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LNWR D205 & now a D133


farren
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Farren,

 

there are a couple of photos of D205s here 

 

http://www.lnwrs.org.uk/Carriages/CarrDiag.php?diag=205&sub=

 

They aren't very clear, but may be the best that the LNWR Society has available. An email to the Photo Officer may produce something better.

 

As ever, a line society should always be high on a list  for sources of information.

 

Jol

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  • RMweb Gold

I model the LNWR in South Wales and have similar kits from a variety of suppliers. I need a cove roof version of the double ended brake. In terms of paint. They were fully lined by the LMS. After the LMS simplified the lining this was applied to the odd LNW carriage. Under BR they seem to have received unlined maroon - suburban without lining or insignia, just running numbers and as my interest is South Wales they had M XXXX W.

 

Regards.

thanks for that i thought it may have been as it seems most if  not all of the coaches in the D205 and similar design series where gone by 1952 i might get the odd one done  in LMS but after the princess i'll give bow pen a miss for now

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Farren,

 

there are a couple of photos of D205s here 

 

http://www.lnwrs.org.uk/Carriages/CarrDiag.php?diag=205&sub=

 

They aren't very clear, but may be the best that the LNWR Society has available. An email to the Photo Officer may produce something better.

 

As ever, a line society should always be high on a list  for sources of information.

 

Jol

ah yes i had looked on there i am planing on joining the LNWR Society as it dose seem to be a very useful for research material. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • RMweb Gold

have done a bit more work still waiting for the wheels so the corridor as been fitted the compartments will have to be made out of plastic card the air vents are also done battery box fitted running boards removed. next job will be the working corridor connecters witch come with the kit.

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post-12485-0-35274900-1380714290_thumb.jpg

post-12485-0-07313500-1380714314_thumb.jpg

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  • 2 weeks later...

Coaches built at the time of your D205 must have been earmarked for early withdrawal after Nationalization, and it is doubtfull if they were ever painted from 1948 onwards. They were however patch painted (if they were lucky) using paint left over from LMS days. The most common livery up to 1953 appears to have been unlined LMS maroon with the running number at RH end in postwar LMS style transfers and LMS 1's on first class doors, plus grey painted 'chalk' panels. The link by LNWRmodeller clearly shows the style.

 

247 Developments and the ex-Dave Gillott Coaches have some interesting LNWR carriages in the range and I am pleased to see this one under construction. As an aside, I just wish all panelled coaches from whoever were etched on the stronger 16thou brass.

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thank you for that info one quick question is the LMS maroon the same as the BR red? I ask as I have been told they are and also that they are not so still not sure, I ask as I have some paint left over from the princess and would be a shame to waste it if it could be used. (Halfords called Rover Damask Red)also have some humbro NO 20 crimson if that's any closer.

 

I have just had another look at the link from LNWR modeller and noticed that there are some steps on the bogies under the guards doors which will need fitting.

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BR Maroon adopted in 1956 was supposed to be a match for LMS crimson lake as used pre-war (the LMS adopted maroon after the war, a shade somewhat darker than its pre-war finish). As it was impossible to repaint every single LMS coach in the new maroon from 1945-47, your Rover Damask red would fit the bill on coaches not repainted. I would just add that the paintwork would be showing its age.

 

Regarding the LNWR bogie stepboards, I etch mine but it is easy to knock a pair up from scrap brass and two lenths of .45 hadrail wire as shown below. Solder the two wires to the underside of the stepboard and bend them up at an angle. Secure the stepbaord tongue into the slot below the bogie axlebox and cut off the surplus wire. You coach probably had deepframe bogies and so the wire supports were on the face of the bogie. On Bulbiron bogies the support wires went up behind the bogie main frame.

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  • 1 year later...
  • RMweb Gold

Been a while on this topic. Sorry coachman never replied to your post, I did build the steps the way you suggested and are fitted. May have to use a wood colour to pick them out a bit. The coach still isn't finished but will give the roof a coat tomorrow. Here's were I'm up to.

post-12485-0-31983100-1436666497.jpg

Edited by farren
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I model the LNWR in South Wales and have similar kits from a variety of suppliers. I need a cove roof version of the double ended brake. In terms of paint. They were fully lined by the LMS. After the LMS simplified the lining this was applied to the odd LNW carriage. Under BR they seem to have received unlined maroon - suburban without lining or insignia, just running numbers and as my interest is South Wales they had M XXXX W.

 

Regards.

W xxxx M, surely?

 

Chris

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Farren has said he is modelling the LNWR in South Wales, which presumably passed to the LMS and L.M.Region. Unless all South Wales went W.Region?

