A Fruit C for Cwmdimbath wot I put in Scratches and Kits when it should be here!

[The Johnster]

Part the next.  With the body sitting too low on the chassis, I cast about for something about the right size to pack it up from the top of the chassis, the 'floor' of the body being the ballast weight sitting on the shelf about  8mm up from the bottom edge.  A piece of plastic channel with sides of this order, IIRC from inside a Lima Siphon G originally, was cut to length and the body sat on top; just about right!  Image 0559.  Image 0564 shows the body sitting on top of the chassis matched for height to my Parkside Fruit D, and with the buffer beams attached.  

 

This evening's session has seen the steps glued on, faffy but very satisfying,  They are real treewood, Sainsbury's coffee stirrers cut in half lengthways and to length; I used a photo of 2862 at Didcot as guidance for this, so this van will probably take that as it's prototype.  Nothing clever, just superglued them to the inside of the bottoms of the door frame where it extends below the bottom edge of the body, and the lower ones to the relief on the LNER axleboxes; the chassis is donated by an old Hornby LNER double door 8 plank mineral cut to length, see image 0567.  I'm rather pleased with this and the way the van is coming together in general.  

 

Still to do; fabricate roof and rain strips (as far as I can see these vans did not have roof ventilators) , make good gap between ends of solebars and buffer beams with Milliput, one end drawhook is missing. couplings, and transfers once I've made up my mind about the livery.  2862 was built in 1939, brown livery with shirtbutton device, possibly retained until early 50s given the unlikelihood of it having a repaint during the war and subsequent austerity period, so that is a viable option, but I rather like the Dapol crimson finish, painted wood starting to fade a bit.

 

More when I've done more!  Roof next I think!

[The Johnster]

So, roof.  Now, I'm feeling a bit chuffed with myself at the moment, for reasons shortly to become apparent.  How on earth was I going to make a roof, with the correct curvature?  The best plan I could come up with was to sit in the layout room, and look in the drawers and boxes for inspiration, throwing myself onto the usually mean of fate.  It worked!

 

Right, I thought, let's cut a piece of Plasticard to just over length, and let's say 4mm over width to account for the curve, and see what I can do with it; if nothing else once I've got the size to ballpark it can be a template for the roof piece.  So, it's got to be bendy but firm; the best thing I could find was an offcut of .75mm plastiglaze.  Cutting to length was easy enough but cutting to width was always going to be incremental.  But how was I going to get the curve?

 

I tried rolling it, to no avail; this might work on sheet metal but not on plastiglaze.  But I did the rolling on the kitchen worktop, and being in the kitchen was what made the next move suggest itself to me.  Why don't I pour boiling water on top of it to soften it, and then drape it over a tin close enough for jazz to the right diameter.  This method had the advantage that I could make a cup of tea at the same time.  So, a tin of Tesco Chicken Curry was taken out of the food cupboard, the kettle was boiled, and the plastiglaze piece laid on top of the tin, which was laid sideways on the draining board.  Boiling water was poured, and the plastic began to sag at the edges.  Encouraged, I poured more, and using a sponge to prevent scalding my self, I pressed the plastic further down around the tin.  About 4 pours was enough.  

 

I now have a perfect fitting roof, by accident, which is drying on the patio after I sprayed it grey primer.  It will need a little trimming, about 2mm, at the sides but will be a perfect Fruit C roof.

 

I am now worrying about how to do the rain strips, which I am expecting to be the hardest thing to get right.  Thin copper rod bent to a radius and cut after bending so all 4 match is the plan at the moment.  Sorry, but I forgot all about photographing the boiling water shaping process; I hope my written description of a process which had the Squeeze threatening to call the men in white coats is adequate.  Glue going off overnight with roof held on by Squeeze's pony tail thingy.  Needs trimming a mm or so on the other side.

 

I have no idea how to do the rain strips.  Photos confirm no roof ventilators.  May paint, transfer, attach couplings, and put the van into service before I do the rainstrips.

