Road Vechicles for Ouseburn Park - Northumbria Leyland Nationals

[Ragtag]

Hi all, with road vehicles and buses in particular being something of a secondary interest of mine I wanted to include a bus depot on my new layout. One thing led to another and as followers of my request for information on the TW Care Bus will know I ended up with a few Leyland Nationals to repaint into Northumbria colours. I have plans for a few other interesting vehicles to add to the Northumbria fleet too.

Given the availability and price of the Pirate kits, I opted to use the EFE National as a base for each model. Whilst not perfect, it looks like a good representation of the prototype to my eye and a few small tweaks can make all the difference.

One of the biggest issues with the diecast is the large gap at the top of the modular front grille panel, but nothing a little filler won't fix:


The vehicles' identities when completed will be:

• THX 192S (National 1 long, 2 door, short roof pod)
• WGR 217M (National 1 long, 1 door, long roof pod)
• APT 124W (National 2 long, 1 door, no roof pod)

The vehicles are shown in the subsequent photos in this order, and are currently at various stages of prep/initial painting. Edges will need tidying up with so many roof/bodyside ridges making the bus a royal pain to mask.

The body shells:


The front end differences:


With their roofs. As you can see further work was needed to fill the edges of the 'filler panel' to replace where the diecasts usually have a roof pod fitted:

 

A final shot showing everything (including the interiors which will be mostly scrap I think). At the very rear is a standard EFE release:

​

 

​Now, a couple of queries:

1. ​I'm intending to scratchbuild most of the interiors with seats fitted from Mark Hughes. Does anyone know whether the Northumbria/United nationals had a short (3 seat) bench fitted behind the front door or whether they had luggage space? My memory says luggage space but I've learned not to trust it.

 

2. A local group has an East Lancs./Greenway Leyland National conversion (SIB 6711) preserved in Northumbria colours: https://www.flickr.com/photos/emdjt42/7148739279/ Was the type ever operated by Northumbria in service? I'm aware of one in blue and white with Northumbria Coaches (SIB 6706), but that was after the advent of Arriva I think.

​Thanks in advance.

[Merfyn Jones]

Hi all, with road vehicles and buses in particular being something of a secondary interest of mine I wanted to include a bus depot on my new layout. One thing led to another and as followers of my request for information on the TW Care Bus will know I ended up with a few Leyland Nationals to repaint into Northumbria colours. I have plans for a few other interesting vehicles to add to the Northumbria fleet too.

 

Given the availability and price of the Pirate kits, I opted to use the EFE National as a base for each model. Whilst not perfect, it looks like a good representation of the prototype to my eye and a few small tweaks can make all the difference.

 

One of the biggest issues with the diecast is the large gap at the top of the modular front grille panel, but nothing a little filler won't fix:

IMG_20160407_110014382.jpg

 

The vehicles' identities when completed will be:

• THX 192S (National 1 long, 2 door, short roof pod)
• WGR 217M (National 1 long, 1 door, long roof pod)
• APT 124W (National 2 long, 1 door, no roof pod)

The vehicles are shown in the subsequent photos in this order, and are currently at various stages of prep/initial painting. Edges will need tidying up with so many roof/bodyside ridges making the bus a royal pain to mask.

 

The body shells:

IMG_20160417_114221002.jpg

 

The front end differences:

IMG_20160417_114243495.jpg

 

With their roofs. As you can see further work was needed to fill the edges of the 'filler panel' to replace where the diecasts usually have a roof pod fitted:

IMG_20160417_114321896.jpg

 

A final shot showing everything (including the interiors which will be mostly scrap I think). At the very rear is a standard EFE release:

​IMG_20160417_114359326.jpg

 

​Now, a couple of queries:

1. ​I'm intending to scratchbuild most of the interiors with seats fitted from Mark Hughes. Does anyone know whether the Northumbria/United nationals had a short (3 seat) bench fitted behind the front door or whether they had luggage space? My memory says luggage space but I've learned not to trust it.

 

2. A local group has an East Lancs./Greenway Leyland National conversion (SIB 6711) preserved in Northumbria colours: https://www.flickr.com/photos/emdjt42/7148739279/ Was the type ever operated by Northumbria in service? I'm aware of one in blue and white with Northumbria Coaches (SIB 6706), but that was after the advent of Arriva I think.

 

​Thanks in advance.

 

One problem I notice, THX192S was a short (10.3M) model not the long version you are working on. Otherwise looking good, awaiting the finished results. Hope this helps before you go any further.

Merf.

[Ragtag]

Where did you find that out Merf, if I can ask for future reference? I spent ages searching trying to find out, and ultimately decided it looked like the 11.3m model based on the relatively few photos there are kicking around, e.g.: http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6330732363_f0507d90dd.jpg

Perspective is a sod  

The care bus was only ever intended as a short-term 'quickie' conversion anyway. I'll tackle a more in-depth one in future with a higher-quality scratch-built interior etc. I mainly wanted to use this one as a testbed for custom decals etc. as it was a cheapie from the local market.

[Merfyn Jones]

Where did you find that out Merf, if I can ask for future reference? I spent ages searching trying to find out, and ultimately decided it looked like the 11.3m model based on the relatively few photos there are kicking around, e.g.: http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6330732363_f0507d90dd.jpg

 

Perspective is a sod  

 

The care bus was only ever intended as a short-term 'quickie' conversion anyway. I'll tackle a more in-depth one in future with a higher-quality scratch-built interior etc. I mainly wanted to use this one as a testbed for custom decals etc. as it was a cheapie from the local market.

