Cofga
-
Posts
230 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Blogs
Gallery
Events
Exhibition Layout Details
Store
Posts posted by Cofga
-
-
6 hours ago, ERIC ALLTORQUE said:
I get confused as to renting my empty bedrooms or motors but it think its a 3 pole they went for over the 5 pole,not coreless,anyone took the plunge and pre ordered Aegis from DCC concepts for running these models?
I did several videos on using the Aegis system and various aspects of installing it in the fascia of a layout and installing a programming track. The production units are now in shipment from China to the UK and DCCconcepts plans to begin shipping pre-orders this coming week. The video series start with:
-
1
-
1
-
-
The Manor has a 3 pole skew wound motor with a flywheel. You can use BEMF with coreless motors, just never place a coreless motored loco without a decoder on a DCC powered track as the high frequency of the DCC power can overheat the motor.
-
1
-
-
34 minutes ago, BMacdermott said:
Hello Larry
In balance (and support of Accurascale), my two Manors (Draycott and Erlestoke) both have good slow start and slow running performance.
I agree that they are not the best locos I have for this, but they aren't far off and it doesn't spoil my enjoyment.
I'm not an 'electrical expert', but I do wonder if controllers make a difference. I use what were Kent Panel Controls handheld units (now made by All Components) and I have the feedback switched to zero (or very low).
Brian
With a modern top of the line transistorized controller with feedback I think you should be able to get better DC slow speed control. My most recent is a 20 year old MRC unit and with that the loco was OK but still tended to start with a lurch at about 1.7VDC. However it is as smooth as silk with DCC. The combination of the keep alive and back EMF control gives nice slow speed control without any stuttering or jerkiness.
-
2
-
-
After 4 1/2 months of operating my Manors I have finally posted a video with my observations. In spite of the clickbait title I love the Manor and after receiving my first, I went back and ordered a second. These really are some of the best steam locos in my collection. Here’s a link to the video.
-
8
-
1
-
1
-
-
On 19/11/2023 at 10:31, Tallpaul69 said:
Afternoon All,
My sound fitted 7810 arrived a few days ago but I delayed opening it until I had a decent period of time available to do it carefully and do some running.
The loo looks great and the matt black smokebox is first class!
The only glue spot i have found so far is hidden on the underside.
I am happy with the sound, although I agree it is a little on the quiet side. Fiddling with the CVs may improve the volume.
Initially the running seemed odd. I put it on my test track and it didn't move although chuffing heartily! I then realised that the driving wheels were whizzing round, it was slipping mightily.
I put it on the test track in order to change the code. While doing so I realised it had a 4 digit code set in as well as the usual 003 code. So I decided to run it on the layout under the 4 digit code.
On the 4 digit code it surprisingly , given the slipping on the test track, seemed very stiff, running best in reverse! It also stalled at places no other 4-6-0 has.
After some running it has started to run better, although still has some way to go, so I am persevering with it.
Should I lubricate it, I wonder?
Others experience in this area would be appreciated?
Cheers for now,
Paul
Mine arrived dry so you might check the gears and axles. Apparently some got missed at the factory.
-
2
-
-
15 hours ago, exmoordave said:
Many thanks CK for your thoughts above (30/10) concerning your Manor. I have since decided to stick with it and conduct some further running-in sessions in the hope that it will bed-in and give slow, smooth starts & stops. It is a lovely loco and I'm very impressed with the appearance - at least I was - until the chimney came off! Now before anyone jumps down my throat and accuses me of being ham-fisted, I must say that only the merest touch by the edge of my finger brought it onto the baseboard! Obviously, no problem to refix, but the lack of adhesive between the joint was obvious. So, a warning to everyone - don't sneeze too hard, as you may find something similar happening to one of your models!!!
You’re not alone, the chimney on my Anthony Manor fell off too when I removed it from the box. That was a good thing as it allowed me to see that the copper top is actually a turned metal insert and not an appliqué. A few dabs of gel CA and the chimney was back in place in no time. The water fill hatch also almost came off but another dab of CA took care of it too.
-
1
-
1
-
1
-
-
17 hours ago, St Enodoc said:
Thanks Larry.
So, in simple terms, when I receive my non-DCC loco and fit my own ESU LokPilot 59828, what (if anything) will I have to do to disable the stay-alive?
BTW I always use Decoder Pro to set up decoders, if that makes the answer simpler.
Thanks.
Assuming what Juergen told me is correct about the LokPilot, then by simply turning button F6 off the stay alive should shut down and by turning button F6 on again the stay alive should work. At least that’s the way mine now works using a Tsunami2 but I have to use button F27. As I said I have not tested this as I do not have a LokPilot decoder. The ESU USA guys have for several years been telling us to turn the stay alive off when programming the decoder to prevent damage.
