'O' gauge ? first tentative steps. Corrugated goods shed part 3: Painting and weathering

[David Siddall]

Much as I should be building 60' track panels, the lure of an unopened Slaters 20-ton LNER/BR Brake Van kit proved too much... so I started it (...which just proves I can patently resist just about anything except temptation when it comes to 7-mil stock modelling!). Not a completely uneventful build to date though as I very quickly discovered that the length of the sides didn't match that of the floor and that, without modification, the verandah ends would have leaned at a distinctly drunken angle. There's also something odd going on where the strapping plates at the top corners of the sides (over what one might call the side access door lintels?) meet the ends too, but more on that in a mo'...

 

Question... reduce the length of the sides and risk damaging some crisply moulded detail or extend the verdah floor? Well, I took what I considered to be the 'easy route' and extended the verandah floor with strips of plasticard (identified by the red arrows). To ensure that the ends sat square, and all the top corners aligned as they should, I also had to do a bit of packing (indicated by the yellow arrows) but at least the stapping plates now meet in an appropriately prototypical manner and the ends are square and vertical in relation to the rest of the body.

 

Please note... this is not a criticism of the kit, it's just an observation about the example I have on my work-bench and I'm no less delighted that there's a good-looking kit of standard BR Van is available in platic kit form (... I think I've mentioned my legendary lack of soldering ability before!). By comparison with some of the work I've had to do in other scales to make things fit / look halfway decent this was neither brain science nor rocket surgery and the mod's took about five minutes ;-)

 

And now for the piccies...

 

 

 

 

Any suggestion that the outer ends are still out of square is caused by what I believe is called 'parallax effect' created by the camera lens. I've had a try-square on them from every angle and can promise that they're now exactly as they should be :-)

 

However I do realise that one of the inner ends isn't correctly located. I took the photos before it was secured in its rightful place!

 

BFN...

 

David

[Donw]

Good to know you are enjoying it.

Don

[Warspite]

Much as I should be building 60' track panels, the lure of an unopened Slaters 20-ton LNER/BR Brake Van kit proved too much... so I started it (...which just proves I can patently resist just about anything except temptation when it comes to 7-mil stock modelling!).

 

Excellent, David. Coming on very nicely.

 

Looks very square to me - I must remember your tip about the ends when (note 'when' not 'if'!) I get mine.

 

By the way, does the roof fit OK after your mods?

 

Stephen

[David Siddall]

By the way, does the roof fit OK after your mods?

 

...it appears to Stephen (he says, resisting the urge to rush upstairs and check again ;-)

 

Have no idea whether this will afflict other examples though? Mine also has a rather more oval than circular hole in said roof where the chimney is due to fit but (personally) I'm far happier doing a simple five minute rectification job on a couple of moulded plastic parts than trying to create one of these vans from brass etchings. I can tolerate the smell of the various adhesives involved, I'm less enamoured however of the smell of singed flesh which is inevitably the consequence of my attempting to solder anything more complex than a feed wire... :-/

 

D

 

PS: Note to anyone who hasn't built a Slaters kit... they do offer, amidst the prodigious amount of paperwork which accompanies their kits, to replace components that the purchaser feels aren't up to scratch.

[Warspite]

...it appears to Stephen (he says, resisting the urge to rush upstairs and check again ;-)

 

You know you have to ....... :-)

 

Have no idea whether this will afflict other examples though? Mine also has a rather more oval than circular hole in said roof where the chimney is due to fit but (personally) I'm far happier doing a simple five minute rectification job on a couple of moulded plastic parts than trying to create one of these vans from brass etchings. I can tolerate the smell of the various adhesives involved, I'm less enamoured however of the smell of singed flesh which is inevitably the consequence of my attempting to solder anything more complex than a feed wire... :-/

 

D

 

PS: Note to anyone who hasn't built a Slaters kit... they do offer, amidst the prodigious amount of paperwork which accompanies their kits, to replace components that the purchaser feels aren't up to scratch.

