NEED HELP WITH FINDING STUFF

[DoctorP]

Hi Doc.  It can be extremely difficult to find proper UK railway modelling supplies in NA.  Steve at Model Railway Imports carries Peco products (and all the other brands too) so I recommend you browse his store at the link in post #3 and email him with your needs.   

 

Peco is great value.  In fact most NA themed layouts I have seen locally use Peco code 100 turnouts with Atlas track.  I am less than impressed with things Atlas, but then I'm a self confessed fusspot

 

Atlas plain track will work of course.  The gauge is right (for 00) but no chair detail.  It is also code 100.  A more to scale size of rail is code 75 and Peco do a range of code 75 track and turnouts.  They have recently released a range of code 75 track with bullhead rail.  Peco also do a range of track for the NA modeller in code 83.

 

If you haven't done a layout before, I would say go ahead and get some track, plonk it down, wire it up and have a play.  In fact it might even be a good idea to get yourself a train set - for the purposes of research of course.  I did this when starting out over 30 years ago.  Once you've got the feel, you can branch out into more sophisticated things.

 

I don't think you mentioned locos and stock - do you have any?

 

What about control?  I think it's safe to say that most railway modellers have DCC these days, I have been DCC for probably 20 yrs+ and wouldn't even contemplate DC now.

 

I'll put in a plug for my second hand list here:  http://www.brmna.org/4sale/jken.shtm Although most things are LMS and LNER so not really appropriate for your Cotswold idea.  There are plenty of other lists on the BRMNA site so take a look.

 

Getting started in model railways is very exciting but can be fraught too.  As you learn you'll probably make mistakes, I did but it does come.

 

John

Great post, John. Let me address the issues you raise:

1. About the track, no, I've never laid or used any sort of track at all. I did go to HobbyTown a little earlier and they had only a few pieces of Bachman snap track and quite a few sections of Atlas flex track. I had determined to use the Bachman but they did not have near enough. I need 75 pieces of 9", 45 pcs of 22" curve, turnouts, re-railers, etc. so I wasn't able to get any track so I'm back to square 1 with that. I felt of the Atlas flex track and it seemed rather flimsy after handling the Bachman snap track with built in road bed/ballast so again, back to square one.

2. I've never seen or held Peco track although it comes highly recommended but I'm not sure why it is preferable over the others.

3. I don't have any trains whatsoever and that is a minus in that I've spent a goodly number of hours preparing my benchwork and it would be sort of nice to see some return on my investment. I'm thinking if I wait till I get everything "right" I'll be too old to enjoy it! Neither have I ever driven a model train so what if I invest a lot of money in a nice locomotive and then run it off the table and see it break up on the floor? I thought I might ought to invest in a cheapo train set just to get the practice, but then there's the matter of familiarizing myself with a DCC system and there you go again...

4. I'm not sure I know what you mean when you refer to a BRMNA "list"??? Let me know on that. 

5. Chair detail?????

6. Yep, the Cotswolds were served by a line running from London to Bristol (I believe it is Bristol...in the Northern Cotswolds). The local folks have been restoring the Gloucestershire - Warwickshire short line and that's what I'm going to try to work into my layout.

7. You mention Peco 75. Most recommendations for HO if not OO scale is #83 whether from Peco or Atlas or whoever. What is better about #75?

Well, I think that does it. I will go back to post 3 and look at Model Rail Imports to see what he has available. Man - thanks for all the help. I'm afraid If I don't get somewhere more quickly I'll burn out and have to go back to restoring garden tractors for a hobby (very hard on the back and the arthritis at my age)!  DoctorP

[DoctorP]

Sadly, no really easy options when it comes to Cotswold Stone buildings. Some downloadable card kits perhaps. The evergreen Bilteezi card range is quite good for architectural style but the stonework rather too grey for most of the Cotswolds and of course no relief to represent the mortar joints.

 

Perhaps, since it is a first layout, best to portray a small rural station with no other buildings nearby?

I've seen some buildings, cottages, etc that will work in a pinch, especially with some painting that golden tan color stone...I'm going to give it a shot anyway, but not much of a shot...have you seen the prices on some of the better stuff???? Whew! To much for a soon to be retired college professor!  DoctorP

[DoctorP]

DoctorP. Have you looked at wills kits. They do 3 stone kits worth a look.  https://www.peco-uk.com/prodtype.asp?strParents=3351,3352&CAT_ID=3354&numRecordPosition=1

Yes, these are very nice indeed...I'll probably end up with these when my bank loan comes through!  DoctorP

[Theakerr]

A word of caution on the Wills kits.  They do make up into excellent models but some are very basic requiring layout and cutting of plastic sheets that can be a little taxing.  Something like Scalescenes, 3dk (in Canada) and others might be a better option because you download the kit and can have as many goes as you want.  These folks make some pretty nice kits but I don't know how they relate to the Cotswolds having never really spent any time there.  Perhaps someone can comment.

http://www.petite-properties.50megs.com/photo_12.html

[brossard]

A lot to unpack there Doc.

