Christleton Junction - 1986 - Gateway to North Wales

[61656]

9 hours ago, mallaig1983 said:

Interesting.

my layout has less track mileage than the gateway to North Wales but generally I give it a wazz with isoP every couple of months and the stock every 6 months. I’d be interested in learning more of your layout hygiene routine.

kaydees? I use but they do not couple on curves, or slightly more curvey curves than, er slight. They are great, more unobtrusive than toy couplings but be careful where you need to couple up.

I have ended up with rather more track than I intended. The layout itself was always fairly complicated - and maybe a bit too much for a first timer. The main growth in track miles is in the fiddle yards, where I have nearly double what I thought I would need. I may have my original calculations somewhere that we can audit!

[61656]

9 hours ago, mallaig1983 said:

 

kaydees? I use but they do not couple on curves, or slightly more curvey curves than, er slight. They are great, more unobtrusive than toy couplings but be careful where you need to couple up.

I am concerned about Kadees. As you say I have some coupling to do on curves, albeit very slight. I’m also concerned about my ability to consistently stop on uncoupling magnets. 
 

With the layout stock free I’m going to fit some test stock and see what happens. At least NEM pockets make this a reversible test!

[St Enodoc]

23 minutes ago, 61656 said:

in the fiddle yards, where I have nearly double what I thought I would need.

That is a law of nature.

[mallaig1983]

19 minutes ago, 61656 said:

20 minutes ago, 61656 said:

I am concerned about Kadees. As you say I have some coupling to do on curves, albeit very slight. I’m also concerned about my ability to consistently stop on uncoupling magnets. 
 

With the layout stock free I’m going to fit some test stock and see what happens. At least NEM pockets make this a reversible test!

Yes, give them a go and run some tests. Coupling on a slight curve should be ok. I have to do this and it is incredibly rare that I have a problem with it but they won’t couple if it’s tight. See how you get on. Mark where the magnets are with a piece of rail or a sleeper or some other line side clutter. I use the kadee magnets as they are nice and large so allow a degree of tolerance for where you stop your trains.

[BenW]

Funny you mention No-Ox-Id - there’s a jar or two on their way here as well! Looking forward to seeing the results, my little tiny bit of track currently shares the room with a kitchen renovation workshop.

 

There are a huge number of threads on couplings out there on other forum pages - if leaders fail you might like to look at the Burford Autocoupling or the Flippem coupling, both of which claim to be good at coupling on curves. I have some Flippem bits spare if you want to try them.

[5BarVT]

46 minutes ago, 61656 said:

The graphite, being a slight lubricant, has the potential to attract dirt. 

Beg to differ!

Oils etc attract dirt because they have some stickiness.  Graphite works in a different manner I thought.

Hence why advice for lubricating locks is avoid liquid lubricant as they attract dirt thus adding to the problem but instead use powdered graphite as it lubricates without attracting dirt.

I may be wrong!

Paul.

[61656]

1 hour ago, 5BarVT said:

Beg to differ!

Oils etc attract dirt because they have some stickiness.  Graphite works in a different manner I thought.

Hence why advice for lubricating locks is avoid liquid lubricant as they attract dirt thus adding to the problem but instead use powdered graphite as it lubricates without attracting dirt.

I may be wrong!

Paul.

Interesting point. I wonder if this could be used in addition to the No Ox?

[37Oban]

I may be wrong, actually, there's a high probability of that, but isn't no-ox-id a grease product used to keep electrical contacts clean?  Would it's use in the exposed environment of your layout actually attract more dirt?

 

Roj

[61656]

5 hours ago, 37Oban said:

I may be wrong, actually, there's a high probability of that, but isn't no-ox-id a grease product used to keep electrical contacts clean?  Would it's use in the exposed environment of your layout actually attract more dirt?

 

Roj

Interesting question, the answer to which we will find out. The No Ox hasn’t arrived yet so I can’t experiment. 
 

All the stock is off the rails and on shelves now - it takes up a lot less room than I thought. (Must need more.)

 

I think before I do the track cleaning I’m going to glue the fiddle yard track down and possibly give it a quick coat of matt black. I’m having a little pause to see if there are any changes I want to make first. 

[61656]

Kadee news…

 

If you’ve never used Kadees before the packet contains some tiny spare springs. Be careful when opening. I will be next time. 
 

I’ve fitted a couple of mk1’s to see how they couple at the planned regular attaching spots. 3 of the 5 are on a slight curve, but all seem to work just fine. 
 

I have also glued a length of track to some spare mdf to test uncoupling magnets. I didn’t originally envisage using Kadees, so retrofitting magnets is going to be an issue. I’ve seen a neat solution using two rows of cylindrical neodymium magnets that could be my saviour. We will see. 

