Modelling Spam Cans (Bulleid Pacifics)

[Dunsignalling]

9 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

Note also the air-brake pump to side of headboard.

 

John

[Dunsignalling]

On ‎09‎/‎08‎/‎2019 at 15:32, roundhouse said:

The latest Bulleid light Pacific on the workbench. This started off as a second hand Winston Churchill and has RT models ashpans and drain off pipes added. I just need to find a spare tender step.

Nameplates are from Fox. Chassis weathering has commenced with the body and tender next

Nice lost-wax brass replacement steps are obtainable from RT Models.

 

A decent representation of the weather cover between tender and loco can be cut from cycle inner-tube repair sheet which is suitably ribbed on the grey side. I glue it beneath the little roof on the tender and tuck the other end under the cab. 

 

The stuff also makes good fall-plates that don't cause derailments by binding as rigid ones sometimes do.

 

John

 

Note: This example has gone a bit droopy but it has been on there about 17 years....

 

Long enough for quite a lot of my weathering to have gone AWOL also!

Edited September 16, 2019 by Dunsignalling
Added photo

[Dunsignalling]

On ‎14‎/‎09‎/‎2019 at 01:01, autocoach said:

If you are looking for the original Southern Railway "square" cab which many WC/BB's ran with up until the early 1950's, the only source is RT Models who are supposed to debut their new etchings for the square cab and original smoke deflectors at the next Scale Forum. See this link. Anyway, RT Models makes most of the original Albert Goodall add on parts for the WC/BB Hornby locomotives.  The V shape cab was not introduced until 1947 so there would be a small window for a few locomotives with the current Hornby WC/BB cab and Southern livery Bulleid coaches.  I will be purchasing the RT cab and smoke deflector but would rather Hornby released a square cab version of the WC/BB as they did with the recent Merchant Navy.  Or someone make a 3 D print replacement cab. 

Tangmere never carried the original style of SR cab, the last to have one as-built was 34064 Fighter Command and that was modified to the v-fronted pattern before the loco entered service.

 

Many people assume the revised arrangement was a BR idea, but they began to appear from the summer of 1947.

 

John

[Dunsignalling]

On ‎13‎/‎01‎/‎2019 at 13:01, Staffordshire said:

   Hello again, thanks for all the help in the past.....

 

   I have a couple of questions regarding 34107  Blandford Forum  ......

 

   Firstly am I right in assuming that this was the only West Country that was not rebuilt and had a 9ft , 5500 gallon cutdown tender ?   Or were there others ? 

 

   Also does anybody know the dates that the Nameplates were changed from Black to Red etc ...

 

   I am hoping to create Blandford Forum in her final days, so need all the help I can get !

 

   Many thanks.

 

   Photo of rebuilt Merchant Navy 35030 attached .....

Five non-rebuilt Light Pacifics retained 5500 gallon tenders to withdrawal, those paired with 34091 Weymouth, 34099 Lynmouth and 34102 Lapford (as well as Blandford Forum) in cut down form. IIRC the tenders were modified quite late (1961 or thereabouts), though.

 

The one attached to 34078 222 Squadron kept the high sides throughout its service. 

 

Hornby have done three out of the five locos. Just Lynmouth and Lapford to go....

 

John

[leopardml2341]

23 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

 I take it you want to model Tangmere as she is today...........

 

John

Not quite John, I 'have' Tangmere, but I was hoping to model Lapford from it.

 

Trouble is steam locomotives aren't really my Forte, and it looks like the loco may not be the bargain I thought it was.

 

Thanks everyone for the information, I'm certainly learning.

 

[Gibbo675]

12 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

Note also the air-brake pump to side of headboard.

 

John

Hi John,

 

It would seem that my original post about the sitting of the air pump and the reasons for its repositioning have disappeared down the "Memory Hole" !!!

 

Gibbo.

[30368]

If I may, thought I would add to the topic with a few pics of my originals. 

35009 is a PDK kit, 35009 kept its original cab until early 1953 when it was shopped and had the wedge cab fitted and a coat of Brunswick Green. 

 

 

 

 

 

35030 is a Millholme white metal kit which was built many years ago but runs well.