 

David

 

I'm with you on this one! I have the utmost admiration for those who can build brass kits and my dismal attempts in the past are witness to my ineptitude. I can cope with Slaters, Parkside Dundas and JLTRT (all excellent kits) but that is the limit of my ability. Having said that, I'm just about to start my Slaters milk tanker ........ gulp!

 

S

[3 link]

Having said that, I'm just about to start my Slaters milk tanker ........ gulp!

 

S

 

Enjoy .

 

ATB, Martyn.

[David Siddall]

You know you have to ....... :-)

I did and it does ;-)

 

I'm just about to start my Slaters milk tanker ........ gulp!

 

I trust you'll do an illustrated, step-by-step build - what with you being a bit handy with a camera and all that ;-)

 

Enjoy .

 

Martin, your tankers are superbly finished and delightfully clean. I cannot wait to see the levels of latterday filth Stephen will apply to his! But where will he apply the rust? I don't think the tanks actually rotted did they?

 

Am currently on a bit of a van-quest myself and have just ordered a JLTRT, BR-built, LMS-designed 12-tonner after spending rather longer than I should have (during working hours anyway) trawling Paul Bartlett's photos (...and, to be honest out of a desire to try their multi-media approach before I grit my teeth and start saving for one of their forthcoming a D63xx/Class22s). My milk tanker ambitions are pending the day when its expedient to order the four I want in one go... I fancy that's a rake I'd like to batch-build.

 

David

[3 link]

 

Martin, your tankers are superbly finished and delightfully clean. I cannot wait to see the levels of latterday filth Stephen will apply to his! But where will he apply the rust? I don't think the tanks actually rotted did they?

 

 

David

 

I am just waitting for some warm weather and to be in an artistic mood and you will see I can be just as filthy as Stephen , as far as I know the tanks were made from aluminium and some earlier makes actually had a glass vessel inside the tanks themselves .

 

ATB, Martyn.

[Warspite]

I did and it does ;-)

 

I never had any doubt .......

 

I trust you'll do an illustrated, step-by-step build - what with you being a bit handy with a camera and all that ;-)

 

Well, I've taken everything out of the box and read the first page of the instructions.

 

"We recommend that the buffers and couplings are fitted before the main assembly begins. .......... The couplings supplied with this kit are of the 3-link variety. The coupling hook has a small slot designed for a screw link type if the builder wishes to fit this type."

 

That's fine, except all the photos I've got of milk tankers in BR days shows them with screw link couplings. Now, why didn't I think of that and get some at the Bristol show? I will send away for some but might just fit them retrospectively.

 

That's all I managed today, having spent half the time looking for some screw couplings I'm sure I had. D'oh!

 

Martin, your tankers are superbly finished and delightfully clean. I cannot wait to see the levels of latterday filth Stephen will apply to his! But where will he apply the rust? I don't think the tanks actually rotted did they?

 

I'm already thinking a creamy 'milk gunge' on the barrels although, at my current rate of progress, it will be next year before I get the thing finished!

 

Am currently on a bit of a van-quest myself and have just ordered a JLTRT, BR-built, LMS-designed 12-tonner after spending rather longer than I should have (during working hours anyway) trawling Paul Bartlett's photos (...and, to be honest out of a desire to try their multi-media approach before I grit my teeth and start saving for one of their forthcoming a D63xx/Class22s).

 

If it builds like their BR standard van, you'll love it. The one-piece body is a great help to those of us who struggle to get things square.

 

Stephen

[Warspite]

I am just waitting for some warm weather and to be in an artistic mood and you will see I can be just as filthy as Stephen

 

ATB, Martyn.

 

Martyn

 

I'm sure you can!

 

But judging by the rest of your modelling, it will be very high-class filth and beautifully done!

 

Stephen

[Warspite]

Enjoy .

 

ATB, Martyn.

 

Martyn

 

Forgot to say, following your very helpful thread on building these wagons at 'the other place'.

 

I've got to the bit where you've opened the box ........ ;-)

 

Stephen

[3 link]

Martyn

 

Forgot to say, following your very helpful thread on building these wagons at 'the other place'.