[5BarVT]

2 hours ago, 61656 said:

If you’ve never used Kadees before the packet contains some tiny spare springs. Be careful when opening. I will be next time. 

Hopefully you won’t need them.  They can be bought separately I think.

When I first bought Kadees those springs came in a tiny plastic capsule so you wouldn’t lose them if they fell out.

Times change.

Paul.

[St Enodoc]

10 hours ago, 61656 said:

If you’ve never used Kadees before the packet contains some tiny spare springs. Be careful when opening. I will be next time. 

 

8 hours ago, 5BarVT said:

Hopefully you won’t need them.  They can be bought separately I think.

In our club they are known as Pingf**kits, because every time they go ping and fly away you shout "F**k it!".

[5BarVT]

“Sod it paint” (typex) had a similar derivation in reading Signal Works.

Paul.

[lincolnshiremodeller]

On 22/11/2023 at 22:49, 61656 said:

 

I have also glued a length of track to some spare mdf to test uncoupling magnets. I didn’t originally envisage using Kadees, so retrofitting magnets is going to be an issue. I’ve seen a neat solution using two rows of cylindrical neodymium magnets that could be my saviour. We will see. 

I use the cylindrical magnets inserted into a hole drilled right through the baseboard which means the magnet can be pushed out if it's to be removed. It  works very well but does involve some trial and error in terms of the strength of the magnets. I use two stacked one above the other in the same hole. I also paint the top of the magnet and also the Kadee itself (frame dirt) to slightly weaken the pull. If it's too strong then the Kadee will simply stick to the magnet.

 

Once working you just need to add a scenic marker of some sort to remind yourself where the magnet is!

[61656]

With a pack each of number 17, 18, 19 and 20 Kadees (short to long with NEM pockets), I’ve trial fitted lots of different combinations to see what works. 
 

Most of the end coaches in rakes will go for the long shank #20, to clear the buffer beam. Most of the locos will be #18, although there are various alternatives. As far as I can work out, nearly all the coupling up moves are on straight sections. The exception is in platform 1, where electric locos back on to Intercity rakes, and nearly always a mk1 BG. Having slightly longer shanks on the electric locos looks like a workable option. Possibly just at the north end, so that when running the other way they benefit from the visual improvement of a shorter coupling. 
 

For uncoupling, I’ve followed the advice from Lincolnshiremodeller, as seen in the photo. 
 

 

There are 5 pairs of magnets and it works perfectly. I’ve had to double up the magnets, so I’ll increase the strength for the next trial before committing to the layout. Clearly these are going to be fairly simple to retrofit and hide. 
 

That leaves the problem for 3 locations where I need either an electro magnet or a raisable solution. I’m sort of confident enough that the running is smooth enough for permanent magnets to be used, but a dynamic solution seems sensible. 
 

Couplings not at the ends of rakes of fixed formation stock will be 3 link for freight and Roco for passenger. The Roco type means changing formations is easier than the Bachmann pipes, as well as a slightly improved close coupling for mk1s and 2fs. 
 

The excellent and inspirational Warley show provided several packs of 3 link couplings to commence the nervous breakdown with….

[DIRTY DIESEL]

On 18/11/2023 at 22:26, 61656 said:

 

 

 

 

Whilst the Wrexham vans are loaded, a 25 rolls in with empties for Penmaenmawr. Booked to arrive at their destination at 0:35! Presumably the ballast yard was staffed 24 hours. Certainly a godforsaken place to pitch up at Driver Only in the small hours.
 

 

 

Hi 61656,

Great layout, when I worked Penmaenmawr SB between 1985 to 1987 Pen Yard wasn't staffed 24 hours un like the box, but we did have a light loco move from the Junction in the middle of the night. It was the Loco off the Parcels 4D11 (I think) which would return back to Junction after arriving at Bangor. Once a week in stead of working the daily Trip working, it would run light back to Pen to work the Pen to Hope Street 'Chippings' train, and yes it was a godforsaken place in the small hours, at least the Drivers got to escape, unlike the Signaller on duty...🙂

Stu 

[61656]

It’s been rather longer than I realised since I last checked in. There’s been lots of effort but not much to report!

 

With all the stock off the layout I decided that every item that goes back on will have the right couplings and be weathered. At least until I run out of will power. 
 

I started by experimenting with various couplings. Kadees for the end of sets, and stock that gets uncoupled, close couplers for coaches and three links for freight. I’ve tried various combinations of close couplers (Bachmann, Hornby, Roco) as they all have different lengths. PV mk2s need the longest, then mk1s and then AC mk2s the shortest. I want the corridor connections touching whilst still being able to negotiate a 2nd radius crossover. I think I have the necessary combinations sorted now. 
 

I’ve also been experimenting with magnets for uncoupling. I have a couple of solutions that work on a test plank. I’ll be trying them on the layout shortly. I also want to do a deep weathering of the track before doing the deep clean described previously. 
 

