When Hornby introduced their locos

[MatthewCarty]

Hi, this is my first post on here so please bare with me.

 

I have been trying to compile a list of steam locos Hornby and Bachmann have introduced in the main range. I have been using the date first introduced in the catalogue (with the date it first appeared in brackets). This is what I have got so far, and I wondered if anyone on here could help add to it.

 

Hornby Main Range                                                                           Hornby Railroad                                                   Bachmann

 

2019: Princess®, Large Prairie, Peckett B2, 48DS, Terrier                                                                                          -

 

2018: Lord Nelson, J36,  Duchess (streamlined)®                                                                                                       J72®, ROD built 2-8-0                   

 

2017: Duchess (non-streamlined)®, H                                                                                                                         Class 1532

 

2016: Original Merchant Navy, B12®, Q6, Peckett W4                                                                                               -

  

2015: King®, S15, J50, Radial Tank                                                                                                                            Coal Tank, 96xx, J72©, Royal Scott©, C1, H2

                       

2014: J15, 700 Class, K1, D16,                                                           Croisi 9F                                                            V2®

 

2013: Star                                                                                            BR 8P, Hall®, P2                                             Stanier Mogul, Midland 1F, 64xx, E4

 

2012: O1, 42xx, 52xx, 72xx                                                                                                                                            J11, D11, Modified Hall ®, Midland 4F, L&YR Tank, Ivatt 2MT tank©

 

2011: B1, LMS Fowler 2P©, LMS Fowler 4F©                                A1 (Tornado)                                                     B1©, Dukedog, C Class, A4©, V2 Chasis©, Midland Compound

 

2010: B17, 28xx®, 38xx®, L1                                                                                                                                   S&JR 7F, 3000 ROD, Midland 3F, A2

 

2009: Clan, Castle®                                                                                                                                                    O4, 82xxx, City

 

2008: 75xxx, Schools®, T9                                                                                                                                          Unrebuilt Patriot, 75xxx, Jubilee

 

2007: Rebuilt Patriot, Rebuilt Royal Scot, LMS Stanier 4P                                                                                            G2A

 

2006: Britannia®, Bulleid Rebuilt Light Pacifics®, M7® N15                                                                                  Ivatt 2MT 2-6-0, 76xxx, BR 9F, Fairburn tank

 

2005: A1®, A4®                                                                                                                                                        Jinty, Hall, Ivatt 4mt

 

2004: Grange, A3®                                                                                                                                                      K3

 

2003: Q1, LMS Fowler 4P Tank                                                                                                                                     Hughes Crab

 

2002: LMS 8F®, LMS Class 5®

 

2001:  Duchess (non-streamlined)(A), Duchess (streamlined), Bulleid Unrebuilt Light Pacifics®, Princess(A)          BR 4MT 2-6-4T, A1

 

2000: Merchant Navy, N2(A)                                                                                                                                          BR 5MT, N class

 

®=Previously modelled but completely retooled

©=Previously modelled but new DCC compatible chassis used

(A)=Previously Modelled but alterations made

 

I found this interesting to compare how many of each locos from the big 4 have been produced, and the groups they have been produced in.

Many thanks.

Edited January 22, 2019 by MatthewCarty

[Andy Y]

Unfortunately the forum software scrambles table columns. It may be worth posting a screenshot from Excel or whatever you'd taken the time to build the table in and post it as an image.

[MatthewCarty]

Unfortunately the forum software scrambles table columns. It may be worth posting a screenshot from Excel or whatever you'd taken the time to build the table in and post it as an image.

That should be ok now, they should be listed instead of a table.

Edited December 29, 2015 by MatthewCarty

[Andy Y]

Yes, that makes sense now.

[timward55]

Pat Hammond's books are a good and authoritative source on the Horny & Bachmann ranges. Might help you in your research.

[Clearwater]

Hi, this is my first post on here so please bare with me.

