Mainline Class 56 replacement motor

[Richie Kynaston]

Hi all,

I’m about to convert a Mainline Class 56 from OO to EM. First time of done it, and the loco was acquired very cheaply so if it all goes wrong, nothing really lost! But it occurred to me, that as my new EM layout will eventually have long Coal trains, it might be worth upgrading the motor while I’ve got it in bits.

 

Has anyone tried this before? Can anyone offer any thoughts or suggestions as to a replacement?

 

All advice/thoughts gratefully accepted.

 

Richie

[Richie Kynaston]

Looking on the P4 New Street site, sorry i've forgotten the guy's name that does it, there is an article on there about re-motoring a Class 56 model using an Athern US chassis .. so might give that a try.  Has anyone else looked into that option?

 

Richie

[Mark Saunders]

Purchase another one cheaply and have two motor bogies!

 

Mark Saunders

[Richie Kynaston]

Purchase another one cheaply and have two motor bogies!

 

Mark Saunders

 

Hi Mark,

Thanks! I did consider that, but was not sure how well matched the motors would be ... also this one sounds a little loud to me, and while I know its going to have DCC Sound fitted, I thought that modern day motors were probably a bit quieter?

 

Richie

[Titan]

Does it actually need upgrading? I have a mainline class 56, Took it to a friend of mines layout and we hung all of our Hornby Merry go round wagons behind it, a total of thirty wagons IIRC and it handled it just fine, so I would expect it could handle a scale 36 wagons unless you have some significant gradients/sharp curves. It has a six wheel drive bogie which helps.

Edited October 3, 2017 by Titan

[Richie Kynaston]

Does it actually need upgrading? I have a mainline class 56, Took it to a friend of mines layout and we hung all of our Hornby Merry go round wagons behind it, a total of thirty wagons IIRC and it handled it just fine, so I would expect it could handle a scale 36 wagons unless you have some significant gradients/sharp curves. It has a six wheel drive bogie which helps.

Hi Titan,

Interesting insight, thanks for that. I’m just getting back into 4mm, so I was working on the premise of an older probably three-pole motor rather than any extensive testing.

 

Rich

[Titan]

Just had a thought - it does have traction tyres which I expect you would lose if re-wheeling it. Additional weight may compensate.

[Richie Kynaston]

Just had a thought - it does have traction tyres which I expect you would lose if re-wheeling it. Additional weight may compensate.

 

Thanks - Have a read somewhere that there is a move away from traction tyres now?  I presume they dont come with new models, like they used it?  Its a few years since i've been around the 4mm scene!

 

Richie

[Titan]

The general standard now seems to be centre motor and drive to both bogies. The chassis tend to be built a lot heavier now so they will pull almost anything without needing traction tyres, which also means all wheel pickup can be utilised too.

[RAF96]

Purchase another one cheaply and have two motor bogies!

 

Mark Saunders

 

I tried the twin Ringfield bogie conversion (getting shot of the traction tyres at the same time by using dummy bogie wheels, which had gears fortunately) but could not get the balance right between the motors. One would start nice and smooth but the other one dragged its wheels until enough oomph was given to get it going then it went like the clappers. I went back to a single motor bogie after that.

 

@Richie: I have a copy of the Jim Smith-Wright Athern PB1 (central motor twin flywheel) conversion article in my files if you need it. I can scan it in and see if it will post.

Rob

[cheesysmith]

To remotor a old mainlime class 56, you have serveral options.

 

The 56 and 58 share the same wheelbase, so this opens up options.

 

Use the new Hornby superdetailed chassis under the original body. This give you the better detailed copressors and battery box/fuel tank. Remove the buffer beams off the end and ruse the original mainline chassis ends for the buffers.

 

Use Hornby class 58 bogies, 2x motored ones, but remove the motors, reuse the worms, make your own drive shafts with a big centre motor.

 

Use Heljan class 58 bogies, avalible as spares from howes, with the gears and motor recovered from dead mazac rot victim class 47.

 

The Hornby class 58 bogies I have not tried, but the other 2 I have actually one myself, so I know they work.

 

PS-the latewr Hornby body is a better bet to start from as it already comes with wire handrails for the cab doors, the older mainline and Dapol ones had moulded ones.

[Richie Kynaston]

I tried the twin Ringfield bogie conversion (getting shot of the traction tyres at the same time by using dummy bogie wheels, which had gears fortunately) but could not get the balance right between the motors. One would start nice and smooth but the other one dragged its wheels until enough oomph was given to get it going then it went like the clappers. I went back to a single motor bogie after that.

 

@Richie: I have a copy of the Jim Smith-Wright Athern PB1 (central motor twin flywheel) conversion article in my files if you need it. I can scan it in and see if it will post.

Rob

Hi Rob,

Interesting, that’s the concern I had about using two powered bogies. I downloaded a copy of Jim Smith-Wright’s PB1 conversion from his P4 New Street website, so should be ok, but many thanks for that.

 

 

To remotor a old mainlime class 56, you have serveral options.

The 56 and 58 share the same wheelbase, so this opens up options.

 

Use the new Hornby superdetailed chassis under the original body. This give you the better detailed copressors and battery box/fuel tank. Remove the buffer beams off the end and ruse the original mainline chassis ends for the buffers.

 

Use Hornby class 58 bogies, 2x motored ones, but remove the motors, reuse the worms, make your own drive shafts with a big centre motor.

 

Use Heljan class 58 bogies, avalible as spares from howes, with the gears and motor recovered from dead mazac rot victim class 47.

 

The Hornby class 58 bogies I have not tried, but the other 2 I have actually one myself, so I know they work.

 

PS-the latewr Hornby body is a better bet to start from as it already comes with wire handrails for the cab doors, the older mainline and Dapol ones had moulded ones.

Cheesy Smith:

Many thanks for that. Using Hornby Class 58 bogies and repowering with a central motor sounds a logical decision. What motor would you use in that case? I’ve never done anything like that before, so is there a way in which people make drive shafts? Or are they available as spares from somewhere? I seem to recall from years ago, the Lima Class 20 was setup in that fashion nd seemed to work quite well.

 

Are the Heljan 58/47s a Centre motor version then, or just a good chassis to work from?

 

Normally I’d go for the later Hornby body, but this is all trial and error for me as i’ e never attempted weathering before, let alone detailing and remotoring, so it was a case of achieve it with this and I’ve got some experience. If it all goes wrong, I’ve not really lost much!

 

I’m having a wander to the Toy & Train Fair at Lincoln Showground tomorrow hopefully, so will look out for some Hornby Class 58 bogies.

 

Richie

Edited October 7, 2017 by Richie Kynaston

[RAF96]

so is there a way in which people make drive shafts?​

 

 

A simple cardan shaft alternative used widely by model tram guys is flexible plastic tube - a.k.a car washer pipe. You just have to find one with the right ID to suit your motor shaft and bogie input shaft, but a little heat can make it fit .

 

Edit to add link to picture of Kirkman chassis

 

https://www.google.com.cy/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwiO4tSGs-DWAhUsMJoKHcHdAbUQjRwIBw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.rmweb.co.uk%2Fcommunity%2Findex.php%3F%2Ftopic%2F85983-below-floor-drivetrain-for-multiple-unit%2F&psig=AOvVaw2yYoowbMFF2XA0IlzE_plU&ust=1507530533670924

Edited October 8, 2017 by RAFHAAA96