[tomparryharry]

Hi John, What I do when making laminated wood section is suprisingly close to your success with your roof. Take a piece of thin plastic (evergreen?) strip, which is 'well' overlong for your application. Glue the piece of strip so your rainstrip is at the top & centre of the arc. Glue here only, and let it set. You should now have 2 'waggly' bits, left & right. Now, gently bend the waggly bit over in a gentle ac, until it forms the curve. Glue it here, and use a rubber band (Or Kasias' hair band) to hold it in place. Repeat for the other 3 doors. 

 

A bit of practice to start with, but I have confidence in you.

 

Cheers,

Ian.

Edited August 21, 2020 by tomparryharry
Schpellinge.

[The Johnster]

That sounds so crazy it might just work, and I haven't much to lose by giving it a shot!  My plan was to bend a piece of brass rod to about the right radius, using a jam jar as a former, and cut it into 4 sections, then trim each section to size by comparing it with the rain strips on my Fruit D, and giving the roof another coat of grey to use the paint as the adhesive for the rain strips.  But I am inspired by your confidence in me!

 

Smoke me a kipper, I'll be back for breakfast...

[The Johnster]

Today has been mostly taken up with a complex pickup goods operation to put the new van through it's paces and to see if I could get the steps to foul anywhere; all is well.  But it also turned into a mammoth clearing up session which has left me exhausted enough to leave it for now, which works well as the Squeeze, who thinks we have a bedroom because there's a bed in the railway room, wants a snooze.  

 

We have come to the conclusion, in order to explain how quickly time goes, that there are in fact only 2 days, Satsunday which is the weekend and Montuwethurfri, which is the week.  So, the intention is to use the 5 actual days that constitute tomorrow to paint, letter, and finish the van.  I'm not 100% happy with the roof so I'll do a new one.

 

 

[The Johnster]

See what I mean; it's now 8 days later and where did that time go?  Anyhoo, here's the current state of affairs, the Fruit C finished apart from the rain strips which are waiting for me to go into town to buy suitable plastic strip.  Number is 2823, which meant only one number had to be changed from Dapol's 2023, I've replaced D with C, and added the wheelbase (12') and tonnage the wagon is able to carry, 10 from photos.   The footboards look fine with a heavy coating of weathering muck; there are places where you can just make out that they are wood colour underneath.  A useful van to add to the NPCCS list, not a finescale model but good. enough to pass muster, and created from stuff in the bottom of the oddznendz drawer, so the price was right.  I am not doing the rain strips yet because I'm not 100% happy with the roof overhang as I think I've overtrimmed it, so I'm going to make a new roof.   Oh, and I've got to put a set of my standard lamp irons on it, and make up some Dean/Churchward handbrake ratchet levers, or I may have some on a sprue somewhere.

 

Hope this has been of some use to someone, and if not some entertainment to someone.  It's an odd size for a British van, and from some angles doesn't look much bigger than a standard wooden Mink!

[RAWRlab]

Hi John, 

I claim little expertise compared to some members of this board, but I do have a piece of advice for making a new roof: 
Once you've cut a piece of plasticcard to the right size, get the curry tin again, and this time tape the piece on the outside, making sure that it's fully taped down around every edge. 
Then you can pour the boiling water inside the tin. The metal on the surface will get hot and conform the card to the curve of the tin, and you don't have to scold your hands to hold it down. 
You can replace the water when it gets cold, but it shouldn't take more than 2-3 hours for a good set this way

 

Here's a diagram for clarity:



Best of luck!

 

Alex.

[97xx]

One technique I have tried is to use a rolling pin and a towel placed on a kitchen top or similar.

 

Once cut to pretty much the right size, warm the plasticard with a hair dryer, then roll gently until it assumes the right curvature.

 

As an aside I've also used this technique (with a thick towel) to 'roll' car number plates to fit a very curved front panel!

