HST upgrading

[jamessolomon]

Saw a video on YouTube from a follow and it showed how to put lights into a mk3 coach which got me interested in the idea of adding lights to the coaches. Was upstairs over the weekend and wondered what would it take to upgrade an old ringfield motored Hornby HST since its in bits from previous attempts to get it running. I had been to the local model shop to snap up the last 2 BR Blue mk3s I needed for the transition rake and still was tempted to upgrade.

 

I posted some Flickr links in an old topic I revisited showing IC125 pulling BR Blue mk3s and it got me started on upgrading the set to look a bit less toy and more model and to find an alteritive to the ringfield motor to power it. it may become my winter project to see this through with pics on progress and if I need help

[pheaton]

Hmmm....personally...

 

if you on a tight budget then i would ditch the Hornby HST altogether IMO it has far too many body issues, and thats before you look at the motor.

 

option 1 purchase a lima HST just for the bodyshell (lima did all BR liveries) and then purchase a Hornby railroad HST (virgin livery) just for the chassis which has a smoother motor in it the railroad hst is actually the lima HST re-released with an updated motor and a DCC socket the lima bodyshell is a straight fit (you might have to mod the old lima weight retainers you can just clip these out) you might also have to add a bit more weight.

 

option 2 if purchase a lima hst powercar and dummy and use that they are more than capable of hauling 8 coaches as long as the motor is in good nick.

 

I did see some use a bachman 25 to re-motor a HST but it was a lot of work.

[6029 King Stephen]

I am considering something similar for a Triang/Hornby Blue Pullman power car and dummy that I bought off eBay.  I am thinking along the lines of fitting a spud bogie unit and dummy unit to fit to each power car, which will enable easy conversion to DCC.  Given the anticipated re-release price of almost £600 (!!) for the Bachmann product, I think this will be a much cheaper solution.  All I will need to do then is source suitable coaches to attach vinyl overlays to and I will have a full set. 

 

Maybe a spud bogie would be suitable for you HST upgrade?

 

Regards,

 

Steve

[James Makin]

Another option could be to motorise a mk3 coach and have both your power cars as dummies - I did this using a Bachmann 166 chassis in a (scale length) Hornby buffet car, then stuck the Hornby mk3 bogie side frames back on - it was a powerful runner for a full 8-coach set back in the days before the new Hornby power cars came along!

 

You could use a powered chassis from the Bachmann 158/159/166/168/170 as they're all the same and with wheel spacing that looks a very decent match!

 

Best of luck!

[DCB]

Not sure the Hornby HST is a good starting point.

 

The Lima bogies are dead simple to add pick ups to, with one insulated and one un insulated wheel per axle just put the wheels in the right way round and add a brass strip bearing on the axles with the wires led up through the holes in the top of the bogie fixings. Run the power through a decoder or rectifier resistor capacitor arrangement  and Roberts your mothers brother.

 

You will probably need 5 volts for clear LEDs as HSTs have very white lighting.

 

Hornby wheels vary from 14mm gauge square axle to fully insulated so really are not suitable. and Lima wheels wont fit being on shorter fatter HO axles   Draggy old Wheel back pickups will definitely require two power bogies.

[James Makin]

Would the 158/159/166/170 chassis require any modifications besides changing the sideframes to fit in a mk3 coach or is it just a straight drop in fit.

 

The powercars could be completely remotored using the bogies, motor and drive shafts ( suitably modified to fit the length ) from a Bachmann class 24/25 loco. The sideframes would need to be changed for the hst sideframes. With this process both powercars could be done and would easily handle 7, 8 or 9 mk3s depending on the region being modelled.

 

 

As I recall from when I'd done the conversion (it was 2002, eek!) I just slotted the Bachmann 166 chassis in with no modifications, other than to transfer over the cosmetic underframe which was chopped out from the old Mk3 chassis and glued onto the bottom of the Bachmann mechanism, with the side frames then also changed. I added some plasticard packing inside the Mk3 body so that the coach sat correctly on the new chassis and clipped into the slots available on the Bachmann metal chassis casting. The wheels are slightly smaller so would benefit from changing if one was keen! 

 

In general, with the amount of faffing around we're all proposing it might just be easier to bite the bullet and obtain some new-style Hornby power cars - I still see the very first batches (Virgin, GNER and Grand Central etc) pop up for reasonable prices (c.£100-£120) at exhibitions, it's only the later models where the price has got truly ridiculous!

 

Hope this helps,

James

[sub39h]

Agree with a lot of the above. The original Hornby Class 43 has completely the wrong shape and isn't worth it.

 

Either start with Lima, and consider these for remotoring:

 

http://www.diesel-trains.co.uk

 

Or get the super detailed one which can be had for reasonable prices if you hunt around.

[JDW]

Its a fair point, I'd certainly prefer to use the Lima (now Hornby Railroad) model over the old Hornby one, its a decent model and the revamped Railroad versions of olther models run much better than the Lima ones, I assume the HST will be the same. On the other hand, if I had to use a pair of old Hornby power cars, while accepting they're not the best I think I'd be doing a few things besides changing the motor. The light clusters always fit badly, I'd look at tidying those up, maybe paint the recess they fit in to black or silver or whatever the most appropriate colour is for the livery. Maybe run a black marker pen around the edge of the clear plastic bit too. The air tanks could do with attaching to the chassis not the coupling. And the bogies look very chunky, clould they be modified if fitting Lima ones weren't an option? From memory they have a big piece of plastic across each end that could be removed for a start.

 

If I were looking to remotor, I'd say the easiest option would be to fit a second Ringfield type motor in the power car, though you'd be losing some potential pick up wheels as one side has traction tyres. I'd be surprised if a pair of good Ringfields with a bit of added weight couldn't move a decent length train. If you're not after finesse, they should do the job (maybe do the same to the second power car?) though if you're wanting precise slow speed running, something more modern would probably be best.

[MJI]

What is wrong with the Ringfiejd HST power cars?

 

Also Lima ones need windows cut for phase 1 power cars (WR and ER) as they are NESW and MML power cars

[JDW]

Yes, the old Hornby ones have windows, but as a model they are a lot more basic than the Lima version, the front end is poor (the light clusters especially), as are the bogies, which are very chunky. That said, one was repainted in a recent edition of Model Rail in to the new GWR green livery and looked quite reasonable.

[Derekstuart]

On the subject of front ends- and I grant that I will be in the minority here- I just don't think the new Hornby one looks right. Well detailed, especially the lights and horn grill, but something just doesn't seem right to me and I can't put my finger on it.

 

Certainly it is disappointing that it has prominent moulding lines on the side of the nose.

[JDW]

I've had similar thoughts, Derek, and I don't know why either. I do quite like the Lima one. I think there's a whole debate we could get in to about whether its more important to bee accurate to the n'th degree or for it to look right ... but we'd better not open that can of worms again!