Transpennine Upgrade : Manchester/Leeds

[JeffP]

I keep reading about Liverpool and Manchester to Hull.

Why does no-one mention the south bank of the Humber, which generates many more lorry loads per day from it's myriad docks at Immingham, Grimsby, Stallingborough and Killingholme, not to mention the still impottant steel plant at Scunthorpe and the refineries at Immingham and Killingholme.

The M180/A180 is filled with lorries many of which end up on one or the other Pennine routes west.

Hull generates far less, even though the population is higher.

But I've never once seen anyone even mention electrifying the southern route.

About the only thing Hull has is a trio of very vociferous MP's.

 

 

[Mark Saunders]

29 minutes ago, JeffP said:

I keep reading about Liverpool and Manchester to Hull.

Why does no-one mention the south bank of the Humber, which generates many more lorry loads per day from it's myriad docks at Immingham, Grimsby, Stallingborough and Killingholme, not to mention the still impottant steel plant at Scunthorpe and the refineries at Immingham and Killingholme.

The M180/A180 is filled with lorries many of which end up on one or the other Pennine routes west.

Hull generates far less, even though the population is higher.

But I've never once seen anyone even mention electrifying the southern route.

About the only thing Hull has is a trio of very vociferous MP's.

 

 

The only place most people may have heard of in North Lincolnshire is Cleethorpes and to prove how bad it is the spellcheck hasn’t either !

[DavidLong]

Isn't the M180 going to be the site of the road overhead electrification experiment to be used by trucks?

 

David

[DavidLong]

Here's the link:

https://trans.info/en/uk-government-to-fund-electric-road-system-trial-on-m180-near-scunthorpe-248190

 

There was also an episode of Gareth Dennis' Rail Natter about it.

 

David

[Titan]

1 hour ago, JeffP said:

I keep reading about Liverpool and Manchester to Hull.

Why does no-one mention the south bank of the Humber, which generates many more lorry loads per day from it's myriad docks at Immingham, Grimsby, Stallingborough and Killingholme, not to mention the still impottant steel plant at Scunthorpe and the refineries at Immingham and Killingholme.

The M180/A180 is filled with lorries many of which end up on one or the other Pennine routes west.

Hull generates far less, even though the population is higher.

But I've never once seen anyone even mention electrifying the southern route.

About the only thing Hull has is a trio of very vociferous MP's.

 

 

 

Freight does not vote. Customers (Passengers) have many more votes.

[woodenhead]

3 hours ago, JeffP said:

I keep reading about Liverpool and Manchester to Hull.

Why does no-one mention the south bank of the Humber, which generates many more lorry loads per day from it's myriad docks at Immingham, Grimsby, Stallingborough and Killingholme, not to mention the still impottant steel plant at Scunthorpe and the refineries at Immingham and Killingholme.

The M180/A180 is filled with lorries many of which end up on one or the other Pennine routes west.

Hull generates far less, even though the population is higher.

But I've never once seen anyone even mention electrifying the southern route.

About the only thing Hull has is a trio of very vociferous MP's.

 

 

Because generally freight does not get moved by electrics, the WCML is the anomaly, but most are still hauled by diesels and will be for a few more years yet.  The days of changing traction as a matter of course are long gone, unless there is an economic reason for doing so.

[jamie92208]

In France we are increasingly seeing a dead diesel tucked in behind the main line electrics, prsesumably to move the train the 'last mile'.

 

Jamie

Edited January 8, 2022 by jamie92208

[jamie92208]

Whilst people are looking at this thread, I wondered if anyone has noticed any progress with the York, Church Fenton electrification.  I was hoping to get over that way at Christmas but Covid put paid to ourctravel plans. I see that NR are posting their work schedule every month.

 

Jamie

[d winpenny]

4 hours ago, jamie92208 said:

Whilst people are looking at this thread, I wondered if anyone has noticed any progress with the York, Church Fenton electrification.  I was hoping to get over that way at Christmas but Covid put paid to ourctravel plans. I see that NR are posting their work schedule every month.

 

Jamie

From what I have seen the knitting is still not up beyond the portals already up they appear to be upgrading a lot of the line side troughing but beyond that I can’t tell 

[Edwin_m]

1 hour ago, d winpenny said:

From what I have seen the knitting is still not up beyond the portals already up they appear to be upgrading a lot of the line side troughing but beyond that I can’t tell 

I read on another forum that signals are also being replaced.  Not sure if this is to make them AC immune, because of sighting issues when the OLE is added or both, but if the OLE supports appeared first probably the former.  Immunisation may well involve replacing the trackside cables so that might also explain the troughing work,  

[jamie92208]

12 minutes ago, Edwin_m said:

I read on another forum that signals are also being replaced.  Not sure if this is to make them AC immune, because of sighting issues when the OLE is added or both, but if the OLE supports appeared first probably the former.  Immunisation may well involve replacing the trackside cables so that might also explain the troughing work,  

The monthly work schedules seem to include a lot of troughing and resignalling work.

 

Jamie

[kevpeo]

First steel work is up in the west side it seems

 

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/jake-berry-515a4b137_ole-ocs-electrification-activity-6891042797110009856-yYcE

 

And a bridge has been taken out this weekend on the Bolton to Wigan scheme.

[kevpeo]

First steel work is up in the west side it seems

 

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/jake-berry-515a4b137_ole-ocs-electrification-activity-6891042797110009856-yYcE

 

And a bridge has been taken out this weekend on the Bolton to Wigan scheme.