 

I have been trying to compile a list of steam locos Hornby have introduced in the main range. I have been using the date first introduced in the catalogue not when it was first released, and I decided to include the croisti 9f as it is almost in line with other main range locos. This is what I have got so far, and I wondered if anyone on here could help add to it.

 

2016: Original Merchant Navy, B12, Q6, Peckett

  

2015: King, S15, J50, Radial Tank

                       

2014: J15, 700 Class, K1, D16, Croisi 9F

 

2013: BR 8P (Duke of Gloucester), P2 (Cock O' The North), Star, Hall

 

2012: O1, 42xx, 52xx, 72xx

 

2011: A1 (Tornado), B1, LMS Fowler 2P, LMS Fowler 4F

 

2010: B17, 28xx, 38xx, L1

 

2009: Clan, Castle

 

2008: 75xx, Schools

 

2007: Rebuilt Patriot, Rebuilt Royal Scot, LMS Fowler 4P

 

2006: Britannia, Bulleid Rebuilt Light Pacifics, M7

 

2005: A1, A4

 

2004: Grange, A3

 

2003: Q1, LMS Fowler 4P Tank

 

2002: LMS 8F, LMS Class 5

 

2001: Coronation, Bulleid Unrebuilt Light Pacifics, Princess, Duchess

 

2000: Merchant Navy, N2

 

I found this interesting to compare how many of each locos from the big 4 have been produced, and the groups they have been produced in. I am also part way through a similar Bachmann one, but struggling due to lack of info available if anyone can help with this also.

Many thanks.

http://www.hornbyguide.com

 

Hi

 

If you've not seen it, the Hornby guide someone's compiled (link above) may be useful

 

David

[Anglian]

Many of those you list are 'up-grades', rather than the first time that the type has appeared for sale in a Hornby branded box. I'm not sure if that has any appreciable impact on your listing though, which I find interesting to see. Perhaps just as some newspapers do when a TV show is a repeat, you could add the 'R' suffix to those models that have been repeated.

Edited December 29, 2015 by Anglian

[Hilux5972]

You can remove Duke of Gloucester, Hall Class, Tornado, P2 Class from that List. They were all designed for the Railroad range, with a higher livery spec for inclusion in the main range. Very much railroad locos though.

[MatthewCarty]

Now edited to include ® for upgrades, and a separate list for Railroad. Other suggestions are very welcome!

[toboldlygo]

2008 T9

Should be Stanier 4P for 2007 not Fowler

[MatthewCarty]

2008 T9

Should be Stanier 4P for 2007 not Fowler

Changes made, would it be useful to add the Bachmann models in a separate column for easy comparison?

[robmcg]

A useful list thank you MathewCarty.

 

One tends to forget how consistent Hornby have been especially considering their factory troubles from c2013. I just received the 2016 yearbook and it shows great promise, new models, quality seems to be generally back to near the best of the Sanda Kan days, or better. The texture of plastics and fine moulding on recent models impresses me.

 

Nice to be reminded of the years where the Hornby models first appeared.

[Ian Hargrave]

Matthew....Hornby Archivist.....congratulations,the job's yours .Seriously,this is a useful thread,so many thanks.

[Metr0Land]

I think the guide mentioned by clearwater in #6 only goes up to 2011?

[MatthewCarty]

I think the guide mentioned by clearwater in #6 only goes up to 2011?

Yes, I had a look at this and it does only go to 2011, and also doesn't give the information in an easy way to get at! I will add the Bachmann models I know now.

[Ozexpatriate]

http://www.hornbyguide.com

I think the guide mentioned by clearwater in #6 only goes up to 2011?

Yes, I had a look at this and it does only go to 2011, and also doesn't give the information in an easy way to get at! I will add the Bachmann models I know now.

The authors of the Hornby Railways Collectors Guide have been diligently working on their website for years, starting from the Tri-ang days and working towards the present.

 

I am confident, based on their rate of progress, that they will catch up at some point. It is a nice online reference.  One of it's limitations (like the list here) is that it is based on the catalogues rather than actual releases. Many items, particularly in the last six years did not appear during the year in which they were introduced in the catalogue.

