcourt?

[jixer]

To me this is quite interesting. Exactly the same thing happened on my 50007. I can confirm it was nothing to do with over-torqueing or mis-aligning a screw. Rather, the metal had what can best be described as visible 'fault lines' all through it, whilst other parts had shattered and/or turned to powder. I have to say that I didn't contact Hornby because I had a spare chassis that I was 'trimming' for use under a Lima body, so it handily provided the spare parts for 50007.

[vac_basher]

Jonathan, who knows? The best thing for you to do would be to take the body off and take a peak....

[vac_basher]

I got my response from Hornby:

 

Thank you for your email.

We do not supply spares directly from ourselves and so I would recommend contacting a service dealer for the parts you require. One I can recommend trying is East Kent Models

Kind regards,

Customer Care

 

 

What would ones consumer rights be in a situation like this?

[Mod2]

 

What would ones consumer rights be in a situation like this?

 

Vac, you have already been advised what your rights are - very clearly - by my colleague earlier in the topic:

 

This is also a good time to point out that the Dealer is always your first port of call to discuss any problems and your rights are well covered by legislation. Once a dealer has had opportunity to examine any defective model it is then up to them to deal with the Manufacturer. Your contract is with the Dealer and not the Manufacturer.

 

As a) you haven't provided the text of the message to Hornby that led to this response, so we can't make any intelligent judgement, b ) you seem to have gone against both the above advice and that provided by another member and c) there is so far no huge amount of evidence of any widespread issue, I'm locking the topic until the admin team have had time to discuss it further. I will say though that you personally are now absorbing far too much of our freely given time with this.

 

Thanks.