[Welchester]

Hubert Carr (Model Railway Developments) does a jig for fitting rainstrips.

[Barclay]

Hi if you are going to the trouble of making a new roof, can I suggest you use 10 thou brass? Annealed first on the hob it rolls to shape very easily but the real value is doing the rainstrips - just tin some brass wire, bend it to shape, and solder in place, making sure the iron only touches the strip to avoid blobs on the roof. When it's firmly soldered in place the solder will have filled the undercut, then you just file the top surface flat with a fine file, and clean it all up with a fibreglass brush.

 

[The Johnster]

On 01/09/2020 at 00:42, RAWRlab said:

Hi John, 

I claim little expertise compared to some members of this board, but I do have a piece of advice for making a new roof: 
Once you've cut a piece of plasticcard to the right size, get the curry tin again, and this time tape the piece on the outside, making sure that it's fully taped down around every edge. 
Then you can pour the boiling water inside the tin. The metal on the surface will get hot and conform the card to the curve of the tin, and you don't have to scold your hands to hold it down. 
You can replace the water when it gets cold, but it shouldn't take more than 2-3 hours for a good set this way

 

Here's a diagram for clarity:



Best of luck!

 

Alex.

An excellent tip, requiring me to eat the curry first and prompting me to consider a can of beer, but I think this is a very good idea, thank you for  it!  Your allegedly 'little' expertise has come up trumps!

 

On 01/09/2020 at 08:17, 97xx said:

One technique I have tried is to use a rolling pin and a towel placed on a kitchen top or similar.

 

Once cut to pretty much the right size, warm the plasticard with a hair dryer, then roll gently until it assumes the right curvature.

 

As an aside I've also used this technique (with a thick towel) to 'roll' car number plates to fit a very curved front panel!

I tried this but was unsuccessful, pouring boiling water over the plastic roof piece but it had cooled before I managed to attack it with the rolling pin, then got told off by the squeeze for using her best tea towel and messing around with 'her' rolling pin.  The curry tin worked very well but I trimmed the roof piece too finely; it will serve as a length and width template for the new one, which will be shaped according to Alex's method and cut well oversize so that incremental trimming can take place on the work table.

 

On 01/09/2020 at 08:38, Bishop of Welchester said:

Hubert Carr (Model Railway Developments) does a jig for fitting rainstrips.

I will investigate this, thanks for the heads up.  

 

On 01/09/2020 at 08:54, Barclay said:

Hi if you are going to the trouble of making a new roof, can I suggest you use 10 thou brass? Annealed first on the hob it rolls to shape very easily but the real value is doing the rainstrips - just tin some brass wire, bend it to shape, and solder in place, making sure the iron only touches the strip to avoid blobs on the roof. When it's firmly soldered in place the solder will have filled the undercut, then you just file the top surface flat with a fine file, and clean it all up with a fibreglass brush.

 

 

Excellent idea and undoubtedly a better way to approach the job,  but prone to blobbery given the not particularly edifying history of my wobbly level of soldering skills!  I try to keep soldering for joints which are out of sight and mind.  And possible issue glueing brass roof to plastic body.

 

Current plan is to replace the roof with 10 thou plasticard, shaped to the Alex method and trimmed to fit, and fit plastic strip roofstrips by the TPH method, but this may change when I have investigated the roofstrip jig!

 

Many thanks everyone for what has been genuinely useful input!

Edited September 2, 2020 by The Johnster

[SM42]

For rain strips I use plastic strip of suitable width (judged by eye), even if a little too  deep, and pre bend by running between finger and thumb nail along its length. Then glue at apex and adjust the ends before final fixing. They never seem to be all indentical on the prototype.  They can be trimmed in situ with care after gluing  before the glue goes off , if it looks too long and even some adjustment is possible before the glue sets. 

After the glue has fully set I file down to what I judge to be the right depth.

 

Bit rough and ready but works for me

 

Andy

Edited September 13, 2020 by SM42