Railway Motors

[Merfyn Jones]

So predominantly only seen on or close to the Western Region, or did they spread more widely in BR ownership?

 

Incidentally, a new arrival in the Base Toys range is a Foden DG, as an artic tractor in Pickfords colours with a low-loader trailer, or as a GWR-liveried ballast tractor with a drawbar low-loader. Is the GWR version prototypical, and is there potential for this in other railway liveries?

 

http://www.ayrey.co.uk/dbimages/models/BTO%20D73.jpg

 

The Thornycroft as done by Corgi is purely a Western vehicle. I have never seen a photo of one anywhere else. There is a preserved one which carries Eastern Region fleet number but that is believed to have been transfered across London. Many will have transfered to other regions with boundary changes without moving depots.

The Foden FG, again only used by the Western Region. Dating from 1947 they would have been in GWR livery for a short time before gaining red / cream. I know of the GW buying six of them and about three are preserved.

Merfyn.

[RANGERS]

The good thing with Base Toys is the interchangability of parts. The small wheels came off an early BMC FG which they were far too small for. I think there are about 3 different wheel sizes that they use.

I have measured the Bantam cab and compared against the drawing. The cabs were 6'6" wide and the model works out 1mm too wide, not bad and certainly not S scale. The first release had the same chassis as the Leyland Comet, but most later releases have a bespoke short w b chassis that suits. Also looks good with a Ford D cab fitted.

The translucent roofs are a good improvment to any model. I learnt to do them from Rippers on this very thread on the previous version of RMweb. Here is one I made earlier.

Merfyn.

 

 

Quite a line-up there, a few more pics of these would give us loads to talk about!

[Adam]

These from the 80s:

 

http://dennistaylor.fotopic.net/c1768520.html

 

Adam

[Merfyn Jones]

Quite a line-up there, a few more pics of these would give us loads to talk about!

 

Happy to oblige Rangers. A few shots from the recent South Caernarfonshire exhibition. Overall view of the goods yard display and the green and yellow stuff overflowing onto the table.

Anything you want to talk about please ask. My aim is to collect as much as possible information on the road motors of British Railways, and this thread and some others have been a big help with this. Many thanks to those who like me have been digging up stuff on internet, and sharing it. I always have that pet hate to see layouts with superb correct stock and ficticous or totally wrong road vehicles so if I can help people get things right, all very well.

And not too long ago the Base Toys Ford D as a mechanical horse was mentioned, easy on the Bantam chassis.

Merfyn.

 

[RANGERS]

Happy to oblige Rangers. A few shots from the recent South Caernarfonshire exhibition. Overall view of the goods yard display and the green and yellow stuff overflowing onto the table.

Anything you want to talk about please ask. My aim is to collect as much as possible information on the road motors of British Railways, and this thread and some others have been a big help with this. Many thanks to those who like me have been digging up stuff on internet, and sharing it. I always have that pet hate to see layouts with superb correct stock and ficticous or totally wrong road vehicles so if I can help people get things right, all very well.

And not too long ago the Base Toys Ford D as a mechanical horse was mentioned, easy on the Bantam chassis.

Merfyn.

 

 

Super stuff!

 

What's the origins of the yellow Commer (PB?) van?

 

I have one of these but no idea what kit it is?

[Hammer]

 

 

 

What was the open-topped bus in NSE livery used for?

 

My first guess was that it was just a rail-replacement bus, but it doesn't seem sensible to use an open topped bus for that given British weather.

[298]

What was the open-topped bus in NSE livery used for?

 

My first guess was that it was just a rail-replacement bus, but it doesn't seem sensible to use an open topped bus for that given British weather.

 

Bridge repair work, plus a bit of flag waving at depot open days.

 

Regarding the single axle low loaders in various liveries, how's about a RMweb competition to build a load for one...? I'm thinking along the lines of the Deltic cab, but if the lorry was in GWR livery you'd have to find something more suitable....

[Merfyn Jones]

The Commer PB was a whitemetal by Roxey, their only 4mm kit.