-
1
-
1
-
-
While it might seem bonkers, it is one of the realities of using the LokSound decoders and PowerPack stay alives. These require 3 connections—2 for the power connection and a third to control it. I think Lenz and DCCconcepts also use similar 3 wire stay alives. Accurascale could have designed the circuit board without the PowerPack and just included solder contacts on the circuit board and that way users could install either the 2 or 3 wire stay alive devices depending on the type of decoder to be used. But then users would complain because they would have to install their own devices and decoders. This is one reason why I write about model railroading instead of selling any of the stuff! As someone pointed out the stay alive may be redundant in these models anyway as they may be heavy enough and have enough power pickups to compensate. John at YouChoos has told me that the Zimo decoder he has used seems to work so it likely has a function on pin 13 that is on by default so check with him and see what he says. And as I related Juergen at ESU told me the LokPilot can control pin 13 using F6 but I don’t have one to test. That should cover about 95% of users and as English poet John Lydgate once said “You can please some of the people all of the time, you can please all of the people some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time”—Larry
-
5
-
1
-
3
-
1
-
-
I found the answer as to how to turn the factory installed PowerPack stay alive on and off when using decoders other than the factory installed LokSound one. This gets a bit technical so hopefully it will be useful for you. Basically it comes down to knowing that pin 13 on the Next18 decoder socket/plug of the Accurascale circuit board is what is used to control the PowerPack. By default under the NMRA standard this is identified as Aux4 which is a logic output. In the LokSound decoder pin 13 is automatically turned on and off when required so you don’t need to do anything.
When using a different decoder all you need to do is find a way to turn pin 13 on to activate the PowerPack. In my case I was using a SoundTraxx Tsunami2 steam decoder. I contacted their tech support folks who were able to tell me that by pressing function button F27 I could do just that. And sure enough it works now. However I will need to turn it off and on manually when programming the decoder and at other times should the function get turned off, if for example the command station is shut down. LokSound USA have for several years recommended that the PowerPack be turned off during programming to prevent damage to decoders.
But what about other brands of decoders. I asked ESU about the LokPilot 5 and was told function button F6 will turn it on and off. Unfortunately there is no comprehensive listing I could find of these settings. Consequently you will need to check with the tech support folks for your decoder. Also there may be decoders for which there is no function assigned to control pin 13. But you may be able to change the function settings and map it to a specific function button. The important thing to remember is pin 13 which is by the standard Aux4. Good luck with your specific brand of decoder—Larry
-
1
-
7
-
2
-
-
1 hour ago, McC said:
Apologies. My confusion entirely as the diesels have decoder selection dips, the manor as it has a much simpler pcb does not. Mea culpa. Please ignore any reference to dip switches in the manor.
Thanks for clearing that up, although I had hopes I had missed something and this could be sorted without a major overhaul. OK, so tomorrow out comes the circuit board and in goes a bigger speaker and SoundTraxx UK steam decoder.
-
1
-
-
1 hour ago, McC said:
The included manual has a set of pin configs (should also be on a yellow ‘warning’ card). The pin arrangement is different for DC , an ESU chip or a non ESU chip
Apparently I am missing those. I have both a DCC fitted Cookham Manor and DCC ready Anthony Manor. With Cookham Manor I received the green booklet on the history of the locos, the instructions with the exploded diagrams and info on fitting the crew and details, and a sheet with a list of the DCC functions. Anthony Manor just had the 2 booklets, there was no yellow “warning” card with either and nothing on these pin configs or dip switches you refer to. Can you post a pdf or scan of what you are referring to? And yes, I just pulled everything out of both boxes to recheck.
-
3
-
-
2 hours ago, McC said:
Have you checked the dip switch array is in the ESU setting? Its needed to switch through the correct pins to the stay alive also?
What dip switch? The Next18 socket and pin arrangement is a standard and should be consistent between all Next18 configured decoders and sockets. If ESU/Accurascale have configured the socket differently for this decoder/installation then that is something they have not mentioned in the past! Can you clarify exactly what you mean?
-
On 05/10/2023 at 14:03, Cofga said:
I am just testing my new Anthony Manor (arrived last night) and it does the same thing. Lift the tender off the rails and it slows down. So there seems to be some interaction with the circuit board. I plan to eventually gut the tender and hardwire a decoder which will bypass the circuit board entirely—it will be interesting to see how this changes. Right now I have given it a few test runs straight out of the box and it is in the midst of a 1 hour break-in run. I measured track voltage and it appears the loco begins to move at about 1.7-1.8VDC—will that change without the circuit board? Will it run slower? I also wonder how slow speed ops would change if the DC pickups are connected directly to the motor, bypassing the circuit board? Of course you would lose the firebox flicker effect but maybe that is part of this interaction—Larry
Well, I give up on the stay alive. I have tested both Anthony Manor and Cookham Manor and the stay alive feature in both works with the LokSound decoder. However when I swap in a DCCconcepts Zen decoder or a Soundtraxx Tsunami2 the stay alive doesn’t work. I think I will gut the tender in one of them and hard wire a Soundtraxx UK steam decoder and put in a larger speaker enclosure for more sound. One thing I did find out is that the starting voltage is about 1.7VDC and with a DCC decoder you definitely can get both locos to creep a lot slower than with a DC controller. I imagine that if one had the time and patience to fiddle with the speed control CVs you might be able to go even slower but hard to say. One would hope that the Accurascale DCC expert or ESU tech would have optimized the speed control for the factory installed decoder—Larry
-
1
-
3
-
-
23 minutes ago, Harlequin said:
Yes, Zimo MS450 but it’s hardwired, completely replacing the PCB.
