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Peco Turntable Motor

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On mine I used the MERG Indexed system, works out about £20 more than the peco one for a fully indexed setup.

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On 27/02/2019 at 19:45, jcredfer said:

However, the bridge will still go at a set speed, regardless of load.  All of which has nothing to do with the point that Indexing was not like the methods the full size turntables used.

 

Indexing is important because unlike on a full size turntable we may be controlling it from some distance away, often at an odd angle with vision partly obscured by buildings and locomotives on adjacent roads. Nothing is less prototypical than frequent derailments and appearances of the hand of god! As for speed, this can be controlled by using an existing analogue power controller via a three way switch to ensure the loco cannot move when rotating.

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I've got one of these turntables to build and was thinking of making my own mechanism for it using Meccano.  But I was under the impression that the new Peco motor was going to incorporate[orate indexing (and it seems earlier posters in this thread thought that too), but this doesn't appear to be the case now.

 

Most complete, "RTR Indexing " Turntable items are in the area of £300+ to buy and making your own is quite complicated.  Peco must have come to a similar conclusion during their planning.   A matter of choice, really.

 

Re the use of Meccano, there are risks of noise problems, particularly if the previous Peco sold "Clearbox" motor is used.   {Google videos of motor driven Peco TT, to hear just how horrendous this can get!!} I bought the kit in the picture below, which is very simple to fit and whisper quiet.  It is held on by the collar on the Gearbox Axle.  It is also beautifully slow, at over one and a half mins for a 180deg, controlled by running it from a Loco Decoder {Address No. 69  :rolleyes:  }, which can also be seen in the picture.   It is very easy to line up, being slow and from the handset speed control, just like a slow Loco. The brass length slots onto the plastic H section, glued to the underside, as at the left hand end {right hand end yet to be positioned and glued}.

 

TT_under_1.JPG.490148ea2efb2e9f9b294be15432dee6.JPG

 

The system also used the Peco split-ring Polarity Switcher, which is part of the kit and the wiring diagram for it is below.

 

721894607_SplitRingPower2.jpg.bbb00d30cb55de77776238548a16a553.jpg

 

There are some interesting alternative ideas from other people too, here...

https://www.dccconceptsforum.com/post/peco-turntable-10042071?&trail=15

and the link near the top.

here https://www.dccconceptsforum.com/post/mister-rustys-workbench-dcc-peco-turntable-control-9914890?pid=1307180246

 

Regards

Julian

 

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7 minutes ago, Broadway Clive said:

 

Indexing is important because unlike on a full size turntable we may be controlling it from some distance away, often at an odd angle with vision partly obscured by buildings and locomotives on adjacent roads. Nothing is less prototypical than frequent derailments and appearances of the hand of god! As for speed, this can be controlled by using an existing analogue power controller via a three way switch to ensure the loco cannot move when rotating.

 

All perfectly fair points, although a matter of personal choice, horses for courses etc.

 

It was my choice to included the DCC Loco decoder, because I wanted to use the Bus Wires for control of the TT and not have to use an, additional, separate 12v DC Bus.  That enabled its operation with no further wires or switches to prevent the Loco on the TT from moving and also allows for the on-board sound on the Loco to be played.  The TT was also planned to be close enough to the controller to see it's movement, so not an issue for me.

 

Regards

Julian

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14 minutes ago, jcredfer said:

Most complete, "RTR Indexing " Turntable items are in the area of £300+ to buy and making your own is quite complicated.  Peco must have come to a similar conclusion during their planning.   A matter of choice, really. 

My understanding is that Peco were going to use the Locomotech indexing system but agreement was not reached and they continue to produce kits themselves with or without indexing to power the Peco turntable. The price for their Roundhouse automatic indexing Motorizing Kit with 32 exits is £67.99

 

https://locomotech.com/index.html

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41 minutes ago, Broadway Clive said:

My understanding is that Peco were going to use the Locomotech indexing system but agreement was not reached and they continue to produce kits themselves with or without indexing to power the Peco turntable. The price for their Roundhouse automatic indexing Motorizing Kit with 32 exits is £67.99

 

https://locomotech.com/index.html

 

Yes, I saw that when I bought their motor and nearly purchased the Indexing kit, with it.  It needs to have time to set it up accurately {no point it doing that item any other way}, but nothing that care and patience could achieve.  I didn't go for it in the end, because of the preferred solution outlined above and only need a 180deg turn. 