Another Millholme kit awaits completion which will be a series 1 locomotive later in life. 

All the contributors have covered the Hornby variations very well so I'll not repeat all your good work with my lot!

 

Kind regards,

 

Richard B

 

 

[Dunsignalling]

10 hours ago, leopardml2341 said:

Not quite John, I 'have' Tangmere, but I was hoping to model Lapford from it.

 

Trouble is steam locomotives aren't really my Forte, and it looks like the loco may not be the bargain I thought it was.

 

Thanks everyone for the information, I'm certainly learning.

 

If you want to do Lapford, you'll need a 605 Squadron for up to mid-1961 with high sides to the tender, and either Weymouth or Blandford Forum if you want it after that with the tender cut-down. 

 

The better news is that either version of Tangmere is suitable for a fair number of other class members. My R2221 is now Hawkinge (with the tender emblem changed to the later one) and my ex-train pack version has been kept as Tangmere.

 

Be careful, though. this can rapidly become a hobby within a hobby - my own Light Pacific stud (original and rebuilt) has grown to 32 almost without me noticing.

 

I still have a stash of three Wiltons on the way to becoming Tavistock, Seaton, and Chard, plus a Yes Tor destined to make Lord Dowding (the last was to have been Axminster but I acquired one (ex-Plymouth) that had already been "seen to". Then I want an Exeter or a Camelford to become Salisbury and another Trevone to make Tamar Valley.

 

Then I intend to stop. Honest...

 

John

[Dunsignalling]

4 hours ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi John,

 

It would seem that my original post about the sitting of the air pump and the reasons for its repositioning have disappeared down the "Memory Hole" !!!

 

Gibbo.

I think that was possibly before I started following this topic, So I'd better go back and look for it.

 

Does my 2013 photo show it as repositioned or was it moved after that?

 

John

[leopardml2341]

45 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

If you want to do Lapford, you'll need a 605 Squadron for up to mid-1961 with high sides to the tender, and either Weymouth or Blandford Forum if you want it after that with the tender cut-down. 

 

The better news is that either version of Tangmere is suitable for a fair number of other class members. My R2221 is now Hawkinge (with the tender emblem changed to the later one) and my ex-train pack version has been kept as Tangmere.

 

Be careful, though. this can rapidly become a hobby within a hobby - my own Light Pacific stud (original and rebuilt) has grown to 32 almost without me noticing.

John

Hello and thanks again John.

 

The reason I want to do Lapford is that it ran right up to the end and therefore fits my modelling period, better start looking for a body or buy another one and sell on the Tangmere.

 

So it IS sadly proving not to be the bargain I thought

 

The danger of buying on a whim.

 

Edited September 15, 2019 by leopardml2341

[Gibbo675]

1 hour ago, Dunsignalling said:

I think that was possibly before I started following this topic, So I'd better go back and look for it.

 

Does my 2013 photo show it as repositioned or was it moved after that?

 

John

It was to the very same post that you have just replied to.

The truth is a dirty word !

[Dunsignalling]

34 minutes ago, leopardml2341 said:

Hello and thanks again John.

 

The reason I want to do Lapford is that it ran right up to the end and therefore fits my modelling period, better start looking for a body or buy another one and sell on the Tangmere.

 

So it IS sadly proving not to be the bargain I thought

 

The danger of buying on a whim.

 

I see. Unfortunately all the locos your Tangmere could become seem to have been early candidates for withdrawal.

 

John

[RFS]

49 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

I see. Unfortunately all the locos your Tangmere could become seem to have been early candidates for withdrawal.

 

John

 

But what about 34023 Blackmore Vale? That too lasted until withdrawal in July 1967, and would match your period and had the same 8'6" body and tender. However the tender by then was the cut-down version which your model of Tangmere doesn't have, unless it's the one from the set. 

[leopardml2341]

Thanks.

 

Might look at that. Bit of modeller's license might be needed, because all the end of steam pics I've found so far show it relatively clean, whereas Lapford was filthy.

 

The tender on my Tangmere is a high sided one as well

 

Replacements seem to be like the proverbial rocking horse poo (or very expensive).

Edited September 15, 2019 by leopardml2341

[Dunsignalling]

13 minutes ago, leopardml2341 said:

Thanks.