Could be due to different PWM frequencies and/or algorithms. Zimos use higher frequencies than most others, I think.
Sorry, I meant getting the stay alive on the PCB to work with a decoder other than the factory installed one.
-
57 minutes ago, Harlequin said:
Yes, I’ve been wondering about that. I have many locos that exhibit a similar growl during slow speed under DCC control, so under PWM control. If you think about it as the motor speeds up or slows down there will be times when the motor RPM is in phase with the PWM frequency and I wonder if that’s what causes the growl.
I just heard from John at YouChoos and he says he has had no trouble getting the stay alive to work with his Zimo MS580 sound decoders. Has anyone here had any luck getting theirs to work with a decoder other than the factory equipped decoder? It definitely didn’t work with the DCCconcepts decoder I tried yesterday. I still have a SoundTraxx Tsunami2 Next18 sound decoder I can try tomorrow.
As for the growl it was a little louder using the DCCconcepts decoder than the factory one but that is with 2 different locos. Maybe tomorrow I will pop out the factory decoder and replace it first with the DCCconcepts one and then the SoundTraxx and see the difference. I love a good mystery and this qualifies!
-
1
-
1
-
-
11 hours ago, Izzy said:
The smaller and more efficient a motor is (and some are now IMHO silly small) the more it will growl under DC PWM because it will have less capacity (mass) to absorb the low frequency high voltage pulses and the subsequent heat produced.
Not sure if it makes any sense but I’m just wondering if somehow this is connected to the large size of the stay-alive fitted on the PCB. That the loco pickups alone can’t supply enough current to keep it topped up in addition to providing power to the motor. Unless of course it’s just the extra drag produced from physically holding the tender away from the rails?Bob
Not likely, as it does it on DC and DCC, even with no stay alive functionality. I tested Anthony (DCC ready) and it growls a lot in one direction at slow speed but is quiet in the other so I suspect the gearbox. Will it quiet down after some extended running? However I also have not completely discounted the motor and PWM interactions. Maybe some fiddling with the drive algorithm could quiet it more.
-
1
-
-
On 04/10/2023 at 12:08, ERIC ALLTORQUE said:
Have you checked in the tender as it sounds like its dead shorting through the tenders wheels,are they to ground or reversed in polarity?
I am just testing my new Anthony Manor (arrived last night) and it does the same thing. Lift the tender off the rails and it slows down. So there seems to be some interaction with the circuit board. I plan to eventually gut the tender and hardwire a decoder which will bypass the circuit board entirely—it will be interesting to see how this changes. Right now I have given it a few test runs straight out of the box and it is in the midst of a 1 hour break-in run. I measured track voltage and it appears the loco begins to move at about 1.7-1.8VDC—will that change without the circuit board? Will it run slower? I also wonder how slow speed ops would change if the DC pickups are connected directly to the motor, bypassing the circuit board? Of course you would lose the firebox flicker effect but maybe that is part of this interaction—Larry
-
1
-
1
-
-
On 29/09/2023 at 13:34, McC said:
Our warehouse team are 7 days now and we are about 80 meters from the DHL international hub :)
Just got an email from DHL that they have picked up Anthony Manor and it is on its way with delivery expected by 5 Oct. So I guess I will be busy next weekend giving it a breakin and installing a decoder, etc. I am excited to see just how slow it will run on various DC controllers before conversion to DCC—Larry
-
3
-
1
-
-
On 23/09/2023 at 22:23, Cofga said:
A lot of interesting discussion today about the decoders and slow speed operation. So far I have not been able to test mine on DC as I don’t have a NEXT18 blanking plug. However I have ordered a DCC ready Anthony Manor and once it arrives will give it a break in and tests on various DC controllers. My suspicion is that a transistorized DC controller that provides PWM power at the track should offer performance similar to the PWM power delivered by a decoder. On the other hand DCC decoders also have feedback monitoring (BEMF) that can improve motor performance, something most DC controllers do not offer. Here in the US we typically operate HO/OO scale at about 14 volts DCC and I know some guys who use 12 volts to give proportionally slower speeds due to the fact that a decoder provides about 1-1.2 volts less to the motor than DCC track voltage. I use DCC Concepts Alpha Meters to monitor track voltage and amperage—Larry
Well I now have a DHL tracking number for Anthony Manor, so lord willing and the rivers don’t rise it should be here by this time next week. However that just means that DHL has received the shipping info from Accurascale but not picked up the package yet, does DHL pickup in Birmingham on Saturdays and does anyone work at the Accurascale warehouse on weekends?
