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Progress on a possible J17 kit


Fen End Pit

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Since I built my J17 by scrapping most of the parts of a PDK kit and making my own etched and 3D printed bits I have been thinking about the possibility of turning the result into a kit. A first draft of the artwork was turned into nickel-silver by PPD with help from my good friends at Brassmasters. (If this turns into a kit that will be where it will come from). The intention is the use etched metal for the chassis and thin bits like the cab and foot plate while 3D printing the complex shapes like the boiler and tender.

 

The first test etch has turned out pretty well and I've had my first go at putting the chassis together, after the external Walschaerts  valve gear of the Ivatt this was nice and straight-forward. I've opted to design the chassis using what I have learnt from the design of Brassmasters' Easichas(sis). I've used their square hornblocks and run them in the chassis cut outs, adding an overlay which combines the cosmetic leave spring below the axlebox and a continuous springy beam (CSB) wire carrier above. Rather than have to solder hand rail knobs or the like into the chassis for the CSB wire pivots I have just located the chassis cross members in the right places and added holes for the wire. The result is a simple to assemble sprung chassis.

 

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Inspired by David Lane (BigCheeseplant) I had a go at 3D printing my own centres to convert Alan Gibson 16 spoke wheels into 15 spoke GER wheels. He kindly sent me a 3D model but in the end I went back to the Great Eastern Railway Society drawing and made my own. A friend with a lathe produced a nice little jig to allow me to assemble the wheel and tyre ensuing that everything is concentric. 

 

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The resulting chassis runs, I think I might have to look at pinning the wheels to the axles because the resin is not as 'grippy' as the Alan Gibson plastic. As per normal power is provide using High Level Models superb gearbox and motor.

 

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I printed the body work out yesterday. Five and half hours on the Phrozen Sonic Mini 4K produced this lot, I will go back and do some modification in the slicer to modify some of the support, some is not needed and there are some bits where moving it would make removal easier. Still not bad for an afternoons' printing.

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Bearing in mind that the photograph above is BEFORE I've done anything to the surface finish, there really isn't that much required. After removing just a bit of support resin.....

 

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.... I was left with these pieces for the body and tender.

 

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and these for the inside motion (I've since realized I need to split these again because of one of the frame spaces)

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So now I have to solder up the footplate and cab etches and make the etched tender chassis.

 

 

The etchings will allow for multiple variants of the body, I've already drawn up one version as vacuum fitted and one as steam braked only. I've got versions of the tender with and without the cut out for the token exchange equipment. It should be possible to do non-super heated version (shorted smokebox without rivets) and even a round topped boiler J16 version. I'll be interested to hear what folks think about a 'mixed media' kit like this so please let me know.

 

David

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To me, a very interesting proposition.  At some point in the future I will need to build one in EM though it is somewhat down the queue. 

 

In the future,  would definitely be interested. 

 

Martyn 

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I have a VERY old Bec J17 (warts & all) which was running on a Triang (?) chassis complete with X04 and shiny oHrnby wheels. Last year I got a new SEF 0-6-0 etched chassis, Markits wheels, HL gearbox, and a CCT motor. Basic construction of the chassis was completed, still got the details to fit but it got sidelined, I'm on the verge of restarting it. Being aware of the 'stretched' shortcomings of the body, I'd love something better, your version looks good (though not sure about taking on the wheels?). I'm following this with interest, but the old 'Bec' will also survive all this, it's in its 'forever' home just like a pet cat!

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2 hours ago, stewartingram said:

I have a VERY old Bec J17 (warts & all) which was running on a Triang (?) chassis complete with X04 and shiny oHrnby wheels. Last year I got a new SEF 0-6-0 etched chassis, Markits wheels, HL gearbox, and a CCT motor. Basic construction of the chassis was completed, still got the details to fit but it got sidelined, I'm on the verge of restarting it. Being aware of the 'stretched' shortcomings of the body, I'd love something better, your version looks good (though not sure about taking on the wheels?). I'm following this with interest, but the old 'Bec' will also survive all this, it's in its 'forever' home just like a pet cat!

I see Markits do a 4'9" 15 spoke wheel which would probably be fine in EM or OO. The frames I have designed fold up to be a suitable width for P4 but I've included spacers on the etch which can be used if you need something narrower.

David

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If there is sufficient space to add a decent amount of weight - it’s surprising just how much weight even an etched body has when it’s finished - then I think this kind of mix is a good idea if the body material isn’t that hard and easily fractured type. All the 3D printed details I’ve tried to use to date have suffered this and been ditched as not useable. Perhaps I’ve just been unlucky. Certainly having all the splasher details attached and ready to glue onto the etched footplate in one go seems great. Will certainly look forward to seeing it finished.

 

Bob

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Have you thought about making the tender body as an etch, there is a depression where the coal slope is and I would suggest you need the thinness but also robustness of the brass to make a durable but convincing tender flair?

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On 16/07/2023 at 22:41, Portchullin Tatty said:

Have you thought about making the tender body as an etch, there is a depression where the coal slope is and I would suggest you need the thinness but also robustness of the brass to make a durable but convincing tender flair?

One of the hardest bits with the PDK kits for ex-GER locomotives is the tender flairs. The 3D print comes out pretty well and slight line you see on the photo cleans up quite easily. As to the robustness the 3D print I have on my first J17 is still looking good after being hauled around and shown to various people. I have had the footsteps break off with heavy handling but stick back on with superglue.

 

David

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With regards to the J17 tender, this should have a rectangular coal space and not a sloped self trimming type. Only B12 and B17 Sandringham's had self trimming versions of the large Holden tender. You can find more detail from Llyn Brookes article in GERS Journal 92. 

 

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Another old 4mm J17 kit that has not been mentioned above is the Stelfox etched brass one from the 1980's. It's a good starting point if you can find one but rare as the proverbial hen's teeth! Bernard Weller took it over from Stelfox and sold some of the castings up to the early 2000's but never re-released the kit. 

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31 minutes ago, BartlowHills said:

Another old 4mm J17 kit that has not been mentioned above is the Stelfox etched brass one from the 1980's. It's a good starting point if you can find one but rare as the proverbial hen's teeth! Bernard Weller took it over from Stelfox and sold some of the castings up to the early 2000's but never re-released the kit. 

 

I am lucky enough to have one salted away. 100% brass which is really nice.

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