Yes the Fleetline in NSE livery was for bridge work, based at Croydon, possibly to replace the Bedford TK that Oxford do. Note no seats on top !

Merfyn.

 

[RANGERS]

The Commer PB was a whitemetal by Roxey, their only 4mm kit.

Yes the Fleetline in NSE livery was for bridge work, based at Croydon, possibly to replace the Bedford TK that Oxford do. Note no seats on top !

Merfyn.

 

 

Just checked it out on Google, an expensive kit at ??18! Mine came off Ebay built up with six other vehicles for ??11, maybe I'll just stick with the one.

 

I like the Bristol SC4 in BR yellow, I remember seeing these at Doncaster in about 1977 and there's a pic of a Deltic in one of the OPC albums with two in the background. There were still some examples in service with Lincs Roadcar at the time. The Commer walk-thru is also a nice piece, have you tried the Bedford TJ versions of these?

[jonhall]

The Commer PB was a whitemetal by Roxey, their only 4mm kit.

 

Merfyn,

 

I think you mean RoxLey models, Roxey (no L ) do lots of 4mm kits, but mostly etched brass coaches!

 

Jon

[kevblokey]

Merv,

 

What is the railway connection to the green GS in the same photo as the very nicely converted DMS?

[kevblokey]

Merfyn,

 

I think you mean RoxLey models, Roxey (no L ) do lots of 4mm kits, but mostly etched brass coaches!

 

Jon

 

 

No, he means Roxley as in http://www.roxleymodels.co.uk/ !

[Lukasz]

What is the origins to what looks like a escort van in front of the bedford beagle and behing the transit Merfyn?

 

 

Lukasz

[Merfyn Jones]

A few items from the recent queries.

 

The van behind the Transit, not an Escort but a Morris Ital, from a whitemetal kit by, I think ABS of a Marina with modified front.

 

The ex London Transport GS from a whitemetal kit by GS models. Now available RTR from EFE. In London country green livery, the photo I have of one is in this livery as the light green lining is visible, indicating that BR did not repaint it. The green being very similar to their own.

 

The Bristol SC from an Anbrico whitemetal kit. One of the ex Lincolnshire vehicles that was based in Doncaster.

 

One I made earlier ! Foden DG timber tractor from EFE chassis and Langley cab, plus plastic card body. Similar to the forthcoming Base Toys model. They have photos to do the BR livery as well as the iminent GWR one.

 

Merfyn

[jcb 3c]

The tracked excavator is a contractors vehicle, BR would have given it a fleet number and red livery.

Anyone know where's there any pictures of this type of BR plant ? red or yellow !

[Merfyn Jones]

Anyone know where's there any pictures of this type of BR plant ? red or yellow !

Hi jcb 3c

I have seen dumpers and compressors and cranes in both red and yellow but never any excavators. Perhaps they were always hired in from contractors, just like today with the many road rail machines.

But am always ready for sombody to prove me wrong.

Merfyn.

[Pixie]

Great thread this guys - makes an interesting read to a BR vehicle numpty like myself.

 

I hope you don't mind me asking, but what vehicles would be suitable for an early 70's South Wales freight yard? I guess the vehicles would be dictated by the goods they'd have to handle which in this case consists of small amounts of coal, pipes and general 'boxed' mechandise, as well as a small amount of reclaimed permenant way goods. Details on available models, suitable liveries and prototype snaps would all be ery useful. I've got a long term plan to also have a Coles crane, but I need to catch up with one first...

 

Boomshanka,

 

Pix

[Fat Controller]

Great thread this guys - makes an interesting read to a BR vehicle numpty like myself.

 

I hope you don't mind me asking, but what vehicles would be suitable for an early 70's South Wales freight yard? I guess the vehicles would be dictated by the goods they'd have to handle which in this case consists of small amounts of coal, pipes and general 'boxed' mechandise, as well as a small amount of reclaimed permenant way goods. Details on available models, suitable liveries and prototype snaps would all be ery useful. I've got a long term plan to also have a Coles crane, but I need to catch up with one first...