 

1)  You're talking about set track which is fine but for more flexibility flex track is better.  As the name implies it can be curved to any radius you want.

 

2)  Peco track looks a lot like British track, although the Flat Bottom rail version, which is ubiquitous, has smaller sleeper spacing than it should if it was scaled to 4mm/ft. (H0 is scaled to 3.5mm /ft) British rail is secured to the sleepers with chairs, cast iron supports that are bolted tot the sleepers with rail held rigid by means of a wooden wedge.  US rail is simply secured to the ties with spikes.

 

3)  Well, I think you should start with a train set from Hornby or Bachmann.  Hattons have a number of these - I checked.  The power supply will need to be adapted to our voltage but that's no big deal I think.  You do need to start playing to maintain your enthusiasm.  DCC can come later.

 

4)  BRMNA members can list their sale items on the site:  http://www.brmna.org/sales.shtml Beware of SH though as you might be getting someones old tat.  My list excepted of course.

 

5)  See 2) above.

 

6)  I assume you are talking GWR.  I don't know the Cotswolds but there are many who do.

 

7)  The original 00 track was code 100 or 0.100 " high.  For a finer look, Peco do code 75 which is 0.075" high and is closer to UK rail.  Code 83 (0.083" high) is a US spec.   Do get something to play with soon.  If you've got young grand children they will probably be over the moon about your trains.  For heavens sake don't get Thomas the Tank. 

 

HTH

 

John

[DoctorP]

A word of caution on the Wills kits.  They do make up into excellent models but some are very basic requiring layout and cutting of plastic sheets that can be a little taxing.  Something like Scalescenes, 3dk (in Canada) and others might be a better option because you download the kit and can have as many goes as you want.  These folks make some pretty nice kits but I don't know how they relate to the Cotswolds having never really spent any time there.  Perhaps someone can comment.

http://www.petite-properties.50megs.com/photo_12.html

Thanks for the website...I'll most definitely check it out.  DoctorP

[DoctorP]

A lot to unpack there Doc.

 

1)  You're talking about set track which is fine but for more flexibility flex track is better.  As the name implies it can be curved to any radius you want.

 

2)  Peco track looks a lot like British track, although the Flat Bottom rail version, which is ubiquitous, has smaller sleeper spacing than it should if it was scaled to 4mm/ft. (H0 is scaled to 3.5mm /ft) British rail is secured to the sleepers with chairs, cast iron supports that are bolted tot the sleepers with rail held rigid by means of a wooden wedge.  US rail is simply secured to the ties with spikes.

 

3)  Well, I think you should start with a train set from Hornby or Bachmann.  Hattons have a number of these - I checked.  The power supply will need to be adapted to our voltage but that's no big deal I think.  You do need to start playing to maintain your enthusiasm.  DCC can come later.

 

4)  BRMNA members can list their sale items on the site:  http://www.brmna.org/sales.shtml Beware of SH though as you might be getting someones old tat.  My list excepted of course.

 

5)  See 2) above.

 

6)  I assume you are talking GWR.  I don't know the Cotswolds but there are many who do.

 

7)  The original 00 track was code 100 or 0.100 " high.  For a finer look, Peco do code 75 which is 0.075" high and is closer to UK rail.  Code 83 (0.083" high) is a US spec.   Do get something to play with soon.  If you've got young grand children they will probably be over the moon about your trains.  For heavens sake don't get Thomas the Tank. 

 

HTH

 

John

A lot of excellent info! Do you have anything for sale (on sale!)? I'll just start by asking you that. Very good info on the track and on the different means of attaching prototypical track to ties...never knew that, just thought rail spikes were the only way. So, you recommend Peco 75 as the best for OO track? And yes, I am referring to the GWR...watched quite a few videos. DoctorP

[brossard]

Yes, my sales link is in post #19.  There's a lot, most of it hardly ever run and quite new as well.  The locos are all DCC however.

