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Brassey

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  • Location
    Cheshire
  • Interests
    LNWR/GWR Joint Lines

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  1. As the OP was about pre-grouping carriages, my marshalling contribution was based purely on pre-grouping observations; I have no knowledge of other periods which may have differed. In the interests of some who may want further illumination, herewith marshalling from the GWR for the Summer of 1912. As can be seen, the means by which these carriages returned was already established in the internal marshalling documentation of the railway. These carriages did not go off to carriage depots but were held at the destinations to be returned (balanced in LNWR terminology) from whence they came to form the same service the next day: As can be seen, a number of LNWR stock ended as far away as Penzance, Plymouth, Exeter and Bristol returning to Crewe along with some GWR vehicles that finished in Liverpool and Manchester. The WCJS 6 wheel Fish Van (of which there was probably only one diagram) must have returned from Bristol to Aberdeen empty via an undisclosed route!
  2. I have some GWR documents for 1912 (my period of interest) which I believe are at Kew PS: my documents (also 1912), from the L&NWR Society Study Centre, are for the LNWR/GWR joint lines so cover the GWR too to a certain extent
  3. Carriage marshalling documents do survive and one can identify the carriage diagram sometimes by deduction for example if it states brake third with 3 compartments - there may not be many diagrams that fit that description. Most of the descriptions were looser than that though. But in the case of the LNWR for example, if it states 6 wheel break van, then the LNWR only made one diagram of that type in great quantity and was a vehicle in wide use in pre-grouping days. Regarding "strengtheners", in the marshalling documents (sometimes confusingly called diagrams) movements were balanced which showed how the vehicles were allocated in both directions. Sometimes the allocation was written on the solbar as per some photos in Russell so carriages usually worked the same train every day. So I don't get the impression there was much stock unallocated lying around in sidings. However, sometimes there may be a comments such as: on market days Shrewsbury to provide an additional 2nd class carriage, so there must have been some.
  4. The bearings should be a loose enough fit in the guides so that they fall out under their own weight but definitely not sloppy. Were these acquire used? Both the MJT and LRM types are unsprung so will need either some beam compensation or CSB setup.
  5. But Tony Wright is building for 00. For P4 you need to employ different techniques to rigid. I have a feeling this chassis is EM?
  6. As we are dealing with some small tolerances between a free and stiff chassis, I am not sure how you can establish this without using the jig to assemble the chassis. I have never encountered a problem when soldering with 145 degree on my Hobby Holidays jig. One solution to the heatsink issue is to solder the side away from the main body of the jig first, take the chassis off, flip it and solder the other side. Another thought is that with an all horn block construction, the wheelbase is a moveable feast as things move up and down, so you will need to open out the rods slightly. However, looking at the pics, you appear to be using the Romford crank pins which IIRC are about 1mm whereas the Hobby Holidays jig is designed to use 1.5mm rod holes so I am wonder whether the jig was setup using these rods?
  7. I am currently building the same chassis but I can't see how using the RR+ doesn't end up with the back end of the gearbox in the cab. I am going to resort to using the drive stretcher as per the Dean Goods configuration.
  8. I live in Stretton. There are a number of Naval graves in the churchyard including a number of young ladies from the base that were killed on the road one night either to or from a dance in Warrington. Very sad.
  9. The RCTS "The Birkenhead Railway" states: GW '3571' class 3577 worked from October 1895 to March 1949. In February 1912, 3577 was at Birkenhead. 3580 was also at Birkenhead that year...from 1907 the 3571's were augmented by Metro classes displaced from the London suburban lines electrification. At the turn of the century, tank engines generally took over from tender engines; 517's as well as the Metros. Herewith at Heswall with a 517 in charge of LNWR stock: "The larger passenger engines shedded at Chester rarely, if ever, saw Birkenhead and the Paddington expresses could be headed by almost anything from either company over this section." "The vacuum braked goods which the GW pioneered around the turn of the century were hauled by passenger engines."
  10. This is a pic of a GWR 2-4-0 3240 at Manchester Exchange. It has probably come from Birkenhead and is being turned for the return Journey. It looks to me to be in the pre-1906 Indian Red livery. I do not know the date of the photo but might be within your time frame. In 1912 3240 was indeed shedded at Birkenhead by which time at had acquired a B4 Belpaire boiler instead of the round top pictured. The 3232 class is in the Martin Finney range now sold by Brassmasters and would avoid scratch building. Tender engines coming from Birkenhead heading for Manchester were facing the right direction whereas the GWR expresses heading West via Shrewsbury required a reversal at Chester so I think it is likely that a Chester engine took them forward from there and maybe a more lowly engine brought them out of Birkenhead.
  11. The LNWR tender passenger locos were as follows: Birkenhead - 18 1912 ‘Small Jumbo’ 35 Talisman, 486 Skiddaw London Road Models provide a kit for these in 4mm All the other LNWR locos at Birkenhead were either tank engines, probably engaged on the Manchester services, or goods engines.
  12. I have some listings for 1912 that are arranged by engine number not by allocation. If you are genuinely interested in building a certain class then I can see whether any of that class were allocated to Birkenhead or indeed Chester. Unlike the LNWR, the GWR did not issue its numbers so randomly so most are arranged by class but there are about 3,000 numbers to go through. As this was a joint line, the LNWR had a presence but you may have that information already.
  13. Also minus its lookout duckets
  14. The short answer is I don't know but it might be worth asking this on the LNWR Society Facebook page as there will be more knowledgable members on there than I.
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