 

Might look at that. Bit of modeller's license might be needed, because all the end of steam pics I've found so far show it relatively clean, whereas Lapford was filthy.

 

The tender on my Tangmere is a high sided one as well

 

Replacements seem to be like the proverbial rocking horse poo (or very expensive).

Also, when the tenders were cut-down, the cab-side lining was changed from horizontal stripes to a round-cornered rectangle.

 

If you wanted to do Blackmore Vale, the easiest starting point would be a Wilton which, like Tangmere, was one of the early releases, but seems to be easy enough to come by second hand. They seem to fetch the thick end of £100 in most cases, a good £20 more than they cost new. However, it's lot less than a new Bideford, which would be the current model to use.

 

I remember Blackmore Vale from 1962/3 when it was the roughest, most disreputable-looking thing imaginable, but I think it was possibly the last unmodified WC to receive a General overhaul, hence its long survival and smarter-than-average appearance. Such cleanliness, by 1967, was a sure indicator of recent employment on a railtour. 

 

John

[Dunsignalling]

53 minutes ago, RFS said:

 

But what about 34023 Blackmore Vale? That too lasted until withdrawal in July 1967, and would match your period and had the same 8'6" body and tender. However the tender by then was the cut-down version which your model of Tangmere doesn't have, unless it's the one from the set. 

I try to confine identity swaps on unmodified Light Pacifics to WC-to-WC and BB-to-BB.

 

It makes it rather less tricky to disguise any traces of what was on there before.

 

John

[roundhouse]

I picked up a 'Wilton' for £50 on Saturday. It looks in almost mint condition with little / no signs of being run and the details bag unopened. 'WIlton' is an older model so it will require a hard wired decoder and extra weight around the chimney to overcome the excessive compensation spring in the rear driver compared ot the more recent models but both easy for me to do.

 

There are only two unrebuilts left for me to be able ot use this for, 'Shaftsbury' (which would require the deflectors modifying) or 'Backmoor Vale'. It is going to be the latter once I complete 34081 '92 Squadron'

[Dunsignalling]

3 hours ago, roundhouse said:

I picked up a 'Wilton' for £50 on Saturday. It looks in almost mint condition with little / no signs of being run and the details bag unopened. 'WIlton' is an older model so it will require a hard wired decoder and extra weight around the chimney to overcome the excessive compensation spring in the rear driver compared ot the more recent models but both easy for me to do.

 

There are only two unrebuilts left for me to be able ot use this for, 'Shaftsbury' (which would require the deflectors modifying) or 'Backmoor Vale'. It is going to be the latter once I complete 34081 '92 Squadron'

You did very well with the Wilton, I'd have grabbed it too, for that! My most recent one (probably never out of the box) set me back £80 about 18 months ago, my cheapest £30 because somebody had started to prepare it for renumbering and given up. You can easily pay that for just a tender!

 

Prices seem generally to have firmed up somewhat lately, but there seems to be a ready supply. The first four (Wilton, Tangmere in Brunswick, Blackmore Vale, 92 Squadron in malachite) were produced in much greater numbers than has been the case more recently. Blackmore Vale, in particular seems to command higher prices, Tangmere a bit less, and 92 Squadron less again. Wiltons seem generally the cheapest (maybe the others all being preserved has an effect?) and real bargains do crop up (as you found) but if you want a decent one quickly £90+ will find one via the web pretty much instantly.

 

You almost certainly know this, but for the benefit of others, the thing to watch with the early releases is the connecting rod, which can get tangled up - later versions have an extra spacer and a longer bolt on the middle wheel. Preventive action (unless you are lucky enough to find a replacement set with the later bits) is to bow the rods outward slightly. 

 

Also, take care to lubricate before running. A little-used example that by now is over 15 years old will inevitably have stiffened up in its box (or, worse, a display cabinet). I neglected to do this with a s/h Weymouth and it cost me a new motor after a few months.

 

John

Edited September 16, 2019 by Dunsignalling

[John Tomlinson]

The other thing you can do with a "Wilton" is to take out the front driving axle and glue some thin plasticard spacers around the axle hole, shaped as a "U".