 

Boomshanka,

 

Pix

Coal would have been carried by the merchant's own lorries- those of my acquaintance in late 1960s/early 1970s Llanelli were just phasing out their ex-Army Bedford O series and replacing them with Bedford TKs.

Unless you're modelling a Sundries depot, then your BR lorries would have been TK rigid flatbeds or tractors with flatbed trailers, or possibly one of the LAD-cabbed Leyland/Albion. Some of these are to be found in the Oxford or Base Toys ranges. There were a few Seddons and Guys, but these went over to Freightliner. Exceptionally, you might have a van or van trailer, but these were more normally confined to Sundries and Parcels depots

For cranes- I'm pretty certain that Hafod yard in Swansea (which was a Full Loads terminal) had an 'Iron Fairey' crane, a representation of which was available from Matchbox. There were also some cable-operated (rather than hydraulic) forklifts, used for containers and for the aluminium slab traffic.

Service vehicles were Bedford HA or Escort vans (even Area Managers used these), with assorted TKs, Ford D series and British Leylands for heavier stuff.

[jcb 3c]

Hi jcb 3c

I have seen dumpers and compressors and cranes in both red and yellow but never any excavators. Perhaps they were always hired in from contractors, just like today with the many road rail machines.

But am always ready for sombody to prove me wrong.

Merfyn.

 

Aha -heres a ex BR CAT 951A still in their livery.

 

http://www.classicmachinery.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2458&hilit=cat+951a

[Merfyn Jones]

Great thread this guys - makes an interesting read to a BR vehicle numpty like myself.

 

I hope you don't mind me asking, but what vehicles would be suitable for an early 70's South Wales freight yard? I guess the vehicles would be dictated by the goods they'd have to handle which in this case consists of small amounts of coal, pipes and general 'boxed' mechandise, as well as a small amount of reclaimed permenant way goods. Details on available models, suitable liveries and prototype snaps would all be ery useful. I've got a long term plan to also have a Coles crane, but I need to catch up with one first...

 

Boomshanka,

 

Pix

 

Adding to Brian's reply. In the early 70s the freight traffic was handled by National Carriers (since 1968) although BR still handled parcels but from stations normally.

The engineers dealt with their own materials, and from 1970 their livery changed from green to yellow, both colours would be seen together for a few years.

Merfyn.

[Merfyn Jones]

Aha -heres a ex BR CAT 951A still in their livery.

 

http://www.classicmachinery.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=2458&hilit=cat+951a

 

Hi jcb 3c

Tried the link, but told I can't view the picture. Any numbers visible on the machine ?

Merfyn

[Pixie]

Thanks for the reply Brian - certainly opens up a lot of options!

 

Unless you're modelling a Sundries depot, then your BR lorries would have been TK rigid flatbeds or tractors with flatbed trailers, or possibly one of the LAD-cabbed Leyland/Albion. Some of these are to be found in the Oxford or Base Toys ranges.

 

Ignoring the livery, something like this (http://www.ehattons.com/StockDetail.aspx?SID=9643[/url]) I guess?

 

For cranes- I'm pretty certain that Hafod yard in Swansea (which was a Full Loads terminal) had an 'Iron Fairey' crane, a representation of which was available from Matchbox.

 

I've been looking on ebay for one of those recently after seeing Hywel T's rather nice modere (http://www.emgauge70.../morfa_4207.jpg). Would be a nice stand in until I can measure up a Coles crane!

 

Service vehicles were Bedford HA or Escort vans (even Area Managers used these), with assorted TKs, Ford D series and British Leylands for heavier stuff.

 

Marvellous - I've got one of Bernards kits waiting in the wings for a HA van, I'll crack out the yellow when it gets to that stage.

 

Pix

[Fat Controller]

Thanks for the reply Brian - certainly opens up a lot of options!

 

 

 

Ignoring the livery, something like this (http://www.ehattons.com/StockDetail.aspx?SID=9643[/url]) I guess?

 

 

 

I've been looking on ebay for one of those recently after seeing Hywel T's rather nice modere (http://www.emgauge70.../morfa_4207.jpg). Would be a nice stand in until I can measure up a Coles crane!