 

The Ramsay's British Model Train Catalogue is of course much more comprehensive, but is only available in print - that being it's purpose.

Edited December 29, 2015 by Ozexpatriate

[Ozexpatriate]

I found this interesting to compare how many of each locos from the big 4 have been produced, and the groups they have been produced in.

Relative to big four locomotives, I have compiled a running tally of all steam locomotives advertised in the annual catalogue based on livery for some years now. It's not the same information that you are looking for and doesn't reflect what was actually produced, but is a measure of whether there is balance in the livery choices intended to be offered.

 

 

I have a similar list for Bachmann locomotives if anyone is interested.  There are a couple of 'wobbles' in the data. Some years SR offerings were very sketchy and I might have included a LB&SCR liveried Terrier as "SR".  (I didn't normally include pre-grouping in this data - they got lumped into 'other' which is not presented.) 

Edited December 29, 2015 by Ozexpatriate

[MatthewCarty]

Relative to big four locomotives, I have compiled a running tally of all steam locomotives advertised in the annual catalogue based on livery for some years now. It's not the same information that you are looking for and doesn't reflect what was actually produced, but is a measure of whether there is balance in the livery choices intended to be offered.

 

hornbyliveries.JPG

 

I have a similar list for Bachmann locomotives if anyone is interested.  There are a couple of 'wobbles' in the data. Some years SR offerings were very sketchy and I might have included a LB&SCR liveried Terrier as "SR".  (I didn't normally include pre-grouping in this data - they got lumped into 'other' which is not presented.) 

That is really interesting, especially when compared to the table above which explains it a little. I would be very interested in the Bachmann one too if you don't mind sharing!

[Ozexpatriate]

I found this interesting to compare how many of each locos from the big 4 have been produced, and the groups they have been produced in. I am also part way through a similar Bachmann one, but struggling due to lack of info available if anyone can help with this also.

Matthew, 

 

I don't have the dates first offered, but this is my list of 00 RTR steam locomotive models that have been announced in recent and not so recent years.  (I should add 00 Works to this list.)

 

It's a bit of an eye-chart in this format but you can click to expand the images.

 

In the highly probable event that I have missed something, I would be delighted to stand corrected.  Since posting here I have corrected a couple of typos (Atlantics are 4-4-2 after all) and added the Crosti 9F.

Edited December 29, 2015 by Ozexpatriate

[Ozexpatriate]

That is really interesting, especially when compared to the table above which explains it a little. I would be very interested in the Bachmann one too if you don't mind sharing!

I am happy to oblige.

 

You can clearly see how Bachmann has paid less attention to SR locomotives over the years - something that is changing recently with the C Class, E4, and Brighton Atlantic etc.

[Anglian]

The M7 and the Light Bullied Pacific in the original form are both reprised models from the mid 1970s. The Britannia must be about late 1970s. The Schools class was first released in the mid 1980's. I think the LMS 2P may date from the same time as Hornby released four 4-4-0, one for each region, simultaneously. 

Edited December 29, 2015 by Anglian

[Old Tearaway]

I was disappointed that Hornby didn't number the N2 69561 in memory of their original Trackmaster derived Triang Railways clockwork version.

 

Some folks have had to wait over 60 years for the electric powered N2 to finally appear.

 

At least they've managed to produce it in the correct scale body length, unlike the old Gaiety and Dublo versions of old.

 

Some of us are old enough to remember when the catalogue wasn't as big as it is nowadays. However some old Triang and Triang Hornby scenic and accessory items from the 1950's (water crane, lineside huts, etc.) and 1960's (bridges, electricity pylons, lineside telegraph poles, lineside fencing, etc.) still feature like familiar old friends.

Edited December 30, 2015 by Old Tearaway

[MatthewCarty]

Matthew, 

 

I don't have the dates first offered, but this is my list of 00 RTR steam locomotive models that have been announced in recent and not so recent years.  (I should add 00 Works to this list.)