 

I've got to the bit where you've opened the box ........ ;-)

 

Stephen

 

Yes it can look a little more daunting than the average Slaters wagon , with reference to the screwlink couplings I have used CPL 's as they have the correct ones with the fixed tommy bar ( well that's what I call it ) . I look forward to seeing the build, they are a bit more time consuming but still enjoyable to do.

 

Martyn.

[hmrspaul]

 

 

 

 

If it builds like their BR standard van, you'll love it. The one-piece body is a great help to those of us who struggle to get things square.

 

Stephen

 

BUT be careful that you get the correct brake rigging for the type. Several of JLtRT van offerings(especially the special covereds) have the wrong type of brake rigging. They have paired up each body with each of the brake riggings they make, and that is not accurate, some only had the RCH/Morton vacuum brake.

 

Paul Bartlett

[Warspite]

Yes it can look a little more daunting than the average Slaters wagon , with reference to the screwlink couplings I have used CPL 's as they have the correct ones with the fixed tommy bar ( well that's what I call it ) . I look forward to seeing the build, they are a bit more time consuming but still enjoyable to do.

 

Martyn.

 

Martyn

 

Thanks for this. I will follow up the CPL screw link couplings although I cannot find a web site for them. However, I've managed to find an address and telephone number so I'll give them a call.

 

Can you fit them after assembling the underframe, buffers etc.?

 

Stephen

[3 link]

Hi Stephen,

 

Sorry I forgot to tell you that CPL do not have a website, but her turn around time is very good usually return of post. Yes the couplings can be fitted at a later stage or even left to last without problems, but I would fit the buffer shanks just before you start on the brake linkage.

 

ATB, Martyn.

[Warspite]

BUT be careful that you get the correct brake rigging for the type. Several of JLtRT van offerings(especially the special covereds) have the wrong type of brake rigging. They have paired up each body with each of the brake riggings they make, and that is not accurate, some only had the RCH/Morton vacuum brake.

 

Paul Bartlett

 

Paul

 

I very nearly made just that mistake when the JLTRT BR vans came out. It was only after checking the brake gear in your photos (on your old web site) that I realised that JLTRT were erroneously doing the planked side/planked door van with clasp brakes rather than the RCH/Morton brake. I did point this out to JLTRT as I wanted to build one of these vans but they couldn't offer the Morton brake at the time so I went with the Slaters version. I see they now do offer both brake versions but as they give you a choice, you have to be careful to get the right version for the particular body - planked side/planked door, planked side/plywood door, plywood side/plywood door etc.

 

I haven't even thought about the LMS vans ....... that's another adventure! Don't know what we would do without your photos!

 

Stephen

[David Siddall]

... be careful that you get the correct brake rigging for the type. Several of JLtRT van offerings(especially the special covereds) have the wrong type of brake rigging. They have paired up each body with each of the brake riggings they make, and that is not accurate, some only had the RCH/Morton vacuum brake.

 

 

I haven't even thought about the LMS vans ....... that's another adventure! Don't know what we would do without your photos!

 

Uh oh...

 

...Paul, I fear that we need to ask you to stop consistently photographing wagons the right way up! The very least you could have arranged was to have had an example of each up-ended so we could see the prototype brake gear arrangements more clearly. Now... do you know a man with a crane? ;-)

 

David

[hmrspaul]

Paul

 

I very nearly made just that mistake when the JLTRT BR vans came out. It was only after checking the brake gear in your photos (on your old web site) that I realised that JLTRT were erroneously doing the planked side/planked door van with clasp brakes rather than the RCH/Morton brake. I did point this out to JLTRT as I wanted to build one of these vans but they couldn't offer the Morton brake at the time so I went with the Slaters version. I see they now do offer both brake versions but as they give you a choice, you have to be careful to get the right version for the particular body - planked side/planked door, planked side/plywood door, plywood side/plywood door etc.

 

I haven't even thought about the LMS vans ....... that's another adventure! Don't know what we would do without your photos!