 

 

 

Marvellous - I've got one of Bernards kits waiting in the wings for a HA van, I'll crack out the yellow when it gets to that stage.

 

Pix

That TK's nice, but there's some cheaper ones about, notably in the Oxford/Scaledale range. I have even seen some yellow flats/dropsides.

That Iron Fairey is one of the later Matchbox ones- the older ones had bigger wheels at the front end, a bit like a tractor in reverse.

The crane might be available as a kit from one of the firms doing military models- BW Models, perhaps?

[Adam]

Re the Coles Crane Pix - do you mean one of these:

 

http://www.oilyhands.co.uk/Archive2.htm (scroll down a bit)

 

Or the older type more familiar from the Airfix Recovery set? Nonneminstre models do a rail mounted versiion of the later one, I don't suppose it would be too much of a stretch to put it on road wheels, assuming you can live with the whitemetal jib? If not, a fabrication from brass angle probably isn't so hard. The basic cranes went on a whole host of chassis, and at least some of the thorneycrofts were around into the late '60s; I've a photo from an old Railway Modeller showing the erection of a roof at Pendon using just this bit of kit.

 

There aren't many kits for this sort of vehicle readily available in model form, and especially not as manufactured in the 60s. Chaseside loaders (usually based on tractors) seem to have been fairly common. Langley produce a couple of kits which aren't too bad for these. The '60s version (which apparently ended up being taken over by JCB) looked very different however. There's a timber merchants/sawmill not far from Yeovil which still uses something not unlike this. Langley also do the mobile Ransome and Rapier crane, but my feeling is that this would be a bit early for your period, and the yard at Roath a bit small to accomodate one...

 

http://www.langleymodels.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_OO_Cranes__Heavy_plant___Road_Machinery___RW1_RW21_29.html

 

What sort of traffic is the crane intended for in any case?

Bernard Taylor does a nice etched grill for the EFE TK btw.

[Fat Controller]

Re the Coles Crane Pix - do you mean one of these:

 

http://www.oilyhands.co.uk/Archive2.htm (scroll down a bit)

 

Or the older type more familiar from the Airfix Recovery set? Nonneminstre models do a rail mounted versiion of the later one, I don't suppose it would be too much of a stretch to put it on road wheels, assuming you can live with the whitemetal jib? If not, a fabrication from brass angle probably isn't so hard. The basic cranes went on a whole host of chassis, and at least some of the thorneycrofts were around into the late '60s; I've a photo from an old Railway Modeller showing the erection of a roof at Pendon using just this bit of kit.

 

There aren't many kits for this sort of vehicle readily available in model form, and especially not as manufactured in the 60s. Chaseside loaders (usually based on tractors) seem to have been fairly common. Langley produce a couple of kits which aren't too bad for these. The '60s version (which apparently ended up being taken over by JCB) looked very different however. There's a timber merchants/sawmill not far from Yeovil which still uses something not unlike this. Langley also do the mobile Ransome and Rapier crane, but my feeling is that this would be a bit early for your period, and the yard at Roath a bit small to accomodate one...

 

http://www.langleymodels.co.uk/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_OO_Cranes__Heavy_plant___Road_Machinery___RW1_RW21_29.html

 

What sort of traffic is the crane intended for in any case?

Bernard Taylor does a nice etched grill for the EFE TK btw.

The Coles cranes in use by BR during the period in question looked very much like the one in the photo. They'd have been used for handling things like the old '4 ton' containers (which were a bit over 5t loaded), unloading pipes, tubes and plates etc. The Ransome crane is of a sort that would have probably dropped out of use by the end of the 1950s.

Dad had one of the Chasesides from the mid-1950s- it got quite a bit of use when he had a series of contracts to adapt disused tinplate factories into warehousing for export tinplate. Even at the time, it looked a bit antiquated- I was hoping he'd get something a bit more modern,such as a Drott.

I like the lash-up Fordson Super-Major shunting tractor- such vehicles were quite common, though the one illustrated must have been a pig to maintain.