 

I recommend Peco code 75 as a good choice.  I might get shouted at if I said it was best, but Peco is the only game in town for code 75.  Bachmann and Hornby make their own track too but it is code 100 and set track.  I've never bothered with it.  See about availability of bullhead rail for your track.  This is fairly recent from Peco.  BH rail was very commonly used by British railway companies through the grouping (1923 - 1948) and for some time after nationalisation (1948 - ?).  Flat bottom rail is more modern but was used in the grouping as well. 

 

Don't get sucked in my the glamour of big engines.  Start small, perhaps a Pannier tank, a brake van and some wagons.

 

John

[DoctorP]

Yes, my sales link is in post #19.  There's a lot, most of it hardly ever run and quite new as well.  The locos are all DCC however.

 

I recommend Peco code 75 as a good choice.  I might get shouted at if I said it was best, but Peco is the only game in town for code 75.  Bachmann and Hornby make their own track too but it is code 100 and set track.  I've never bothered with it.  See about availability of bullhead rail for your track.  This is fairly recent from Peco.  BH rail was very commonly used by British railway companies through the grouping (1923 - 1948) and for some time after nationalisation (1948 - ?).  Flat bottom rail is more modern but was used in the grouping as well. 

 

Don't get sucked in my the glamour of big engines.  Start small, perhaps a Pannier tank, a brake van and some wagons.

 

John

I'll take a look and get back to you on the "for sale" items. Also, do you have trouble creating proper curves with the Peco flexible track? That would be a concern of mine. DoctorP

[brossard]

Quite the opposite, you can create good looking curves with flex track.  There are techniques for the joints though.  What radius curves were you considering?  The larger the better.  Proper curves?

 

John

[DoctorP]

I'll take a look and get back to you on the "for sale" items. Also, do you have trouble creating proper curves with the Peco flexible track? That would be a concern of mine. DoctorP

Went to the second hand items for sale category and couldn't find you there.  DoctorP

Quite the opposite, you can create good looking curves with flex track.  There are techniques for the joints though.  What radius curves were you considering?  The larger the better.  Proper curves?

 

John

22"

[brossard]

This is my list:  http://www.brmna.org/4sale/jken.shtm

 

22' radius curves are kind of tight but you only have so much space.  You don't have to build a circuit, you can do an end to end.  Depends on what you like to do, watch trains go round or operate.

 

John

[DoctorP]

This is my list:  http://www.brmna.org/4sale/jken.shtm

 

22' radius curves are kind of tight but you only have so much space.  You don't have to build a circuit, you can do an end to end.  Depends on what you like to do, watch trains go round or operate.

 

John

I'm building an end to end with a modified reverted loop and mini yard at either end. 22" is the max size curve I can get on the 36" end

[DoctorP]

I'm building an end to end with a modified reverted loop and mini yard at either end. 22" is the max size curve I can get on the 36" end

Here is a scaled schematic of my bench

https://imgur.com/aS1kJl7

[brossard]

Well, I am happy to hear you are doing an end to end layout.   It doesn't look all that different from mine.  I have 20' x 11' but I'm doing 0 gauge.

 

My plan:

 

 

Rather than a loop, I have a sector plate with three tracks:

 

 

The plan is to construct a branchline terminus:

 

 

You can see more here:  http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/127114-another-as-yet-unnamed-7mm-layout/

 

Another thought is that, while it is some distance, you might consider this:

 

http://www.theplatelayers.org/gbts2018/gbts2018poster002.jpg

 

It is the only exclusively British model train show in NA.  I plan to attend.  What better way to get to know the suppliers and check out layouts?

 

John

Edited March 19, 2018 by brossard

[DoctorP]

Well, I am happy to hear you are doing an end to end layout.   It doesn't look all that different from mine.  I have 20' x 11' but I'm doing 0 gauge.

 

My plan:

 

20170529_202128.jpg

 

Rather than a loop, I have a sector plate with three tracks:

 

P1010001-007.JPG

 

The plan is to construct a branchline terminus:

 

P1010001-016.JPG

 

You can see more here:  http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/127114-another-as-yet-unnamed-7mm-layout/

 

Another thought is that, while it is some distance, you might consider this:

 

http://www.theplatelayers.org/gbts2018/gbts2018poster002.jpg

 

It is the only exclusively British model train show in NA.  I plan to attend.  What better way to get to know the suppliers and check out layouts?