 

ex London Buses and I recall most of theirs were short ones.

A useful (free) resource is 'Bus lists on the web' which can be searched by make, registration , etc.

[Ragtag]

Thanks for the tip Merf, saved me another potential headache there as it turns out WPG217M was also a shortie. Need to find a new prototype for that one then!

[HillsideDepot]

The clue to a "short" National is the window ahead of the back axle - it is the "long" size to allow space for the central door (if fitted). So a 11m National is 7 "long" modules and the "half", whereas a 10m National is 1 x long, 3 x short, 1 x long, 2 x short modules and the "half". It's not always easy to tell, but comparing the cab/door module with the ones behind and that central one is the best clue.

 

I've had a dig through my Northumbria photos again and come up with these two which have fronts which could be National Greenways? They haven't had the side window modification, so I'm not sure if they are a "home grown" concoction (like Cheltenham & Gloucester Omnibus Company's so-called "National 3" rebuilds) or a variant of Greenway. I'm afraid my interest and knowledge of the products of Workington is considerably less than for the products of Brislington!

 

Here is a product of Brislington, but not doing what it was originally intended for!

 

And finally, all operators have to have (at least) one open topper...

[russ p]

Those rebuilt front ends look awful, not sure what they set out to achieve?

What are the light units? A lot of recent bus headlights are a bizarre twin unit but made to the dimensions of a maestro unit.

The original front of the national was a very clean design the bus having been styled by the design house ,Michelotti

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giovanni_Michelotti

[Ragtag]

I've had a dig through my Northumbria photos again and come up with these two which have fronts which could be National Greenways? They haven't had the side window modification, so I'm not sure if they are a "home grown" concoction (like Cheltenham & Gloucester Omnibus Company's so-called "National 3" rebuilds) or a variant of Greenway. I'm afraid my interest and knowledge of the products of Workington is considerably less than for the products of Brislington!

I think they're something to do with East Lancs. but not necessarily the complete rebody that the full Greenways were - I seem to remember reading somewhere that they were done at the same time as a re-engine (and vaguely something about that making them the first 'urban bus'?).

 

The exhibition bus is on the 'to do' list, but haven't seen those shots before so thanks for those

 

As for open toppers, completely agree, they had at least 2 more Bristol ones:

 

 

and: https://www.flickr.com/photos/26024754@N07/10207466965/in/photolist-gxZWiK-7Y4ReQ

[Ragtag]

Those rebuilt front ends look awful, not sure what they set out to achieve?

What are the light units?

 

They remind me of those seen on the Scania L113 East Lancs. that Northumbria/Arriva used to use a lot in these parts: https://www.flickr.com/photos/nedbasher/6887006716/

[birch1]

They remind me of those seen on the Scania L113 East Lancs. that Northumbria/Arriva used to use a lot in these parts: https://www.flickr.com/photos/nedbasher/6887006716/

Ahhh! One of those Maxi things or whatever they used to call them! I never got how someone could make something look so ugly, especially in a side shot.

 

Anyway, great work on the nationals so far, I shall be watching with interest.

[quicksilvercoaches]

I've had a dig through my Northumbria photos again and come up with these two which have fronts which could be National Greenways? They haven't had the side window modification, so I'm not sure if they are a "home grown" concoction (like Cheltenham & Gloucester Omnibus Company's so-called "National 3" rebuilds) or a variant of Greenway. I'm afraid my interest and knowledge of the products of Workington is considerably less than for the products of Brislington!

90.jpg

736.jpg

Those aren't Greenways but 'Urban Buses', if I remember rightly a cheaper and simpler modernisation by the British Bus group using the front bumper and headlights from Plaxton Paramount coaches on the otherwise largely unmodified National shell..

[Ragtag]

Might make for an interesting conversion at some point, thanks for the additional info.

 

Well the test-paint of the National bodyshell in Northumbria colours is complete and, as expected, brush-painting over the masked body contours caused some issues. Nothing that can't be tidied up, but for the actual models I think aerosol may be the way to go. Surprisingly, the thin tape from ebay I used to mask the thin white stripes held rather well - notably better than the Tamiya I used on broader sections which was a pleasant surprise.

[Ragtag]

Progress!

 

From left to right: 2 standard EFE releases; a rough repaint to use as a testbed for transfers; a short National 1 to become the wheelchair accessible care bus (THX 192S); a long National 1 (NTC 639M); a long National 2 (APT 124W). These three are just being touched up prior to varnish now. A little further behind are a National urban bus conversion (JTH 763P) and a National greenway - reg. on this one is undecided I was going to make it preserved SIB6711 'til I realised that was a short one.

 

 

 

 

A couple of others on the go too:

[birch1]

Very nice looking these are, great job on these so far!

[Ragtag]

Hi all,

 

hoping you might be able to help me with some details on the following vehicles whilst with Northumbria Motor Services. I'm looking for details on the seat coverings/moquettes used and also the floor coverings - an interior photo would be the holy grail!

1. Northumbria 701 THX192S Leyland National 1 wheelchair lift fitted carebus
2. Northumbria 706 NTC636M Leyland National 1
3. Northumbria 3124 (later 778) APT124W Leyland National 2
4. Northumbria 736 JTH763P Leyland National urban bus conversion
5. Northumbria 78 BUF277C Leyland PD3 Queen Mary driver trainer
6. Northumbria 20 BPT920S Bristol VRIII show bus
7. Northumbria 240 YEL97Y Leyland Leopard ECW

 

Thanks in advance for any help you're able to provide