Strand and its trains

[Guy Rixon]

Here's the track plan on the 1895 map. The part between the outer ends of the train shed (blue rectangle) and Chandos Street depot (left-hand green polygon) is about 15 feet in 4mm scale, which is all I can allow myself.

 

 

I haven't drawn the lower-level depot south of the Strand. I haven't worked that part out yet. The end of the hoist siding indicates the natural axis for the track entering the depot, but I don't want it making too broad an angle with the station, as it has to go off-stage at the end of the layout. Also, the run-round loop in the hoist sidings may be a little too long -  it only needs to take a short cut of wagons - in which case the hoist is nearer the Strand: that helps.

 

I'm not entirely sure about the market sidings. It may be better to reverse the entry to that depot (again!) and take a lead off the loop siding, passing across the Strand near the PH symbol on the map. This also allows the possibility of a street-level siding crossing into the undercroft of the Market sidings from Strand depot. This would be horse shunted in the dead of night. If I can achieve Electric Ned, the fake model shunting horse, then this would be a nice feature. Or maybe it can be shunted by locos with reach wagons.

 

The plot on the corner of Agar Street and the Strand is being kept clear for a model of the BMA headquarters (latterly Zimbabwe House), which is about the only recognisable building in the compass of the layout.

 

Finally, there should be a covered walkway from Charing Cross station, starting near the refreshment rooms shown on the map. This cuts straight across at first-floor level to meet the Strand train-shed near the south end. It provides the scenic break for the lower yard.

[Nearholmer]

This gets more intriguing as it goes on.

 

As regards access to a wagon-lift in a very cramped location, can I recommend Walworth Dust Sidings?

 

This was where rubbish and horse manure was loaded into rail wagons, hoisted-up (lift highlighted with red splodge) onto the viaduct, then trundled out to Kent to be dumped into old brick/chalk pits, or spread on fields. Notice the sector plate.

 

You haven’t swept away the “Coal Hole” pub, I hope.

Edited February 13, 2018 by Nearholmer

[Guy Rixon]

Thanks. I was aware of Vestry, although I've only just spotted the weighbridge next to the hoist. 

 

Most of the Stand plans to date have had the hoist in a small loop à la Vestry, and I might go back to that. In the current plan i moved it to the end of the siding firstly because I wanted to angle it more and secondly because this plan demands a loop where engines can run round cuts of wagons - it's needed to shunt the market sidings and helps with getting tail traffic to the hoist. Maybe a double loop is called for?

 

PS: the Coal Hole is further east and is quite safe.

Edited February 14, 2018 by Guy Rixon

[Edwardian]

Here's the track plan on the 1895 map. The part between the outer ends of the train shed (blue rectangle) and Chandos Street depot (left-hand green polygon) is about 15 feet in 4mm scale, which is all I can allow myself.

 

Strand-track-map.png

 

I haven't drawn the lower-level depot south of the Strand. I haven't worked that part out yet. The end of the hoist siding indicates the natural axis for the track entering the depot, but I don't want it making too broad an angle with the station, as it has to go off-stage at the end of the layout. Also, the run-round loop in the hoist sidings may be a little too long -  it only needs to take a short cut of wagons - in which case the hoist is nearer the Strand: that helps.

 

I'm not entirely sure about the market sidings. It may be better to reverse the entry to that depot (again!) and take a lead off the loop siding, passing across the Strand near the PH symbol on the map. This also allows the possibility of a street-level siding crossing into the undercroft of the Market sidings from Strand depot. This would be horse shunted in the dead of night. If I can achieve Electric Ned, the fake model shunting horse, then this would be a nice feature. Or maybe it can be shunted by locos with reach wagons.

 

The plot on the corner of Agar Street and the Strand is being kept clear for a model of the BMA headquarters (latterly Zimbabwe House), which is about the only recognisable building in the compass of the layout.

 

Finally, there should be a covered walkway from Charing Cross station, starting near the refreshment rooms shown on the map. This cuts straight across at first-floor level to meet the Strand train-shed near the south end. It provides the scenic break for the lower yard.

 

 Brilliant. Very good to see a track plan fitted to the map like this.  One can begin to visualise the layout.

[Guy Rixon]

Predictably, the track plan at Strand has mutated. (Hands up anybody who didn't see that coming...nobody? Didn't think so.)