[4630]

20 minutes ago, kevpeo said:

 

 

And a bridge has been taken out this weekend on the Bolton to Wigan scheme.

 

Chew Bridge at Westhaughton for anyone interested, with details from Network Rail here.

[Mike Storey]

3 hours ago, 4630 said:

 

Chew Bridge at Westhaughton for anyone interested, with details from Network Rail here.

 

Maybe this has been mentioned before, but I cannot find it. This appears to be part of a series of projects called (by Network Rail) the Great North Rail Project. According to its website, ( https://www.networkrail.co.uk/running-the-railway/railway-upgrade-plan/key-projects/great-north-rail-project/ ) by 2022, these will "have delivered a multi-billion pound package of improvements". Not sure when that was written....

 

Not to be mixed up with the Trans-Pennine Upgrade Project, which still has its own thread and does not even mention the GNRP.

 

Shome confusion here shurely??

 

[4630]

1 hour ago, Mike Storey said:

 

Maybe this has been mentioned before, but I cannot find it. This appears to be part of a series of projects called (by Network Rail) the Great North Rail Project. According to its website, ( https://www.networkrail.co.uk/running-the-railway/railway-upgrade-plan/key-projects/great-north-rail-project/ ) by 2022, these will "have delivered a multi-billion pound package of improvements". Not sure when that was written....

 

Not to be mixed up with the Trans-Pennine Upgrade Project, which still has its own thread and does not even mention the GNRP.

 

Shome confusion here shurely??

 

 

You're right of course Mike.

 

But I think all that this does is highlight again the 'stop-go' nature of electrification in this part of the network over the last 20 years (at least!), resulting in the changing plans, phasing and scope of individual schemes, against a backdrop of the (regular) changing in direction of Department for Transport priorities for rail.

 

As far as the actual Trans-Pennine Route Upgrade (TRU) is concerned, I've reached the stage now where I'll believe it's happening when I see a few masts somewhere anywhere between Copley Hill East Junction at Leeds (the current limit of the OLE along the Huddersfield line) and Huddersfield station!

 

My cynicism apart, there must be some confidence that the TRU will happen as a tender invitation has very recently been issued for 15-30* Bi-mode locomotives for TransPennine Express.  See here for the tender details.

 

*plus an additional five for Great Western Railway for use on the sleeper service.

 

 

Edited January 24, 2022 by 4630

[jamie92208]

That's an interesting contract. I suspect that an uprated class 88 would fit the bill. Isn't the proposed Class 93 something like that.

 

Jamie

[mac1960]

4630

I read something on BBC business  this morning showing the extension of HS2 stopping in Marsden , I nearly wrecked my keyboard. Now I know Marsden maybe slightly important in the Colne valley but I do not think it requires a high speed link to London but very handy for my commute if the train would actually stop there .

Cheers

Mac

[Grovenor]

20 hours ago, Mike Storey said:

 

Maybe this has been mentioned before, but I cannot find it. This appears to be part of a series of projects called (by Network Rail) the Great North Rail Project. According to its website, ( https://www.networkrail.co.uk/running-the-railway/railway-upgrade-plan/key-projects/great-north-rail-project/ ) by 2022, these will "have delivered a multi-billion pound package of improvements". Not sure when that was written....

 

Not to be mixed up with the Trans-Pennine Upgrade Project, which still has its own thread and does not even mention the GNRP.

 

Shome confusion here shurely??

 

From your link the GNRP seems to be the TPU plus a couple of lifts at Macclesfield and a couple of level crossings at Southport. So effectively 98% TPU.

[Mike Storey]

On 25/01/2022 at 14:19, Grovenor said:

From your link the GNRP seems to be the TPU plus a couple of lifts at Macclesfield and a couple of level crossings at Southport. So effectively 98% TPU.

 

Indeed, from just what is currently posted. But the TPU is stated as just York to Manchester, not even Liverpool. So the GNRP must be much greater than that. It is just invisible. Strange.

 

[jamie92208]

Perhaps when the long awaited levelling up repirt is supposedly published tomorrow we may get more promises. Could this be to take flak away from a certain person.

 

Jamie

[JeffP]

Looking at that tender document, we might see some of those through Scunny.

Edited January 28, 2022 by JeffP

[jamie92208]

I finallly got chance this month to mskecour trip to see the family and distribute Christmas presents.  Todsy I was sble to have a day out on my own and went to York. En route I called at Church Fenton, Ulleskelf and Colton junction to look at progress. This was the view looking north from Church Fenton.  The scheme seems to stop just north of the station. Here 195 118 is heading for Blackpool.

A closer view of the very substatial looking steelwork.

And this view of the works just south of the end of the steelwork.

I haven't got any editing software with me to dumb the photos down so I'll have to do another post.

 

Jamie

Edited April 8, 2022 by jamie92208

[jamie92208]

Part 2  

 

3 more this time at Colton Junction.  Here is the view looking south.

And the view north towards the junction and York.

And a close up of what NR calls the small parts steelwork in place.  It's good to see that all four tracks are being wired.

 

There seems to be 1 wire running down the west side of the gantries.  Good to see work progressing.

 

Jamie

 

 

Edited April 8, 2022 by jamie92208

[Edwin_m]

Even allowing for the long lens, those structures look nearly as ugly as the GW ones and considerably worse than those installed northwards from Bedford.