 

These will limit the sideplay on the front axle and lessen the risk of a mangled connecting rod.

 

I'm still trying to decide if the sprung rear driving axle on these early locos is a good thing or not. I think I'm beginning to conclude it is not, as the haulage capacity up my inclines isn't all it might be, despite extra weight in the bodyshell.

 

I am greatly enjoying this thread, though with a mere seven of the WC/ BB's with casing I'm barely a player!

 

John.

Edited September 16, 2019 by John Tomlinson
Thought I had five but missed two

[leopardml2341]

Thanks for all the guidance folks.

 

I've decided to 'back date' just a little so that brings 34002 Salisbury into play.

 

All I need now is a new cutdown tender, which it would seem is the same type as erroneously issued with Hornby's 34050 earlier this year:

 

 

(or someone to tell me that I can't do 34002 for a different reason).

 

Any offers?

 

Rgds,

Edited September 16, 2019 by leopardml2341

[roundhouse]

5 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

You did very well with the Wilton, I'd have grabbed it too, for that! My most recent one (probably never out of the box) set me back £80 about 18 months ago, my cheapest £30 because somebody had started to prepare it for renumbering and given up. You can easily pay that for just a tender!

 

Prices seem generally to have firmed up somewhat lately, but there seems to be a ready supply. The first four (Wilton, Tangmere in Brunswick, Blackmore Vale, 92 Squadron in malachite) were produced in much greater numbers than has been the case more recently. Blackmore Vale, in particular seems to command higher prices, Tangmere a bit less, and 92 Squadron less again. Wiltons seem generally the cheapest (maybe the others all being preserved has an effect?) and real bargains do crop up (as you found) but if you want a decent one quickly £90+ will find one via the web pretty much instantly.

 

You almost certainly know this, but for the benefit of others, the thing to watch with the early releases is the connecting rod, which can get tangled up - later versions have an extra spacer and a longer bolt on the middle wheel. Preventive action (unless you are lucky enough to find a replacement set with the later bits) is to bow the rods outward slightly. 

 

Also, take care to lubricate before running. A little-used example that by now is over 15 years old will inevitably have stiffened up in its box (or, worse, a display cabinet). I neglected to do this with a s/h Weymouth and it cost me a new motor after a few months.

 

John

Yes, one thing I always check is the connecting rods on early ones.

 

With 47 Bulleids I am not rushing out buying every one especially the recent release as I have already renumbered one to Bideford and at 180 quid (have seen it down to 146) I will now just buy second hand. It took me some weeks to service them all earlier this year but luckily just one that had seized up, requiring a new geared driving wheelset

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, leopardml2341 said:

Thanks for all the guidance folks.

 

I've decided to 'back date' just a little so that brings 34002 Salisbury into play.

 

All I need now is a new cutdown tender, which it would seem is the same type as erroneously issued with Hornby's 34050 earlier this year:

 

 

(or someone to tell me that I can't do 34002 for a different reason).

 

Any offers?

 

Rgds,

Salisbury lasted in service until April 1967 and its tender was cut late, too (March 1963)

 

Because it had a badge, you'll have no difficulty hiding where the BB one comes off.

 

The "wrong" tender body from the 34050 model is the correct sort, but the body-to-chassis fixings were changed when Hornby altered the tenders to accommodate DCC, so you'll have to fiddle with that. The cab-side lining will also need changing.

 

Other than that, you should be good to go.

 

John

Edited September 16, 2019 by Dunsignalling

[JohnR]

I am about to get up the nerves to tackle my first renaming - converting a Wilton into 34033 Chard, using the Modelmaster pack.

 

Any tips?

[Graham_Muz]

A line up of BoB’s on my Fisherton Sarum layout whilst exhibiting at the Faversham MRC exhibition on Sunday to commemorate it being Battle of Britain day. 

[Graham_Muz]

Merchant Navy 21c11 is cleaned on Fisherton Sarum shed  and a couple of spotters bunking the shed look on whilst at the Faversham MRC exhibition this weekend. You can help restore the full size No.11 to this condition and put the steam back into General Steam Navigation here. http://35011gsn.co.uk/ 

Edited September 16, 2019 by Graham_Muz