 

The previous plan worked pretty well until I came to lay out the lower yard and then it stopped making sense. Problem 1 is that the goods sheds in the main yard, and the hoist, need to be where the track is close to street level, not way down at the south end where ground level is a few stories below the viaduct. This puts them where I have the loco facilities. That's fixable, but problem 2 is that the angle of the incoming tracks with the lines on the viaduct is too great. I can draw out a sensible layout from a fake-history point of view, but the fiddle yard for the goods depot stick out too much at the front to make a good model. This is not easily fixable.

 

Therefore, I've reworked it for viewing from the east side, with some of the goods facilities moved to that side of the running lines.

 

 

In this schematic east is at the top (Dwarven conventions...)

 

The Metropolitan's depot is now in Bedford Street rather than Chandos Street. The Market sidings are also in, or possibly over, Bedford Street, that street being considerably wider at its lower end than the historical version.

 

Strand A and B goods sheds are really two ends of one shed that includes the undercroft of the passenger station: they are built into the west and east sides of the viaduct respectively. The lower lines serving these sheds are not shown (nor worked out in detail, yet) but are assumed to be shuntable only with horses and capstans: they would have approach curves down to 3 chains or so and many turntables. Some of the lower lines on the east side will show on the front of the layout and may actually be workable, if I make working capstans. The lower reception lines and main wagon standage for Strand goods are immediately west of A shed and the number 1 hoist links to them. Most of this complex will be hidden behind the upper-level fiddle yard.

 

The upper level of B shed is the older perishables depot, built before the Market sidings were installed. It's an open structure, somewhat like the upper level at Birmingham Moor Street goods. The number 2 hoist, which is a large one, capable of taking a two four-wheeled wagons or one 6-wheeled NPCS van, descends into the lower interior of A shed; therefore it takes wagons between the scenic part of the layout and the fiddle yard.

 

I haven't detailed all the pointwork around B shed, the Met. depot or the Market sidings, as I'm waiting to see what fits onto the map. I think B shed has two sidings with a loading bank between and the hoist's stub siding abutting the end of the bank. The Met. facilities are a shed with two short sidings (basically Vine Street depot) and possibly an open siding in front of them. The Market sidings are either a short loading bank with two sidings or a longer one with a single sidings.

 

Goods trains from the north that detach wagons at Strand halt on the Down relief and set back the front of the train either into the exchange sidings or into the east-side sidings directly. (Open question: is this feasible if the train has to be divided while on a 1 in 50-ish gradient?) After setting down wagons, these trains either on to SECR metals (to Hither Green or Herne Hill) or shunt into the west-side sidings to depart north from the loop siding alongside the passenger platforms.

 

Passenger trains from the north that terminate either use platform 2/3, from where they can depart directly onto the Up main, or the terminate in platform 4 and are shunted via the carriage sidings into platform 1 for departure. Passenger trains from the south that reverse (mainly the shuttle from Herne Hill) arrive in platform 1 and go via the carriage sidings to platform 3 or 4 to depart. They may shed through portions in the process.

 

Through coaches arriving from the north generally do so in platform 4 and are then shunted onto the back of the portion starting from Strand in platform 3.

[Nearholmer]

This is sounding awfully like a real project ....... that by normal hobby-hours would take many years to complete.

 

Is that where this is going, because, if it is, I seriously want to attend it’s first show.

 

Kevin

[Compound2632]

Why does the down main have a platform face on both sides? I'm aware there are locations where this was done, though am still puzzled why. Ascot, for instance.

[Guy Rixon]

Kevin, thank you for that vote of confidence. I definitely intend to build Strand and I'd like to do it while I'm still young enough to exhibit it. Now that the track plan is stabilising, all that prevents me from starting to build is lack of money. If the financial squeeze eases this year, I propose to build a small section as a cameo, possibly the B-shed complex with its capstan-worked lines. That will then get absorbed into the larger layout in due course. If the cameo layout meets the criteria for the S4 society's "Standard Gauge Workbench" program, it might get invited to Scaleforum in 2019.

 

Compound: the road with two platform faces is left over from a previous plan. Half a dozen version ago, I needed a goods-arrival loop connected to the passenger line on that side, so two island platforms seemed a good way to go. In the current plan, it might safe some space to put the relief-line platform on the outside. However, I rather like the arrangement on the centre road as it stands, and it does give cross-platform interchange between CCEJ locals and SECR trains starting from Strand.