 

Stephen

 

Correct, without looking them up, IIRC they offer the clasp brake, with the unique square based V hanger, on several van types which were NOT built after 1957-8 when this was introduced.

 

LMS vans - they interest me. So have looked up http://www.justliketherealthing.co.uk/lms-vans-p-165.html?cPath=7_51 The all planked van is an interesting variant. BUT they have the diag number they quote wrong. Looking at

Essery, R, J, (1981) An illustrated history of LMS Wagons, Volume 1, Oxford Publishing Co. SBN 86093 127 7. viii + 180 pages it is the SR built van diag 2070 (not diag 2088) The diagonal stanchions on the side and end are noticeable differences between these two batches. This is the type they are modelling

http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/lmsvan/e2cbf5a8f

The brake rigging - Morton appears correct - only one set of brakes on one side is needed. This batch of wagons were all listed for vacuum braking in 1958, which is how mine appears.

 

My photos of diag 2088 are not of a good example, but do show the end diagonal very well - an unusual feature

http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/lmsvan/e2251f599

 

They don't illustrate the more usual van described as

LMS D2097 Goods Van -

Corrugated ends, sliding door, morton brake - which appears correct. Again BR would have VB'd these. My photo of one of these is a conversion, but the original character remains

http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/lmsvan/e3c2c9138

 

Apologies to OP for going off on one!

 

Paul Bartlett

[David Siddall]

Now you'd have thought that queuing for nearly three hours in the cold and the pouring rain (from 7.45am) to ensure we got tickets to see Michael McIntyre at a local theatre would be enough to earn sufficient brownie points to gain dispensation to make a start on baseboard construction indoors... well you would, wouldn't you?

 

Hey ho, on with the brakevan, ...and maybe a track panel or two ;-)

 

D

[hmrspaul]

Uh oh...

 

...Paul, I fear that we need to ask you to stop consistently photographing wagons the right way up! The very least you could have arranged was to have had an example of each up-ended so we could see the prototype brake gear arrangements more clearly. Now... do you know a man with a crane? ;-)

 

David

 

David

 

I do have a lot of detail photos on my site, including some wagons on their sides. All of the photos are in the collections of their own wagons, but there are also five collections of these as wagon details at http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/wagondetails The brake riggings are in http://paulbartlett.zenfolio.com/wagondetailspoetc

 

The BR clasp brake is http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/wagondetailspoetc/e224563d6 and http://PaulBartlett.zenfolio.com/wagondetailspoetc/e11a5a78f shows the other side (but also has air brake fittings).

 

Paul Bartlett

[David Siddall]

...have looked up http://www.justliket...html?cPath=7_51 ...they don't illustrate the more usual van described as LMS D2097 Goods Van - Corrugated ends, sliding door, morton brake - which appears correct. Again BR would have VB'd these. My photo of one of these is a conversion, but the original character remains http://PaulBartlett....msvan/e3c2c9138

 

Apologies to OP for going off on one!

 

Absolutely no apologies required Paul. On that basis I can breathe a sigh of relief as I went for a Dia 2097! Helped in no small way by checking out your photos 'before' I placed my order and now confirmed by your research :-)

 

D

[David Siddall]

My Slaters BR brakevan and I are not on the best of terms at the moment (albeit progress is being made)! Firstly, because despite having found a great photo to work from: (courtesy of Paul Bartlett at http://paulbartlett....16bcb#h3a016bcb), I can't rid myself of this horrible feeling that once again the best I'm going to be able to produce will be a bit of a sorry hybrid. I think I'm now at least resigned to the undercarriage department being no more than a vaguely accurate impression of the mind-boggling variety of brake-gear fitted to the prototypes - but then I hope it won't be seen upside down too often. I have however managed to work out the difference between the 'with and without v-hangers' variations courtesy of Keith Norgrove's web page on the subject at: http://www.norgrove.me.uk/pmkbke.htm.

 

Hey ho... so today's modelling initially got me here...