 

John

I need some more time to make this out. I'll take a look at the websites you list above. I'm very interested in what you've got going...I can 't run O...my space is too small.  DoctorP

[DoctorP]

I need some more time to make this out. I'll take a look at the websites you list above. I'm very interested in what you've got going...I can 't run O...my space is too small.  DoctorP

Thanks...this is tomorrow's "work" right here...I've got to find a resource for Peco 75.  DoctorP

[brossard]

Actually, you might be surprised at how little space it takes.  There's an 0 gauge layout here called Trebudoc that is 9' long in total, including sector plate.  Very inspiring.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/54364-trebudoc-in-o-gauge-videos-page-28-29-31-to-33-36/page-45

 

I think you should walk before running so no more proselytizing from me.

 

John

[DoctorP]

Actually, you might be surprised at how little space it takes.  There's an 0 gauge layout here called Trebudoc that is 9' long in total, including sector plate.  Very inspiring.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/54364-trebudoc-in-o-gauge-videos-page-28-29-31-to-33-36/page-45

 

I think you should walk before running so no more proselytizing from me.

 

John

OK, I just had an idea...how does this sound: do you think it would be of interest to people on the RM site for me to start a thread entitled "Starting From Ground Zero" chronicling, with pictures, my efforts to "find my way" as it were as i move forward in making decisions, planning, building, accessorizing, re - planning, re-building, re-accessorizing, my efforts from the standpoint of a rank novice through the entire process of creating my layout? If so, I can do that, but if you think people would not be interested, then let me know because nobody wants to post stuff people aren't interested in. I thought it might 1) get me some excellent advice along the way, and 2) it may even help others get things straight in their minds about what they want or need to do as they move forward in their layout.  I do realize the level of skill, experience, and expertise among most members of the forum is such that this idea would be way beneath them (you as well), but it was just a thought. you can let me know. Thanks.  DoctorP

[brossard]

I daresay you wouldn't be the first to do that.  I think it is a good idea and you will garner some good advice along the way I am sure.  There may be less brave lurkers out there with similar questions to yours.  RMWeb is a large congregation with all sorts of interests and skill levels.  Non-one is born with the knowledge or skill to build a model railway, it has to be learned.

 

John

[Theakerr]

I am mostly in agreement with Brossard but I would strongly suggest the use of Code 100 to begin.  Basically it is so much more forgiving in terms of laying it and running than either Code 75 or Code 83, especially for someone starting out.  When painted it doesn't look at all bad.  Just look at Grantham, the Streamliner Years on this forum.  I do agree though on getting something going.  I would suggest that the probability of becoming unhappy with ones first go is almost 100% for many reasons.  So, get that first go out of the way but have a lot of fun and learn at the same time

[brossard]

I am a bit torn on the use of code 100 track.  I think a compromise is to get a Bachmann or Hornby train set (which will have code 100 track), mount it on a piece of ply and get a feel for things, as I said before.  The train set track could be used as a test/play track while the main layout is under construction.  I suppose I believe that if you're to make the investment, start with the latest product.

 

John

[DoctorP]

I daresay you wouldn't be the first to do that.  I think it is a good idea and you will garner some good advice along the way I am sure.  There may be less brave lurkers out there with similar questions to yours.  RMWeb is a large congregation with all sorts of interests and skill levels.  Non-one is born with the knowledge or skill to build a model railway, it has to be learned.

 

John

John, I just looked at your thread created when you were building your layout...I think I'll change my mind on posting my own...your's was unbelievably good. Kudos!  DoctorP

[DoctorP]

I am mostly in agreement with Brossard but I would strongly suggest the use of Code 100 to begin.  Basically it is so much more forgiving in terms of laying it and running than either Code 75 or Code 83, especially for someone starting out.  When painted it doesn't look at all bad.  Just look at Grantham, the Streamliner Years on this forum.  I do agree though on getting something going.  I would suggest that the probability of becoming unhappy with ones first go is almost 100% for many reasons.  So, get that first go out of the way but have a lot of fun and learn at the same time

Thanks my friend. I will try to do just that with, as Joe Cocker said, "A Little Help From My Friends."  DoctorP

[DoctorP]

I am a bit torn on the use of code 100 track.  I think a compromise is to get a Bachmann or Hornby train set (which will have code 100 track), mount it on a piece of ply and get a feel for things, as I said before.  The train set track could be used as a test/play track while the main layout is under construction.  I suppose I believe that if you're to make the investment, start with the latest product.

 

John

What do you think of this (below):

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Hornby-BRAND-NEW-BOXED-00-GAUGE-FLYING-SCOTSMAN-TRAIN-SET-/282891597699   Doc