[Sarcodelic]

Well OT, but anyone who hasn’t read a biography of Yerkes is advised to do so. It isn’t only his financial affairs that wouldn’t stand up to modern scrutiny.

 

On finances, his biographer said “Yerkes didn't invent corruption in Chicago. He merely perfected it, bringing order to what had been a chaotic system of bribery."

A very amusing 'compliment'.

 

On a more serious note Strand has the potential to be be a truly awesome layout. Central London, SECR, LNWR, Metropolitan, Metropolitan District, GWR, interesting architecture and engineering. Sounds extremely interesting.

Edited March 9, 2018 by Sarcodelic

[wagonman]

There's a small group of modellers in Sarf Lunnon – the remnants of the erstwhile Norwood MRC – who are building a P4 model of the old Blackfriars station in the 1880s. This is the LCDR station that used to stand on the south bank of the river. Not sure how they are progressing...

[Guy Rixon]

In the search for a convincing arrangement for Strand's B-shed complex, I came across Peter Kay's article on the Brick Lane site of the ECR/GER in the London Railway Record. This turns out to be an astonishingly close match for what I had imagined.

In this map, North is up and the running lines are, at the top, the main lines into Liverpool Street and below, the goods lines into Bishopsgate. The goods depot is both on viaduct and at ground level (tick!) and consists of multiple sheds. These are the "old granary" (shown blue), the "new granary' (green) and the ground-level shed (yellow). There is is also a wagon hoist (tick; highlighted in red). Along the side of the viaduct, at street level, inset tracks run to other goods facilities (tick!) which at Brick Lane are associated with the Spitalfields coal-yard and the exchange sidings for the ELR (visible at the right-hand edge of the map).

 

Abstracted to Strand, the top of the map faces west. The old granary becomes B shed. The new granary becomes a new facility, C shed, and serves to mask the length of the fiddle yard while allowing B shed to remain compact. The ground-level shed doesn't fit at Strand, so the ground-level tracks can be truncated to the east face of B shed. The tramway to the right edge of the map leads, at Strand, to the street-level part of the Market Sidings. The hoist is the hoist, but becomes more of a prominent feature than a theatrical star-trap dropping into the shed.

 

In operational terms, I can shunt C shed with locos at viaduct level, and similarly shunt wagons to the hoist. The upper lines into B-shed can be worked by Hand of God using working capstans, but I think I would not attempt that at shows when all of Strand is present; it might be disruptive. The lower lines around B shed might be worked but hand-shunting cuts of wagons out from under the viaduct. The tramway I would try and work realistically, using perhaps a wagon-pusher running in the slot between a running rail and check rail.

 

Concerning the latter gimmick, my ultimate aim is to introduce Ned the Electric Shunting Horse as the visible motive power. Since Ned and his handler are shy, they always work on the operator's side of the wagons, and hide inside the shed between jobs, so nobody can see that they're actually static figures attached to a wheeled platform...

 

I need to simplify the viaduct-level tracks to make it buildable, but that's plausible as Strand is a smaller and more specialised depot than Brick Lane; also built on higher-value land.

 

Finally, Strand needs a coal depot. I may place it in front of C shed, served by a traverser. It would be somewhat like the depot at Cambridge Street near St. Pancras.

[Nearholmer]

Somehow, in my nls maps tour of the goods facilities of London I’ve missed this particular bit. What a gem it is!

 

Notice the ‘even lower level’ ELR crossing below the yellow shed? And, on the far right of your extract, the blind tunnel that was supposed to connect the ELR to the GER more usefully that the ‘in and out of Liverpool Street’ route?

 

The bit I’ve never quite worked out is where the wagon lift that connected the ELR to the GER in this area was. I don’t think it is the one you’ve highlighted, which goes from viaduct to natural ground level ........ there was either another one from natural ground down to the ELR, or direct from viaduct down to ELR. Maybe it wasn’t built until a bit later.

 

And, where did the coal trains to serve the big coal depot come from?

 

In want of a time machine, Kevin

[Nearholmer]

Aha!

 

It was later. Here it is c1914.

[Regularity]

Hoist by thine own pétard, eh?

[Guy Rixon]

Aha!

 

It was later. Here it is c1914.