 

 

Wrong brake shoes fitted to one end (duh!) - my error and inevitably identified 'after' I'd discovered that the brakes would have to be packed some distance away from their intended location to avoid fouling the wheel flanges! (The odd bits of brass visible within the underframing are, by the way, waste from the etched fret to provide a bit of extra weight).

 

And eventually here...

 

 

I've also had to do more body mod's (the slivers of plastic strip inserted into the veranda lintels visible in the previous photo, and the strip hiding the gap twixt floor and solebars more readily discernible in this one), were added having spotted that the underframe had gone ever so slightly pear-shaped since it was assembled earlier in the week (well, more banana-shaped actually). Fixing the distortion entailed holding it over a boiling kettle and gently persuading it straight again. Younger viewers should not try this at home - only insane adult modellers might consider it worth risking scalded fingers!

 

What else... well I can't find anything in the kit which resembles the sort of axle-box cover castings shown in the photo I've chosen to follow so I've had a go at fabricating them... with only a minimal degree of success it would appear so far, but I hope a bit more time (and a thick coating of paint and weathering) will sort that out!

 

All in all a day of mixed fortunes. I've had two wagons hit the floor accidentally recently... this one came close (on a couple of occasions today) to doing so ballistically :-/

 

TTFN... D

[3 link]

Hi David,

 

With reference the brake shoes what I do to help stop any binding is take a file and just put a chamfer on the rear of the shoes, and also you will find that when you fix the brake pull/push rods you will have a degree of control as to the final fixing of the shoes ( if you get my drift ) . Not being a rivet counter but if you look at the shanks of the buffers they have a shorter rib on one side and these face upwards, not sure but I think you might have one up the wrong way, sorry.

I have done the same as you regarding placement of some extra weight and have packed a few ounces of lead in there before fitting the cover, that is the only thing with any plastic wagons in my opinion that they all need a bit of added weight. My tankers both had 4ozs of lead added to each one and they seem to move smoother over any track joints and there's none of that rickerty movement for want of a better word . Enjoying the build topic and tomorrows another day, and the yearning to make the van go ballistic will fade .

 

ATB, Martyn.

[David Siddall]

With reference the brake shoes what I do to help stop any binding is take a file and just put a chamfer on the rear of the shoes...

 

Not being a rivet counter but if you look at the shanks of the buffers they have a shorter rib on one side and these face upwards, not sure but I think you might have one up the wrong way, sorry.

 

Hey, no worries Martyn and thanks for the tips (also apologies for spelling you with an 'i' in previous replies). To be honest I'm relieved... an upside-down buffer casting is the sort of gaff that'll only take a moment to fix (I hope ;-). I was sort of expecting far worse. I would have to say though that whilst Slater's kits undoubtedly produce great-looking wagons in a medium I'm comfortable working with, I'd suggest they'd do so a little more readily if the instructions contained a few more hints and were a little more illustrative? But mind you, if they were I wouldn't have challenged myself to find out what I need to know or do what I've had to do to get this one thus far ...perhaps it's a subtle ploy to ensure that anyone who completes one is a better modeller as a result? :-)

 

D

[hmrspaul]

David

 

I'm pleased you are finding my photos helpful. I was worried when you chose this kit, BR brake vans are a mine field - although the book helps

Gent E (1999) British Railways Brake vans and ballast ploughs. Pub. By HMRS 92pp. ISBN 0 – 902835 – 16 –5. and

Silsbury, Roger & Mann, Trevor., (1983) The 20 ton standard goods brake van. Model Railway Constructor vol. 50 (part 589) pp 279 - 283.

Drawings - Brake van diag. 1/504 (286); Brake van air pipe diag. 1/507. There are so many changes with major features down the years of building from LNER onwards.

 

I'm also embarrassed that my two concerted attempts at this kit are still laying around in bits. What I would have advised - and this is a general one - is to do the detailing before the build. There are a lot of hand rails on this which are easier to put on, on the flat. I also always put buffers, couplings and pipes in place before building them on.

 

Regards

 

Paul Bartlett

 

PS I'll be interested to hear how the JLTRT van goes. Unfortunately they don't seem to be appearing at Halifax, the only O gauge I attend.