 

In which case - M xxxx M, the prefix denoting the operating region and the suffix denoting the maintaining region, as we know.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

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In 1958 a major re-drawing of the regional boundaries took place. LMR lines in South Wales and south-west of Birmingham were transferred to the Western. Therefore prior to 1958 the LNWR coaches working within the L.M.Region in South Wales would presumably not carry W 0000 M

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There were various lots of boundary changes in the 1950s.  The ex-Midland main line south of Barnt Green certainly went into the WR in 1958, hence the appearance of pannier tanks as Lickey bankers.  However, I am pretty sure that the LMS lines in South Wales were lumped into the Western Region early on in the life of BR.  There are photographs in the RCTS collection of some ex-L&Y coaches at Abergavenny Junction with WxxxxxM numbers taken in the early 1950s.

 

If you can wait a few days I am trawling through some old Railway Observers looking for something else and I will check what it says.

 

Chris

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]In which case - M xxxx M, the prefix denoting the operating region and the suffix denoting the maintaining region, as we know.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

 

Nope I didn't know that.

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Finally got a few coats on the roof a bit of over spray needs removing from the sides. A 3rd coat I think should do it.

 

What's the best way to do the windows? The kit comes with two bits of clear plastic I had thought of just sticking them just to the inside but thought I'd better ask?

 

The next coach is a LNWR di 133 again from 247. I would like to make this a 5 possibly a 6 coach rake. The original idea was just to work through the 247 kits. I have the address for the new owner so might just carry on with that idea. However if you have any better ideas don't be afraid to post them.

 

There tends to be very little information on Leicester in the 1950's

 

So if any LNWR coaches did run on London Road I don't know for sure. So with some modeling licence some coaching stock found it's way from the Joint LNWR&GNR to the Midland line.

 

If you have any information on this being done again please feel free to post what you know

post-12485-0-09436300-1436803020.jpg

Edited by farren
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I dont imagine the sort of single waist coaches you are building lasted much beyond 1955. Speaking off the top of my head without research, they would all have been built roughly 1905 and 1915. Add 40 years and the were at the end of their useful lives by 1945-55. Coaches converted to push-pull operation tended to last longer because they worked specific low-mileage duties. LNWR 'Toplight' coaches are a safer bet if you want them running up to around 1958-9, as some of these were built by the LMS under fresh diagrams with slight detail changes. That said, I am probably stretching a point by running a D265 corridor third circa 1957.

Edited by coachmann
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There were various lots of boundary changes in the 1950s.  The ex-Midland main line south of Barnt Green certainly went into the WR in 1958, hence the appearance of pannier tanks as Lickey bankers.  However, I am pretty sure that the LMS lines in South Wales were lumped into the Western Region early on in the life of BR.  There are photographs in the RCTS collection of some ex-L&Y coaches at Abergavenny Junction with WxxxxxM numbers taken in the early 1950s.

 

If you can wait a few days I am trawling through some old Railway Observers looking for something else and I will check what it says.

 

Chris

 

From the Railway Observer, January 1949, under the heading "Inter-regional transfer of lines":

 

"Lines in South and Central Wales, and on Welsh Border

 

Transferred from London Midland Region to Western Region: Craven Arms to Swansea Victoria and branches; Swansea St Thomas to Brynamman; Merthyr Tydfil to Abergavenny and branches; Hereford {Moorfields) to Three Cocks Junction; Rotherwas Junction to Red Hill (Junction), Hereford; former joint stations, including Abersychan & Talywain, Pontardulais etc.  Also Merthyr - Morlais Junction line (formerly joint).  This places the whole off the railways in South and Central Wales in Western Region."

 

This and other transfers on the lengthy list was described as "already approved and now being implemented by the chief regional officers concerned, sometimes department by department on various dates as convenient".  I read this as equating 'manana' with 'urgent', since the departure of LMS motive power and rolling stock and its replacement by GWR items was far from immediate.  For example, ex-LMS power was still to be found at Tredegar shed in the Sirhowy Valley when it closed in 1960, and it was not until 1954 that the passenger service between Merthyr and Abergavenny went over to WR auto trains.  Rome was not built in a day.

 

Apologies for the hi-jack btw.  I like the coach that is the subject of the thread very much.

 

Chris

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No worries Chris all information is welcome.

 

I was thinking of a second rake and after reading coach mans last post I think a toplight rake would be a good idea. Just ordered a lms transfer sheet for the coach and was wondering would the coach running number still be in LMS numbers or would it be in a BR script?

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The best way of answering that is by finding a photograph - easier said than done in many cases, I grant you.  In the first few years of nationalisation liveries and numbering practice were in a bit of a state of flux and although there were rules there were exceptions which some might call mistakes.  Larry Coachmann knows more about this than I ever will!

 

Chris

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I have another daft question been looking at the photos of the 205 and it seems the airfents above the windows air a different colour? Any body now what the best colour would be to use for them also the chalkboards

Maybe better to paint them before I add the transfers.

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