 

Yes. I was surprised that no hoist was there in the c.1895 map. There was freight on the ELR then, so it must have been worked through Liverpool Street. However, the 1895 map has track in the dead-end tunnel, so presumably the hoist was just about to be installed. Unless that was a where the wagons were store in the day, waiting to go to Liverpool Street at night.

[Guy Rixon]

Hoist by thine own pétard, eh?

Well the Brick-Lane hoist is at the end of Artillery Street. Someone at the ECR must have had the same sense of humor.

[Nearholmer]

According to what looks like a reliable source, the Spitalfields coal-drop viaduct was built in 1866, and the extra bit with the hoist in 1900.

 

I wonder if the sidings in the blind tunnel were used for carriages, because the LBSCR might have needed somewhere to put some at that end of the line. I’d always imagined good trains being marshalled at new cross, then forwarded ’off-peak’, either around lunchtime or in the evening/night.

 

More generally, these goods and coal depots and services are ‘dark territory’ from a photographic viewpoint. The odd record shot by their owners, but often next to nothing else. I think if it wasn’t for the availability of maps, the massive railway freight infrastructure of London might have sunk without trace. There is definitely a book waiting to be written about it.

[Regularity]

There is something about some of these coal depots in one of the “Great Eastern in Town and Country” volumes, IIRC.

[wagonman]

There is something about some of these coal depots in one of the “Great Eastern in Town and Country” volumes, IIRC.

 

 

That's what I thought – and vol 1 does have something on the depots around Fenchurch Street – but the best info and photos of Spitalfields and its environs are in the BRJ Special Great Eastern Edition (Wild Swan, undated but late '80s).

 

 

PS: it includes a couple of good shots of the Granary wagon hoist from street level

Edited March 18, 2018 by wagonman

[Nearholmer]

Interesting. I’ll look out for that.

 

My comment was meant more broadly, that goods facilities across the whole of London, and I guess other cities, were ‘secret’ places. The famed railway photographers didn’t pay them much attention, and I can’t imagine that many goods porters counted amateur photography among their spare-time pursuits.

 

One would barely know that every one of the great passenger termini had a twin or more.

[Compound2632]

One would barely know that every one of the great passenger termini had a twin or more.

 

Here's a well-documented example, albeit from a provincial city. Here the principal station was joint; one of the owning companies had three large goods depots nearby - one on each of its approaching lines, while the other had two. It's notable that four of these were developed on sites that were the original passenger termini of the various lines, with only one being built on a green-field site.

[Brassey]

There's a Grade II listed Midland Railway Goods Warehouse in Liverpool City Centre.  Don't know if it ever had any rail connections!

 

https://www.britishlistedbuildings.co.uk/101062567-midland-railway-goods-offices-central-ward

[Orion]

The LNWR goods depots in Sheffield and Nottingham were elevated and in tight locations. Possibly they would be good examples to look at for general goods traffic. The Sheffield one was covered on the LNWR Society Facebook site recently. 

[Compound2632]

There's a Grade II listed Midland Railway Goods Warehouse in Liverpool City Centre.  Don't know if it ever had any rail connections!

 

https://www.britishlistedbuildings.co.uk/101062567-midland-railway-goods-offices-central-ward

 

Marked on the 1906 25" map as Midland Railway Receiving Warehouse - not rail connected. It was common for the railway companies to have receiving offices for small consignments at premises around many towns and cities - often in other shops (much as one has PO counters in convenience stores these days); there would be a cart come round to collect and take to the goods or passenger station, depending on the consignment. I think it's unusual for it to be done on such a grand scale but Liverpool was probably something of a special case where competition for traffic was intense - note the strategic location between the city centre and the LNWR's Lime Street Station!

Edited March 18, 2018 by Compound2632

[wagonman]

Interesting. I’ll look out for that.

 

My comment was meant more broadly, that goods facilities across the whole of London, and I guess other cities, were ‘secret’ places. The famed railway photographers didn’t pay them much attention, and I can’t imagine that many goods porters counted amateur photography among their spare-time pursuits.

 

One would barely know that every one of the great passenger termini had a twin or more.

 

 

Most of the photos in the BRJ article (and probably in 'GER in Town & Country' though not credited) seem to be the work of the 'official' photographer, now in the NRM collection.

 

 

Richard