 

I didn't know that was the intended Peco choice, perhaps they will get back to it, although not very easy to see how it might fit the current box.  Maybe that's just the angle the pictures show.

 

Julian

 

 

Edited by jcredfer
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On 10/10/2019 at 10:15, Derails Models said:

Power has to be provided from an independent 12vDC 2 amp supply,

 

 

TWO amps??!! How big is this turntable? Seems large enough for a 12":1ft Terrier.

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Watching this as I am getting very close to committing to the final turntable design on my HO Port Costa (California) layout.  Unfortunately to be prototype it needs an HO 70 foot turntable so the much longer Peco table and pit cannot be used.  I dearly would love a plastic casting for a pit that  is only 245 mm in diameter (61.5 feet in 4 mm scale) as it would save a lot of work building a pit and supporting it 

 

 

The Port Costa table had two leads, two tracks into the roundhouse (engine shed) and two "garden" tracks (uncovered engine storage.) The image from a test track fitting below shows what I mean. 

9-17-19 c right east PC yard.jpg

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Can anybody tell me how much depth it adds below the base of the turntable?

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On 08/11/2019 at 17:20, Hintez said:

Can anybody tell me how much depth it adds below the base of the turntable?

 

That rather depends how long your shaft is - the one attached to the TT Bridge.  I pushed mine fully home, so that there was only a 1/4 inch showing above the collar joining the Bridge shaft to the motor gearbox.  That gives 5 inches from the base of the TT to the end of the motor. The TT Well is another inch, to the top of the baseboard.

 

{I should perhaps mention that when pushing the shaft fully home, there is some sort of a ridge, in the shaft housing, preventing it from going all the way.  I measured the depth with a thinner rod and discovered that the shaft could go further, once past the ridge and that the ridge was quite small.  an application of a 4mm drill dealt with that and I was then able to obtain the maximum contact area between the Bridge axle and the housing, for glueing.}

 

Hope that helps.

 

Regards

Julian

 

Edit: I should, perhaps, add that they do seem to change the source for their motors, from time to time, so maybe my measurements might be a rough guide for depth.  To be fair, it shouldn't be too far from whatever they buy next.  They were quite happy to provide measurements when I bought mine.

 

Edited by jcredfer

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Anyone know why locomotech do not do an indexed version of their n-gauge turntable, seems odd given they do the motor etc for both gauges, what do they use for indexing that is not compatible with n-gauge? 

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I'm not impressed by Peco's offering.

Apart from a fancy looking control box it doesn't seem to be any advance on the cheapo gearbox kits that have been around for years and which could be controlled from the DC or DCC system.

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1 hour ago, Paul80 said:

Anyone know why locomotech do not do an indexed version of their n-gauge turntable, seems odd given they do the motor etc for both gauges, what do they use for indexing that is not compatible with n-gauge? 

 

Their website only gives information about the two turntables it provides Indexing Kits for.  It does specify that the existing kits work on light through slits, but no specific accuracy range mentioned.  Perhaps the question for information about specifications would be best referred to the manufacturers.

 

Julian

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I tried that but got no reply

 

Anyone with this system could you post a photo showing their indexing system as they don't show it on their website.

 

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I found this earlier, although, frankly it isn't ideal, but does give some sort of an idea.  The pictures are near the bottom of the page.

 

 

Regards

Julian

 

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If you scroll down in this one, there is a slightly clearer view of the circular indexing disk, and it does seem to show the slots in it.  I clicked on the image and then clicked on that to enlarge it.  some slots can be seen clearly at 7 - 8 o'clock.

 

 

 

Regards

Julian

 

Edited by jcredfer

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12 hours ago, Paul80 said:

Anyone know why locomotech do not do an indexed version of their n-gauge turntable, seems odd given they do the motor etc for both gauges, what do they use for indexing that is not compatible with n-gauge? 