 

It's a bit of an eye-chart in this format but you can click to expand the images.

00models1.JPG

00models2.JPG

 

In the highly probable event that I have missed something, I would be delighted to stand corrected.  Since posting here I have corrected a couple of typos (Atlantics are 4-4-2 after all) and added the Crosti 9F.

When you say brand new, does that mean new tooling or not done before? I have assumed new tooling.

Hornby: Bulleid Light Pacifics, B12, A3, B17, Fowler 2P, Fowler 4F I think should be new

             N2, D16 are missing

             Was the Jinty new?

Bachmann: V2, Patriot, Ivatt 2mt I think should be new

 

Does anyone know when the following Bachmann models were released?

City, C1 Atlantic, H2 Brighton Atlantic, Midland compound, jubilee, Br 9f, 5mt,4mt (tank), 3mt (tank)?

[MatthewCarty]

I am happy to oblige.

 

bachmann00liveries.JPG

You can clearly see how Bachmann has paid less attention to SR locomotives over the years - something that is changing recently with the C Class, E4, and Brighton Atlantic etc.

It is very interesting comparing the Hornby and Bachmann charts that they both show a similar trend in the rise of BR liveries since 2000. Both start of at a similar proportion to each of the big 4, and by the end are much larger, especially Bachmann. This is very similar to preserved locos, it would be interesting to be able to compare the two, but I doubt anyone has that sort of info available!

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

When you say brand new, does that mean new tooling or not done before? I have assumed new tooling.

Hornby: Bulleid Light Pacifics, B12, A3, B17, Fowler 2P, Fowler 4F I think should be new

             N2, D16 are missing

             Was the Jinty new?

 You will need to make an explicit definition of 'new tooling' for your tabulation. Maybe you can follow another compiler's precedent in this matter, or decide for yourself.

 

All of these mentioned in your post: Bulleid Light Pacifics, B12, A3, B17, Fowler 2P,  Jinty; have  been present in the Triang/Triang-Hornby/Hornby range made from tooling created in the UK from the 1950s on. The current Jinty and B12 still contain elements defined by their first tooling in the 50s and 60s respectively. Some of these subjects: Bulleid's light pacific, A3, B17, have since been completely new tooled since Hornby went to Chinese production, no relation whatsoever to the earlier tooling. The B12 has been announced for just such an 'all-new' tooling in 2016.

 

Items like the Fowler 4F, J94, N2, 61XX, Terrier, L&Y Pug, were tooled originally by completely different businesses and subsequently absorbed, largely unchanged, into Hornby's range, well before they moved to China. Some have received alterations since acquisition by Hornby, but there is still previous manufacturer origin tooling in their make up.

 

Then there's the D16/3: that's an all new tooling of a subject that Hornby had never previously offered, announced 2014, available 2015.

 

 

 ...Bachmann: V2, Patriot, Ivatt 2mt I think should be new

 

Does anyone know when the following Bachmann models were released?

City, C1 Atlantic, H2 Brighton Atlantic, Midland compound, jubilee, Br 9f, 5mt,4mt (tank), 3mt (tank)?

 The Bachmann V2, Patriot, Ivatt 2MT, well predate 2000, introduced on split chassis mechs between 1991 and 1995 I would guess. They have had revisions since, but original elements of the tooling remain, they are not 'all-new'.

 

First release City of Truro 2009, C1 2015, H2 not yet!, Midland Compound 2011, Jubilee 2008, BR 9F 2006, 5MT 2000, BR 4MT 2-6-4T 2001, BR 3MT 2009. That's on the basis of memory, so I might be a little out on one or two.

 

Personally I think you would do better to go with the year items went on retail sale, rather than first appearance in a catalogue, as there have been - and are - some long durations between catalogue announcement and availability. For example Bachmann's WD 2-8-0 was announced I think in late 1995, went on sale late 1999.