Identity of DMU

[Kenton]

Continuing my "research" for scenic environments for my 2010 Challenge Layout Quintland the station of which is going to be VERY loosely based on Edinburgh Haymarket and set in the early 1960's. I have been looking in particular for photos of the footbridge, the Waverley Tunnel entrance and the platforms.

 

I came across this image

http://canmore.rcahms.gov.uk/images/l/794534/

 

Two questions:

1. No date given - any suggestions?

2. I realised that (to my shame) I couldn't even identify the unit

[Guest 838rapid]

The picture is of a DBSO used on the Glasgow < - > Edinburgh push pull services powered by a 47/7

 

They were converted from MK2 brake standard opens for the purpose

 

Hope that helps

[backwaterscotland]

The picture is of a DBSO used on the Glasgow < - > Edinburgh push pull serives powered by a 47/7

 

Thye were converted from MK2 brake standard opens for the purpose

 

Hope that helps

 

There is no cowcatcher which puts the date between about 1979 and 1984 (the cow catchers were fitted after the Polmont crash)

 

Andy B)

 

Edit - date is more likely to be 1980 or later as the corridor connection is plated, I believe this was done in 1980.

[Kenton]

Thank you both 838rapid and Andy

and a very fast response.

 

Pity about the date I had thought it quite a few years earlier - though can't think why.

 

So the DBSO ? only used on that route, ScR.

and I'm being lazy, what was the Polmont crash that brought about the addition of cowcatchers specifically to this stock ?

[griffgriff]

Thank you both 838rapid and Andy

and a very fast response.

 

Pity about the date I had thought it quite a few years earlier - though can't think why.

 

So the DBSO ? only used on that route, ScR.

and I'm being lazy, what was the Polmont crash that brought about the addition of cowcatchers specifically to this stock ?

 

 

1) GE mainline to Norwich (as hand me downs).

 

2) it hit a cow.

[backwaterscotland]

Thank you both 838rapid and Andy

and a very fast response.

 

Pity about the date I had thought it quite a few years earlier - though can't think why.

 

So the DBSO ? only used on that route, ScR.

and I'm being lazy, what was the Polmont crash that brought about the addition of cowcatchers specifically to this stock ?

 

The DBSO's were converted for the Glasgow-Edinburgh push-pull sets in 1979, later moving to Intercity, Anglia and currently some of them are in use with Network Rail. History of the DBSO here : http://www.scot-rail.co.uk/page/DBSO+Push-Pull

 

Polmont Crash - 30th July 1984 a DBSO being propelled hit a cow on the line at Polmont. Part of the cow went under the front bogie causing it to derail along with some of the coaches behind. 13 people were killed and 61 injured. There are more details here : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polmont_rail_accident

 

There is a photo of the train, post-crash, here : http://danger-ahead.railfan.net/gallery/polmont.htm

 

The cow catchers were fitted to deflect debris (not just cows) from the line to reduce the chances of this happening again.

 

Andy B)

[Guest 838rapid]

Sorry should have put Driving Brake Standard Open rather than DBSO

[Kenton]

Thanks once again - I had not realised that the crash was so serious.

[griffgriff]

1) GE mainline to Norwich (as hand me downs).

 

2) it hit a cow.

 

 

To be fair while in Scotland they were also used on the Mainline to Perth and I believe they worked North of Glasgow and Edinburgh... did they get as far as Aberdeen I wonder???

[Guest jim s-w]

Thank you both 838rapid and Andy

and a very fast response.

 

Pity about the date I had thought it quite a few years earlier - though can't think why.

 

 

Hiya

 

If you want earlier then you will need top and tail class 27's Any excuse for that I rekon.

 

Cheers

 

Jim

[backwaterscotland]

To be fair while in Scotland they were also used on the Mainline to Perth and I believe they worked North of Glasgow and Edinburgh... did they get as far as Aberdeen I wonder???

 

Yes, the DBSOs were used with rakes of Aircon Mk2 coaches on the Aberdeen services. They were also used on trains to Oban towed by a class 37 :

 

Flickr Photo

 

Andy B)

[Bob Reid]

There is no cowcatcher which puts the date between about 1979 and 1984 (the cow catchers were fitted after the Polmont crash)

 

Andy B)

 

Edit - date is more likely to be 1980 or later as the corridor connection is plated, I believe this was done in 1980.

 

1979/80 Andy as you say. The Driving Brake "Second" Open has no storage receptacle for the RCH jumpers to sit in - as they were when first delivered. These were fitted at Craigentinny later on however the the plywood covers over the corridor connection came much sooner.....

[Barry J]

the classic ScotRail Express set was formed of DBSO and mk3 trailers powered by 47/7. These sets were introduced in 1979 initially on the Glasgow QS to Edinburgh Waverley core route. More DBSO units were converted than initially needed for E&G services so through time the ScotRail Express concept was expanded to include Aberdeen & Inverness. DBSO's were used on the ocre E&G and Glasgow to Aberdeen routes, occasionally appearing on Edinburgh - Aberdeen and Glasgow - Inverness services with either mk3 or mk2 air-con trailers. There was also 1 set of mk2a stock which saw use with a DBSO mostly on Perth - Edinburgh/Glasgow locals. Inverness & Aberdeen services from Edinburgh were more often 47/4's with mk2 air-con stock or mk2a's though full ScotRail sets would appear depending on what was available.

 

you might also see the DBSO's appear on West Highland Sunday specials to Oban with 37/4 power but they were only used in push/pull mode with the 47/7's

 

Internal Scottish express routes have never been as well served since these sets were removed in 1989/90

[Flood]

...occasionally appearing on Edinburgh - Aberdeen and Glasgow - Inverness services with either mk3 or mk2 air-con trailers. ...Inverness & Aberdeen services from Edinburgh were more often 47/4's with mk2 air-con stock or mk2a's though full ScotRail sets would appear depending on what was available.

 

Don't entirely agree with these comments!

 

Agreed, when the Glasgow - Aberdeen service went over to push-pull in 1985 the Edinburgh - Aberdeen services (two each way per day) didn't, they stayed as 47/4 haulage. From 1986 these services also went over to push-pull stock and in 1987 the Edinburgh diagrams were combined with two of the Glasgow mark 2 push-pull diagrams to produce an Aberdeen - Glasgow - Aberdeen - Edinburgh and an Edinburgh - Aberdeen - Glasgow - Aberdeen. In addition, originally there were five out and back HST services to Aberdeen from Edinburgh but in 1987 two of these trains went to air-con mark 2 stock (one used the Night-rider stock from the Aberdeen sleeper and worked Aberdeen to Edinburgh and return). During shortages of push-pull rakes a scratch set could also be used to cover diagrams (mainly during the Polmadie refurb program of the ScotRail Mk2 air-cons in late 1987 to mid 1988).

 

The only push-pull service to Inverness was the Jacobite Edinburgh - Inverness train which ran daily in the summer of 1984 and Saturdays Only as push-pull in the summer of 1985, all other trains from Glasgow and Edinburgh to Inverness kept pressure vent air-braked mark 2 stock.

[Jim Martin]

There was an article in Rail Express issue 133 (June 2007) on Scottish Region push-pull trains. The earliest train formations shown are from 1971 (with T&T 27s and Mk. 2s)and most are from the 1980s. One of the sets shown is marshalled DBSO-FK-TSO(x4)-47710 (all of the non-DBSO coaches being Mk 2s) and is noted as being a Waverley-Inverness service from July 1984.

 

Jim

[D6975]

Can't see any mention of this so far...

The Sunday specials to Oban were Deltic plus push pull rake on at least 2 occasions.