 

I don't see why the 00 system couldn't be modified for N Gauge, by extending the N Brass restraining strip to the same distance out as the 00 one and using the 00 slotted disk kit.  The angular travel would then be precicely the same as the 00 TT, with the same accuracy.  The big question then remains as to whether those same tollerances would allow for sufficiently close alignment of the N Gauge Bridge Rails to the Approach Rails.  {Possibly why Locomotech haven't yet made it an offering.}

 

It might be possible to fudge the ends of the Approach and Bridge Rails, by filing a wedge off all the inside faces {already recommended by Peco for the 00 version} and perhaps a further outward tweek of all the rail ends.  It would probably also need small conducting metal plates under the modified ends for the wheel rims to run on.  It might just be easier to locate the TT controls close enough to enable the Locomotech Motor to be rotated by a normal loco controller, visually aligned.

 

Regards

Julian

 

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Loco mech are still trading and very busy. I have a motor on order which they can’t supply  at the moment as they have run of bits and awaiting supplies. I did have to drop them an email to find out this information, but I did get a quick response.

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On 08/11/2019 at 20:34, jcredfer said:

 

That rather depends how long your shaft is - the one attached to the TT Bridge.  I pushed mine fully home, so that there was only a 1/4 inch showing above the collar joining the Bridge shaft to the motor gearbox.  That gives 5 inches from the base of the TT to the end of the motor. The TT Well is another inch, to the top of the baseboard.

 

{I should perhaps mention that when pushing the shaft fully home, there is some sort of a ridge, in the shaft housing, preventing it from going all the way.  I measured the depth with a thinner rod and discovered that the shaft could go further, once past the ridge and that the ridge was quite small.  an application of a 4mm drill dealt with that and I was then able to obtain the maximum contact area between the Bridge axle and the housing, for glueing.}

 

Hope that helps.

 

Regards

Julian

 

 

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I had a wee play with the new Peco motor the other day at Harburn Hobbies. It is a very nice, slow movement, slow enough to make alignment easy enough. If you overshoot, there is a small degree of slack in the gears that the motor takes up when reversing, thus gives it a very slow start for a second or two which makes fine tuning the stop point much easier.  
One thing I did notice though, the turntable was quite jerky and didn’t rotate smoothly. I don’t thing this was down to the motor as it is quite common on center pivot driven TTs. I guess you need to build it carefully with a low friction bearing in the middle so it runs smoothly. 
all in all, I was quite impressed. 

Edited by Chameleon
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4 hours ago, Chameleon said:

I had a wee play with the new Peco motor the other day at Harburn Hobbies. It is a very nice, slow movement, slow enough to make alignment easy enough. If you overshoot, there is a small degree of slack in the gears that the motor takes up when reversing, thus gives it a very slow start for a second or two which makes fine tuning the stop point much easier.  
One thing I did notice though, the turntable was quite jerky and didn’t rotate smoothly. I don’t thing this was down to the motor as it is quite common on center pivot driven TTs. I guess you need to build it carefully with a low friction bearing in the middle so it runs smoothly. 
all in all, I was quite impressed. 

 

Before I built a Peco TT, I looked at many videos, which proved rather useful.  Some points became evident, like smooth running relied upon proper running of the Bridge on it's wheels, ensuring the proper removal of flash between the 3 Well pieces, ensuring that the vertical walls had no vestige of gap between them, ensuring that the circular rail track was absolutely smooth all the way round and a decent very slow motor / gearbox unit.  I agree totally with the comment about the central pivot, which should only centre the Bridge and should not play any part in bearing the Bridge weight.

 

As for the Peco unit, I am yet to be convinced of the improvement over driving a decent motor / gearbox with a normal variable speed loco controller, DC or DCC, dependant upon layout choice.  That said, the Peco is a vast improvement over their previous Clearbox motor and gearbox, the new one is easy to fit and does the job.  Well done Peco.

 

Regards

Julian

 

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