To keep the tasks varied I’ve weathered all 18 of my tank wagons… 

 

 

I’ve also made a start on my mk1s. Just under half of them have the annoying ridges on the roofs, so the whole coach is stripped down, roof sanded and then sprayed. The sprayed roofs look a lot better than the  original which is a bit glossy. This probably means I’ll have to do the whole fleet. Here’s an original unmodified BG without the ridges. 
 

 

For ends of passenger sets, the BGs (stayin alive…) get underframes dirtied and a light coat of thin dark brown on the body side. 
 

 

And the intercity mainline version…

 

 

Finally, for those in parcels rakes which are less frequent visitors to the carriage wash, a much heavier going over. 
 

 

I’m pretty happy with these. They don’t stand close scrutiny but look good in a rake and will certainly improve the straight out of the box look. 
 

Next up are the two RB(R)s that need some minor window modifications, followed by the pair of 20’s. There is no reasoning to my order!

 

When I’ve had enough of weathering I’ll sort the magnets and track out. 

 

 

[ISW]

10 hours ago, 61656 said:

For ends of passenger sets, the BGs (stayin alive…) get underframes dirtied and a light coat of thin dark brown on the body side. 

 

10 hours ago, 61656 said:

Finally, for those in parcels rakes which are less frequent visitors to the carriage wash, a much heavier going over. 

I'd have expected the latter 'parcels rake' (M80905) to get B2 bogies, and the former 'passenger sets' (W80723) to have B4s. However, you have it the other way around ... Unfortunately, the bogies are correct for the running numbers (according to the RCTS Coaching Stock Book on 1981), so you can't just swap them.

 

Ian

[61656]

1 hour ago, ISW said:

 

I'd have expected the latter 'parcels rake' (M80905) to get B2 bogies, and the former 'passenger sets' (W80723) to have B4s. However, you have it the other way around ... Unfortunately, the bogies are correct for the running numbers (according to the RCTS Coaching Stock Book on 1981), so you can't just swap them.

 

Ian

I hadn’t noticed the bogies differed on the two. Something else to consider…

 

I had noticed only one of my RBs is on commonwealth bogies and I suspect they all were by 86. Of course the RB’s are a compromise as the Bachmann model is of the unrefurbished coaches, hence window and door alterations are required too. 
 

If I can help it I’ll avoid coach renumbering, at least for the moment. This weathering pass is supposed to be quick and simple!

[61656]

The 20’s have been through the reverse paint shop. Both have been renumbered with correct discs for 1986. 20002 is one of the small number of pilot scheme 20’s that retains oval buffers. You can still see the white surrounds from its railtour back in May. 
 

[61656]

I’m now into quite a laborious run of coach weathering. In theory it’s a quick frame dirt, brown wash for the sides, and black wash for the roofs. For 10 of my mk1s it’s a much more intensive strip down, roof sand and roof spray.  I tried sanding the roof in situ but it’s not as effective as taking the roof off to do it, plus spraying the roof is much easier without the need to mask. 
 

 

Coaches 6, 7 and 8 of the 47 I need to do are seen stripped down, with roofs sanded ready for spraying. The Bachmann mk1 comes apart really easily after a little bit of working out how to do it. Ask if you want some guidance. 
 

Coach 5 can also be seen here, Bachmann’s Unclasssified Restaurant (RU) which were all converted to Restaurant Buffet (Refurbished) RB(R) by my time period. One side is unchanged, whilst the other side loses two windows and a door to make space for the buffet. You can see the amended side waiting another coat of rail grey.
 

There are also the final two ribbed roof coaches awaiting their fate. If you haven’t bought your mk1’s yet, I highly recommend checking they have smooth roofs!

[5BarVT]

I have a couple of ribbed coaches.  Since you know my main interest in modelling, you won’t be surprised to hear that they will be remaining ribbed for the time being.

I’ll just pretend they are not there.

Paul.

[St Enodoc]

1 hour ago, 5BarVT said:

I have a couple of ribbed coaches.  Since you know my main interest in modelling, you won’t be surprised to hear that they will be remaining ribbed for the time being.

I’ll just pretend they are not there.

Paul.

Mine are all ribbed and will remain so. You can rib me all you like about that.

[61656]

Somewhat frustrated with the poor quality of my photography I’ve been doing some research… I now have a tripod, remote shutter button, and I’ve learnt how to change the exposure settings. 
 

These are my first efforts, clearly a lot of work to do, but I can see some potential!

 

 

 

Edited January 12 by 61656
Spacing

[61656]

1 minute ago, St Enodoc said:

Mine are all ribbed and will remain so. You can rib me all you like about that.

Sanding them down is a bit of a pain, but I think it’s worth the effort. Probably more important is getting the roof to be matt instead of the out of the box satin.