-
2
-
1
-
-
1 hour ago, geoffers said:
Thanks for the suggestion. Yes I have thought about it but to be honest the constant removal of the tender of 7800 is starting to cause damage with bits falling off and the tender connection becoming detached during the process. It is not too easy to re-attach with arthritic fingers and dodgy eyesight. So I am very, very reluctant to do so. I did try a Bachmann 36-567A in 7800 initially (not the same one as in 7812) but whereas it worked in 7812 the 7800 one did not give stay-alive. I suppose I could send it to Accurascale for them to have a look at but I did purchase the loco from my local shop and I don' want to hassle them with it, and it is too much of a faff for a loco that, apart from the stay-alive, is working well. I think I will abandon this now and just enjoy the loco for what it gives.
I sympathize with you. Those little handrails at the front corners are a real pain to reattach and the connector plug can be difficult to remove and reinstall. I have a DCC Concepts Next18 decoder which should be compatible with the ESU PowerPack and plan to give it a test when Anthony Manor arrives. I am beginning to wonder whether this board is so specifically designed for the LokSound decoder that the PowerPack may only work with it. But the socket is a standard wiring configuration so it should be compatible with any Next18 decoder.
-
1
-
1
-
2
-
-
1 hour ago, geoffers said:
Reset tried. No difference.
Have you tried swapping the LokPilot decoder with the LokSound decoder in Erlestoke Manor? That would answer whether it is a circuit board failure or just something related to the LokPilot?
-
1
-
1
-
-
5 hours ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:
Powercab users will have to advise on what this system can do in the way of decoder set up.
One of the greatest assets of DCC is the ability to closely match performance of the locos on track, whatever motors and gear ratios have been employed. I do it myself, timing the loco on a scale mile circuit, and rarely needing to adjust more than CV's 2, 5, and 6. Then whack in a heap of inertia simulation on CV's 3 and 4 depending on the usual traffic the loco is allocated to, and job done.
Not much to say on functions, as my utilisation is confined to turning lights on BR diesels down to 'as low as possible' often assisted by a filter, for the 'glom of nit' provided by a 40W filament bulb.
I have a video on my YouTube channel on speed matching DCC decoder equipped locos so they operate together at the same scale speeds. While I use a speedometer for this you can also match them by running them on the same track together and adjusting their relative speeds while running with programming on the main. Here is a link to that video.
-
3
-
-
2 hours ago, Miss Prism said:
What's the gear ratio?
Don’t know the ratio but it is designed to take advantage of the motor speed range and provide a scale top speed of the prototype locos themselves. The motor was originally a high quality one designed for use in some dental applications so is not a cheap one. It has 3 poles but is skew wound and that along with the flywheel provides smooth slow speeds without any cogging. While it does not seem capable of the extremely slow crawling speeds on which Sam likes to base his reviews, with DCC and the stay alive capacitors it starts at a prototype speed on step 1 and moves through points and frogs without any hesitation or variation in speed—Larry
-
1
-
4
-
1
-
1
-
1
-
-
A lot of interesting discussion today about the decoders and slow speed operation. So far I have not been able to test mine on DC as I don’t have a NEXT18 blanking plug. However I have ordered a DCC ready Anthony Manor and once it arrives will give it a break in and tests on various DC controllers. My suspicion is that a transistorized DC controller that provides PWM power at the track should offer performance similar to the PWM power delivered by a decoder. On the other hand DCC decoders also have feedback monitoring (BEMF) that can improve motor performance, something most DC controllers do not offer. Here in the US we typically operate HO/OO scale at about 14 volts DCC and I know some guys who use 12 volts to give proportionally slower speeds due to the fact that a decoder provides about 1-1.2 volts less to the motor than DCC track voltage. I use DCC Concepts Alpha Meters to monitor track voltage and amperage—Larry
-
2
-
3
-
Accurascale's First Steam Locomotive; GWR Collett 78xx Manor Class!
in Accurascale / Irish Railway Models
Posted · Edited by Cofga
I am surprised to see you have several of these still in stock. However my impression of the UK market is that modelers tend to prefer to visit their local hobby shop and pick out the model they are interested in instead of buying direct. However given my positive experience with your service and shipping I would encourage anyone considering purchasing a Manor to take a look at what you have in stock and also get the word out to their friends that these are still available—Larry