Beginner soldering help

[Geordie Exile]

Hi all. I've just started playing with soldering n/s etches. I'm getting the hang of some elements, but I'm struggling when it comes to attaching one piece to two previously soldered pieces. Parts A & B are already soldered, but add Part C, and it undoes the existing joint with A & B sliding away from each other.  (I hope that makes sense). Everything is pre-tinned and the shape of the pieces makes them impossible to hold them together mechanically while I'm working.

 

So is it bit size, temperature of iron, or just me being cack-handed and needing more practice?  I've been using a narrow pointed bit, and my iron is set to 350C (It's a 60w iron, with a variable dial ranging from 200C to 450C)

 

Any advice welcome.

 

Richard

 

(Edited to show size of pieces: The whole model is a laminate of bearing-sheave-bearing-bearing-sheave-bearing. I'm working in 2mm so there are going to be lots of fiddly bits!)

Edited June 28, 2020 by Geordie Exile

[Torper]

How big are the parts concerned?  What sort of solder are you using? A picture might be helpful.  Without any further information I'd be thinking of turning the iron up to 450 degrees and thereby spending less time on the joint to be soldered.

 

DT

Edited June 28, 2020 by Torper

[down the sdjr]

Hi Geordie,

Im very much a beginner myself but you can get solder with different melting tempatures, standard and detailing solder. Others here will answer you much better than i can.

[Geordie Exile]

29 minutes ago, Torper said:

How big are the parts concerned?  What sort of solder are you using? A picture might be helpful.  Without any further information I'd be thinking of turning the iron up to 450 degrees and thereby spending less time on the joint to be soldered.

 

DT

Hi DT. I've edited the original post to include some more details. Solder is Silverline 60/40 and I'm using tiny amounts of flux paste applied with the end of a cocktail stick.

 

R

[Izzy]

Hi Richard,

 

Would I be correct to think this is a winding wheel for your colliery? It’s just that I am trying to visualise the parts to suggest how I might tackle such a job. As you have found it’s not just getting the solder to melt, but holding the bits together correctly. If it is a wheel does it fit on a shaft? Can holes through the centre for said shaft align it all together and solder the lot in one go. Soldered onto the shaft perhaps. Certainly I would use a larger chisel bit to get more heat to the centre quickly. An in-out job so the heat doesn’t spread over the whole assembly but keeps it localised. 
 

Izzy

[brossard]

The bit pictured looks dirty to me.  Try to clean it up so it is shiny (do NOT file it).  I'm finding brass wool is very effective:

 

https://www.amazon.ca/Aoyue-Soldering-Cleaner-Sponge-Needed/dp/B005C789EU/ref=sr_1_3?dchild=1&gclid=CjwKCAjw_-D3BRBIEiwAjVMy7LZelT4ts_IENAcO-34a4qE0hSwJhZb-dOzF2QuuaP4JKqMK0W14BBoCsOMQAvD_BwE&hvadid=229997850686&hvdev=c&hvlocphy=1002516&hvnetw=g&hvqmt=e&hvrand=2822809261055718246&hvtargid=kwd-300822213772&hydadcr=27421_10625040&keywords=brass+wool&qid=1593348002&sr=8-3&tag=googcana-20  

 

but you can use a damp sponge.  Try to find tinning compound:

 

https://www.amazon.ca/Platon-Tt-95-Solder-Remover-pointe-étain/dp/B001UGZZ8K/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=tinning+compound&qid=1593348048&sr=8-2.   

 

Dirt doesn't transfer heat well so you may have to linger too long for the joint  to make.  Try putting in a new bit and tin the first time you use it.

 

When soldering things as you have pictured one trick is to attach parts as far away from previously attached parts as possible.

 

John

[jcredfer]

How about making a jig, by boring a hole of the same size as the external diameter of the wheel and a couple of mm deep, in a flat piece of softwood.  Lay the bits in, apply DCC Concepts "No Wash" flux get the tip to 450 load up tje tip and run round the edge, leading with some of their thin solder, so you don't get too much solder under the tip.

 

Julian

Edited June 28, 2020 by jcredfer

[dhjgreen]

Use normal solder to join A and B then use a lower melting point solder to join C to them.

[Torper]

I find aluminium hair clips very useful in holding bits together for soldering.  That's in 4mm, of course - they might be too big for 2mm scale!

 

DT

[Geordie Exile]

4 hours ago, Izzy said:

Would I be correct to think this is a winding wheel for your colliery? It’s just that I am trying to visualise the parts to suggest how I might tackle such a job. As you have found it’s not just getting the solder to melt, but holding the bits together correctly. If it is a wheel does it fit on a shaft? Can holes through the centre for said shaft align it all together and solder the lot in one go. Soldered onto the shaft perhaps. Certainly I would use a larger chisel bit to get more heat to the centre quickly. An in-out job so the heat doesn’t spread over the whole assembly but keeps it localised. 

The wheel was sent to me by a very kind member of this forum, along with a dodgy etch for me to practise on (you can see incomplete wheel in the photo in the OP).  Unfortunately they're too small for my colliery, but they're too beautiful not to use somehow!  I'll think of something.  I think on the next version I'll do as you suggest, ream out the hole in the centre of all the pieces and use that as a combined shaft/jig.  I'll give the larger bit a try too.

 

4 hours ago, jcredfer said:

How about making a jig, by boring a hole of the same size as the external diameter of the wheel and a couple of mm deep, in a flat piece of softwood.  Lay the bits in, apply DCC Concepts "No Wash" flux get the tip to 450 load up tje tip and run round the edge, leading with some of their thin solder, so you don't get too much solder under the tip.

Thanks for this: as I've said to Izzy, for my next go at this specific model, I'll use a central shaft to hold all the pieces in place, but I may give the softwood jig a go in other future attempts.

 

4 hours ago, dhjgreen said:

Use normal solder to join A and B then use a lower melting point solder to join C to them.

Genius and simplicity combined!  I'll get some lower melting point solder to add to my armory.

 

4 hours ago, Torper said:

I find aluminium hair clips very useful in holding bits together for soldering.  That's in 4mm, of course - they might be too big for 2mm scale!

Wouldn't have worked in this case, but I've come across this recommendation a few times: I think Eileen's Emporium sells them too, and I'm making a shopping list.

 

5 hours ago, brossard said:

The bit pictured looks dirty to me.  Try to clean it up so it is shiny (do NOT file it).  I'm finding brass wool is very effective:

...

but you can use a damp sponge.  Try to find tinning compound:

...

Dirt doesn't transfer heat well so you may have to linger too long for the joint  to make.  Try putting in a new bit and tin the first time you use it.

 

When soldering things as you have pictured one trick is to attach parts as far away from previously attached parts as possible.

I already had the damp-sponge thing on my stand, so thought I wouldn't bother, but again I've seen the brass wool recommended in favour of sponges (and they're echoed in the reviews on the Amazon link you provided) so I'm adding a brass-wool holder to my shopping list.  Never heard of tinning compound, but I'll look some out.

 

As ever, thanks to the good folk of RMW for the advice.

 

Richard